To think this doesn't make me a 'lazy fucking bitch'

[ohlookanamechange]

Background: DH works very long hours. He is in a career he chose, and persued, with my support. Pay is ok, but not massive. When we we first together and with one DC, I worked full time. Then I went part time (joint decision). Since births of DC2 & 3, I have not worked. All DCs are now at school and I am looking for work to fit in around school hours, which isn't easy to find.

Neither DH or I want me to work full time as we do not want to put the DC into childcare (personal choice and not a judgement of others - we used day nursery for DC1).

Due to DH's hours, I cannot work evenings as he often would not be home, ditto weekends. We have no family to help with childcare.

DH's wage supports us ok, but there isn't exactly much spare cash.

So today, DH has just exploded at me and called me a 'lazy fucking bitch'. He then stormed off and I confronted him, as the reason he called me that was utterly ridiculous and a real non-issue. He has shouted that I should work the same hours that he does, and if he doesn't get home until 12am, then I should stay up and do housework until then.

He has moaned that I should not sit down in the evenings whilst there is any outstanding housework, such as any washing or ironing. He has moaned that the oven isn't cleaned often enough and also that there are Xmas presents left to wrap - it's still a few weeks away and I have done ALL the mas shopping for everyone, except my own presents (which are yet to be bought).

After that, I lost my rag, told him to fuck off and threw some clothes at him. He has driven off in his work van. He isn't meant to be into work until late tomorrow but I don't think I will see him now until probably weds morning when he returns from tomorrow's work. The way I am feeling right now, is that it is over. He has hinted at these feelings before, but when i've questioned him about it, e says he is joking. Tonight has proved he isn't. He honestly believes I am lazy and has said I am crap at what I do - being a housewife.

So AIBU? Should I be putting in the hours he is? Often he leaves as 5.30am and returns at 12am. This is mostly overtime and a lot by choice, but we could do with the money. It is due to his career that I am so restricted by hours, and he knows I have applied for all the local part time term time jobs, with not much luck. I tend to sit down once the DCs are in bed and lunches are made, yet he believes I should carry on until EVERYTHING is done. The house is clean and tidy, but there is a basket of irnong and there was a chopping board not washed up, which had just had bread on it, which both of us would usually leave until morning.

I should add that this would have not been helped by the fact he has been giving up smoking for about 6 weeks, but it seems to be what he really thinks

Apologies this is so long.

Oh love. You sound at the end of your tether and no wonder.

I am getting pretty angry on your behalf - I think we all agree working his kind of hours is very tough but it seems to me it's tougher on you TBH.

You're bored, you want a job, and he's insisting he must do the job he likes, so many hours that he can't do anything else and he yells at you.

No, sorry, that is not on.

What would he say if you suggested it was your turn to have your career prioritized now? It does seem only fair when he is making his career have such a huge effect on your life and your childrens' lives.

I've done hours like that - on buildings sites.

He can't think straight. He just can't.

You must get him to reduce his hours. You will not get any of the other relationship stuff sorted until he does.

You work like that, you're basically high. It does things to your head, it really does. Add quitting smoking into the mix, and you're wasting your breath talking to him.

I'm not for one minute trying to excuse his behavior. However, if you want to sort this situation out you have to get your half-deranged husband down from the trees so he can hold a rational conversation.

That means less hours and hopefully some time off. Everything else is pointless until you get him to do that.

Yes I thought the Same re affair

And guessing he works for rm

Stuckfor words, that's really helpful thanks.

I have no idea how he keeps going with the hours, but I really don't know why he does it. It is probably a very deep rooted must do my best at everyhting thing from childhood. But he's a grown man now and I have supported him 100% throughout our relationship and forgiven some very shitty behaviour on his part.

I have no career. I have only ever had 'jobs' not bad ones but not something like he has. I could never match his wages just going from nothing to getting a job,

Next year I will be starting a degree with the OU which should help make me less bored and i'm hoping to do some volunteering soon.

We need to have a chat about his hours. They have become so normal that sometimes I don't realise how insane they are.

Not having an affair - although I can see why it looks like that and you're not the first to suggest it. WEll he's definitely doing the overtime. If he's also having an affair then i'm defnitely lazier than him.

