to ask why the Sun and the Mail newspaper are so hated on here?

[missnamechange]

I have name changed for this as i am a regular MNer and i know i really ought to know this but i don't

i read the Sun every most days, i like the vacuous celeb gossip and their easy to understand way of writing (again - ) and the womens section, and the problem pages

what's so bad about it?

I don't know what else I can say - I've explained how the website operates separately from the newspaper.

separate editor
separate journalists
separate photographers
separate lawyers
separate sub editors
carrying different content
targetting a different demographic

But not so much in many other instances.

But Nancy, surely it covers some of the same content as well? Which is why so many of us like it so.

well, when I asked her to confirm her earlier statement "completely different product, written by a different team"

She replied "Yes, really. "

I think we have established that is not true, so she is either mistaken, or telling fibs.

Online does carry stories from the print version - have said this several times now.

Nancy, almost the entire print paper is digitally reprinted in the online version! How different can it be?
Same journalists, with more added, are still the same,
Same photos printed online and in paper: same photographers.
Same content, reprinted word for word, just because there is more in the online does not change this.

Different demographic? In what way?

I'm not sure if you are being deliberately obtuse or you just don't actually understand that the Mail themselves say (again):
MailOnline - all the latest news, sport, showbiz, science and health stories from around the world from the Daily Mail and Mail on Sunday newspapers

which bit of their own tagline do you find hard to grasp?

Does online carry all the news and excellent health stories from the paper or only a subset?

'Different demographic?'

My guess would be a younger, hipper, less savvy demographic, possibly comparable to a Guardian demographic.

all of them and more, afaik. They also include a large amount of bizarre celeb stalking articles on the online version that don't make the print one.

It carries all the health stories but not all the news stories as they tend to have a strong Uk slant and the online readership is more international.

"completely different product"

but

"does carry stories from the print version"

I must try to grap what the word "different" means.

Obviously I am too thick to work in the fish-wrapping business.

Here is a lovely new complaint about the Mail that should pique the interest of MN'ers, outright disabilist lies in the Sunday Mail

Although reading about Heffer's Rightminds part of the online edition, it seems they want to make that part a bit like Comment is Free on the Guardian. That may be a bit of a tall order, but there is no harm in trying and expanding output.

the front page of the website currently features about 70 stories that were not in the print version - that pretty much fulfils the definition of 'different' for me....

OP - read Alastair Campbell's written evidence to the Levison Inquiry - start from ~ page 14. (He really does a number on Daily Mail - what a great platform for him to do so. ).

Daily Mail is imo deeply misogynist.

Re the Sun well how any woman can read something calling itself a newspaper which has a topless picture of a woman in it?! Well .

See [http://www.object.org.uk/ the Object campaign]] re objectification of women etc.

well it calls itself dailymail.co.uk.

So it must be them that's fibbing about being the same, rather than you that's fibbing about being different.

Do you know roughly how many stories in teh paper are not featured in teh online edition as a percentage, say?

Does anyone know if McMullan's testimony is available online for viewing. I miissed it but have seen some of it on youtube and it does look like it is worth watching.

Ah, so we're meaning different as in "the same but with more stuff added" and we're using "totally separate and unrelated" to mean "the same company sharing most of their resources with majorly overlapping content".

Well as long as your definitions are clear.

don't forget the same name, neuro.

The website is called Mail Online

Yes it is called the Mail Online, but the address is www.dailymail.co.uk.

Odd coincidence. They have the same logo too! What are the odds?

well somebody is using the name of your paper as a domain name, and robbing stories off your newspaper as well. Your legal department should get on it.

So....to summarise Nancy's increasingly desperate attempts to whitewash her employer's reputation:

The online edition is completely and utterly different to the print version. Any similarities are merely coincidental. Like the stories that appear in both.

Clearly, 'tis a very quiet week for news on the Mail and the online paper that isn't at all like the Mail.

Yes, yes...excellent - that is EXACTLY what I said - no conjecture to suit your own argument whatsoever there.....

Want a job?