He does moan he doesn't get enough sex - I do point out that it would help if he was at home sometimes, and that if I wasn't so fucking bored I may feel like it a bit more.

Think i'll go to bed, i'm confusing myself with all this and i'm tired - even though I wasn't up at 5am!

He's a danger to himself and others working these hours.

Remember the bloke who fell asleep at the wheel, crashed onto train tracks and caused many deaths?

This simmering resentment you both feel needs to be sorted. If your marriage ends, what would he be working for?

op i could not live like that.

he is using the family home as a hotel, what are you getting from this relationship.

You are not lazy, infact i would turn it around i say he was lazy and using his work as a cop out for not having to deal with the day to life.

You need to bring home to him that HE is the one who is being ridiculous. Working the way he does is just stupid and unsustainable. You don't look back at your life when you're on your deathbed and wish you'd worked more, you wish you'd spent more time with your loved ones.

HE is the one making a martyr out of himself. No-one else. No-one is making him do it.

And how dare he try to dictate to you that you should be equally as stupid as him and slave all hours like an idiot? To what end? To become a thundering gobshite like him?

He needs a sharp reality check. You cant cuddle an overtime cheque at night.

We've kind of continued in a relationship for no reason other than the fact that we're already in it. If I met him now, or if we didn't have children etc, I wouldn't stay for a minute.

OP, there's your answer.

I know you said upthread that you think you can't split because you haven't worked for many years and can't support the DCs, but you can. He can pay child support, you can get some help through benefits. You can get out of this abusive non-relationship, find your feet and within a few years be making a better future for yourself. You can't do any of this by sticking around. Yes it will be tough but the 5-years-from-now you will look back and wonder why you didn't do it earlier.

I'm not one to jump on the "leave him" brigade but by your own admission you don't think this is a relationship worth saving. He sounds like he has some serious mental issues (workaholic, abusive, taking you for granted, etc.) If you stay then will become more and more YOUR issues too, in that you have to deal with him. He's already got you thinking you're lazy (FFS!) so you can see the damage he's done to you already.

If your marriage is worth saving, then you need to think seriously about some couples counselling. Lay it on the line for him -- if you stay, then things change. Radically. Otherwise you leave (or more like, he leaves and you stay with the DC).

It's a scary time for sure, but if you're already at the tend of your rope and have decided not to put up with it anymore, then you've already taken the first all-important and hardest step.

And YANBU obviously! And no man should be treating you like this, you can do better.

Of course YANBU, being spoken to like that.

However, I have worked those hours, late in my first marriage. For almost two years, non-stop. I can honestly tell you that I was so indescribably exhausted I was sometimes not thinking straight at all. Had I quit smoking at that time....

Absolutely not an excuse for speaking to you that way, but maybe worth considering as you weigh things out. Exhaustion really does do strange things to a person.

My dp has worked similar hours in the past but has cut down alot since ds3 was born, however he has never spoken to me like that and wouldn't even if I decided to tale a whole week off from the housework

Sounds as though he's chosen the job over you. He clearly isn't choosing to spend time with you, or your DCs. Is he aware that other people have family and social lives and enjoy spending time with other people?

The not being able to turn down overtime thing is odd - like a person who's been starved being obsessed about food, has he struggled for money and feels some compulsive need to gather as much as possible? It does sound like a compulsion, of a not very healthy kind.

Sounds like you do more housework than we do, you certainly deserve a rest after a long day.

You working won't help if you have to spend it all on childcare will it?

Your thread makes me feel lucky, I can't imagine living with such a person and don't think anyone should have to live with his horrible 'everyone must be the same as me or else' attitude.

I think you need to talk to him about reducing his hours to something feasible say 8-6 or whatever would work. Say you think it's really damaging family life and your relationship. If he agrees to cut down then I would stick around and see how getting more sleep and getting used to stopping smoking changes his character. It might be that you get the man you used to love back. If so brilliant - if not you can re-evaluate things then. At the moment it's impossible to know how you feel about him as he is grumpy and unpleasant but anyone doing what he's doing would be...

There's no excuse for the way he ranted at you. Has he been like this before the kids came round?

I don't think what you do or don't do (sounds like you do enough already. Cleaning out the oven???? -sounds like he needs to get a grip!) is the actual issue here. You're not leaving anything necessary undone.

He's stressed about something. Money worries? Mid life crisis? An affair? Problems at work / not enough work / fear of losing his job or business?

Maybe it is purely the nicotine withdrawal making him like this. I have heard people say it can - when their flatmates/family members went cold turkey. Maybe he should consider getting some patches/gum/Zyban, whichever is medically appropriate according to his doctor. They do help with mood swings.

Lack of sleep can do it too. Can he be persuaded to stop doing overtime? Money might be useful in the short term, but unless it's to prevent eviction (need it for the mortgage), prevent hypothermia (pay heating bills), prevent malnutrition (need it for basic food bills), one needs to think hard about what the extra cash is costing the whole family, not just you. It's a Faustian pact. If the extra money is causing such harm, ultimately divorce and splitting the family into two homes will be even more costly than having a lower income and economising. Unless, of course, the extra money is essential for things like mortgage and meals on the table.

The other thing is whether the decision not to use childcare - nursery/childminder - is now one he is regretting. If he is really finding it too hard to cope with being the sole breadwinner, then it may be time to reconsider this. The children will cope with being with a reliable childminder or nursery - but they cope less well with all this aggression or the negative outcome (eg separation).

However, if he refuses to discuss things with you, then it might be a sign that things are indeed over - or that he wants to call time on it. Try, try in the first instance to at least to talk the problems over and ask what sort of solutions he'd like to see - not for you to be washing or making bread round the clock, clearly, but proper solutions like altering his work hours, or going back to work for you, etc etc.

Really feel for you OP - it's awful to be on the receiving end of it. (speaking as one who knows from experience).

Typo: I mean "like this before the kids came?"

op - i think i get exactly where you're coming from.

the tiredness/stress/no smoking may well be the trigger - but it's the underlying attitude that would be a deal breaker for me.

he's not valuing you or your role at all. it's not a competition to see who does the most/hardest/best paid/shittiest job.

it's about working together as a couple for things that you've agreed about as a couple.

if you both want kids - someone has to look after them. how that's arranged is up to you both to decide, but shouldn't be seen as a better/lesser contribution.

if it wasn't for your input, would he have passed his exams, been able to work those hours, or even have kids? almost definitely no. if you disappeared tomorrow his life would be in chaos - without you he would suddenly need childcare, a cleaner, a cook etc etc. you may not be contributing money, or working as long hours, but he can only have the lifestyle he does because of you.

it sounds like a classic case of he's swallowed the patriarchal bullshit that he HAS to be the big man supporting his family, is almost addicted to that scenario, but at the same time resents it & is displacing it onto you.

I bet if you offered to be a wohm, with him as sahp, he would turn you down flat. he is doing it to martyr himself, feel needed, and you aren't doing enough to make up for how he feels he's sacrificed himself. you never will be able to.

and the refusing to discuss/apologise/acknowledge this issue is very manipulative.

sit him down, tell him straight, then figure out what to do.

Since your last post OP I am inclined to think maybe you should leave. You say if you met the guy now, you wouldn't stay with him for one minute. Tbh it sounds like there is no love or respect left, you are both ploughing on in a toxic relationship. That can't be good for you or the children.

You seem to feel you don't have choices, because you don't earn and haven't ever qualified for a career. That's worrying but you need to address the issue now- it's either that, or spend the next 40 years living like this- bored out of your skull and with an abusive husband. Whatever he says about wanting to take on all this work, it clearly is NOT making him happy. Maybe he's depressed, or underneath is desperately stressed by the responsibility of sole financial upkeep of the family. He's dealing with it totally the wrong way- he ought to be talking to you about how to decrease his work hours and increase yours- not just ploughing on in his job and then resenting you. But clearly he isn't happy, you are not happy and in that atmosphere how can your children be?

Also meant to add: don't let him 'tell 'you' he doesn't want you working outside school hours. This is YOUR life. YOUR brain needing some stimulation. YOUR right to have a work life with the social and other stimulus that brings. And please don't go down the route of thinking 'well so-and-so has granny picking the kids up so it's easier for her', as you mentioned above. That way madness lies. You'll constantly be looking for reasons why you cant change the situation. Widen your job search, organise some childcare (yes it'll cost but so what? It's an investment for YOUR future). Then tell your husband what you are doing to make YOUR life happier

OP I have read through some of this thread, and personally I am at the way he has spoken to you and treats you, working long hours is no excuse. I don't understand how he can legally work 19 hours a day, isent there a law against that! I am inclined to agree with booty on this one, there is something that doesn't ring true. You cannot be 100% certain whether he is working those hours and what he is doing all day, and picking on you like that! You have to think long and hard about what you want to do. Lots of people would not tolerate this verbal abuse.

One day don't do all the stuff you normally do, let him see the mess & chaos that would ensue if you really WERE a "lazy bitch" !!

No-one should be spoken to like that by anyone, DH or not.

My ex used to be foul when he tried to give up smoking. We agreed he could have one or two a day just if /when he got really bad. The GP said as long as he kept it under 4/5 a day the health benefit was offset by the level of stress putting the BP up. It worked much better, kept him calm & he has kept it that way ever since, usually one after coffee lunch & tea is all he needs max.

I'm not putting it all down to that obviously but it might help if you could have your chats when he's not in withdrawal.

As an aside, your OU course will help give you your sense of self back, they are brilliant, loads of support & all the books/tools you need to get started.

Btw, does he recognise that other people would pity him, not admire him, for his workaholic obsession, lack of balance and pleasure in life? Are we all lazy b**s, is he the only person who can understand what's important in the world? If he thinks this sincerely he has a deep problem, if he recognises that others have a point and he's doing it to cover for something, at least he has a problem he can address.

Don't mean to be too flippant but you'd both be great candidates for 'wife swap' - remember the low-grade tv 'entertainment' programme? He'd be paired with a wife who spent two hours doing her hair, drank wine with her friends every day and expected him to cook or buy takeaways when he came home, (or someone with a job and a cleaner who shared out of hours childcare) and would come to appreciate you much more! You'd get to put your feet up for a couple of weeks.

I echo what everybody else said - he is out of order.

Just one thought: If he expects you to do housework from 5am until 12 midnight when he does those hours, what would he expect to happen when he comes home at 6pm? Would it be ok for you to 'down tools' and not do any more housework or looking after children? And what about weekends - does he do exactly the same hours as you with regards to housework and childcare?

He is bang out of order, first for putting work and money before your family and second for his stinking attitude towards you.

He needs to realise that they only reason he can do his job is because you stay at home. He needs to realise that you gave up your career for the sake of your family. He needs to realise that being at home with the kids is damned hard work, no days off, no sick leave, no pay and no bloody thanks for any of it. He needs to realise that you and the kids should come first, as long as you can eat, keep warm and have a roof over your heads then overtime can be damned. He's made choices that are making his family suffer, he's selfish and basically just stupid of he thinks that his opinion is right in any way.

Sending you my sympathy, my ex worked nights and slept all day until an hour before he had to be at work so I know how hard it is without any support from your partner. If he'd even attempted to call me lazy I would have kicked his arse into the next century!

Hours like that are unsustainable.

He's sleep deprived and his body is running on empty.

Well the update is he slept on the sofa - I only realised he was home when I got up

Neither of us said a word to eachother - I will not start speaking to him until he apologises as what will happen is I will start speaking to him, he will be arsey, then gradually come round and I will feel like I am in the wrong.

It's weird as when I am reading all of you saying that I am not lazy, i'm actually disagreeing. Probably as I am on MN for a few minutes, rather than hoovering or something equally boring.

We have spoken about his hours before. I have told him it is crazy and not normal. But he still doesn't stop. I should point out that he's not working 5am til 12am - travel is included which is 3 to 4 hours there and back. Written like that I do feel sorry for him but he is choosing it.

I will have to see what happens over the next couple of days. He will very likely work late tonight and will either not come home, leave really early, or just ignore he in the morning (he is actually meant to be going in later tomorrow).

He is on nicotine tablets and the spray thing.

When he looks at other people, because he sees that most women we know are working, I think when he is in one of those moods, that justifies how he feels. But when we talk about it rationally, he says it's not worth the extra money for the hassle it would cause - childcare, kids being ill, school plays etc.