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AIBU?

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Original poster

to think Cancer Research should rethink some of their marketing?

381 replies

MrsCarriePooter · 05/12/2011 12:13

This is a fairly mild AIBU but interested in what you think.

We were in our local Cancer Research shop this morning and in the window they had a big poster of a woman who had survived breast cancer, but the wording was something about "Vanessa wasn't going to let cancer beat her". I said to the volunteer insider when I was paying that I thought that was a bit offensive, as though those who die from cancer just had decided to roll over and "let cancer beat" them. Was I just being overtouchy? Having had relatives die of cancer I know I could be. The volunteer said "she'd pass my views" on to the area manager.

OP posts:
madwomanintheattic · 05/12/2011 17:08

oh we did look at the sontag. it was more looking at cross-cultural stuff and working out why that terminology in particular was so prevalent in the uk (wondered about the uk/ ww1/2 stuff) - don't think sontag looked at other european countries? so wanted to know whether there had been a pan -european study, which might have suggested 19th century stuff. and wanted to dig through old lit and dig up references...)

(sorry, previous life as eng student means sometimes i get intrigued by a particular aspect. - so not the discourse as such, but more why here?) must go and dig it out and read now though. thanks for reminding me!

limitedperiodonly · 05/12/2011 17:09

mummy that's awful. Idiots.

lisaro · 05/12/2011 17:20

YANBU. I have also thought this - a very close relative has recently had cancer.

WhoIsThatMaskedWoman · 05/12/2011 17:20

I'm with Danny Baker. Cancer is fought, bitterly, but it is fought by doctors and researchers, with the help and endurance of the patients.

The only cancer sufferers in my family actually chose not to fight it, for reasons which made sense to us all. They had better things to do with their remaining few years than chemo.

Hardgoing · 05/12/2011 17:21

madwoman, I think Sontag was writing about America, it's very connected with the positive thinking 'American Dream' anything is possible narrative. Not sure why we in the UK are more susceptible to this, some have argued it's the Protestant work ethic at play (i.e. those who work harder, are in control, take personal responsibility are 'better' people) which would explain why its not as prevalent in other European countries.

paddypoopants · 05/12/2011 17:21

I agree wholeheartedly. This attitude has always angered me -my Dad died of cancer he obviously didn't fight hard enough. Cancer Research should be more sensitive to those bereaved- a lot of them who go on to do fund raising for CR after their friend or family member has died.

LambofGod · 05/12/2011 17:26

YANBU- I find this incredibly disturbing, and can't put my finger on why.

I think its the randomness and sheer wrongness of the thinking that a positive mental attitude will get you through.

Did anyone hear Ramblings on Radio 4 about a month ago Salcombe- Hope Cove? There was a woman recovering from BC (I think); her son was talking about how he knew she'd be ok, didn't ever think she wouldn't and I just felt very angry on her behalf. There was no space for her feelings; the 'she's a fighter- she'll be ok' discourse is more about the person saying it and their fears it than the person with cancer IMO.

Oggy · 05/12/2011 17:28

Not read the whole thread but just thought I would pipe in because I used to work at Cancer Research UK several years ago and it was something that came up within the charity then that people found this offensive (and rightly so in my opinion, I agree with OP) so I am surprised that it is still being used as an approach.

Cancer Research UK are very image conscious so the best way to get any action IMO is likley to be to make a very loud fuss about the issue.

HoHoOpotomus · 05/12/2011 17:29

I visit our local CR shop weekly and saw the same poster and thought the same thing as the OP last week. There is a dreadful implication that those who lose their life to cancer somehow didn't fight hard enough or werent' strong enough - I don't think cancer is like that.

AWimbaAllTheWay · 05/12/2011 17:32

A little off topic but this reminded me of a feature on This Morning many years ago. My fiancé had just died in a train crash, This Morning did a feature where they had a survivor on and were insinuating that some people survived because they had better and faster instincts than others. Obviously I took offence as having extensive knowledge of what happened in that crash I knew my Df would have died no matter what he'd done and I found it very hurtful that people were saying he could have survived if only he'd had better instincts. I called to complain and after I refused to go on air to discuss it Richard Madeley made some snidey remark, wanker.

Sometimes people are just unlucky, sometimes lucky, whether it be cancer or train crash.

LinusVanPelt · 05/12/2011 17:34

I have nothing to add that hasn't already been said more eloquently than I could manage, but just wanted to add one more post in support of the sentiments of the OP.

I am yet another person who has lost beloved immediate family members to cancer, and this 'winning the battle' and 'not letting it beat you' language upsets me every time.

It is wrong to link survival to virtue. Wrong, wrong, wrong.

madwomanintheattic · 05/12/2011 17:35

that's interesting hardgoing... have you got any links that consider the european stuff? or ideas where to look? always adding to my 'to read' pile Smile and this thread reminded me i didn't go anywhere with that thought and now it's tickling me again... it was a one hour seminar and then we were whisked off in another direction, but i always meant to dig around a bit.

OhDoAdmitMrsDeVere · 05/12/2011 17:42

See - I do think people getting treatment for cancer are brave because its so horrible. I DO think my DD was the bravest person I have ever known because she could have said 'I am not doing that!' But I hate that bloody crappy brave heros stuff too. I know it doesnt make sense but its the way I feel anyway.
People on treatment are deserving of our care and respect. We should be extra nice and considerate to them. Because they are going through a horrible thing.
We shoudnt be placing extra pressure on them to run marathons and bare their bald heads with pride (unless they want to)

DD was the most bravest because at the end when they said they could try one more treatment (one that had almost killed her previously) she said 'no' she said she had enough and wanted to 'have my body back'. She was 14 ffs.

Is she not brave because she didnt keep battling on?

Another thing is that 'dont give up on her' 'keep strong' FUCK OFFFFFFFF.

The poster who wrote to the magazine about the 'touched by breast cancer thing' WELL DONE. If I hear of one more fucking z list sleb and their 'cancer scare' which turns out to be nothing more than a 'hmmm what if I have cancer, oooh I am off to the doctor' I will fecking scream. Its like a fashion accessorie the way they all have 'baby scares' when they are pregnant.

I havent seen the poster you are talking about. I am glad because the way I feel at the moment I would probably smash the bloody window it was hanging in.

CLicsargent are one of my favourite charities and I am very grateful to them but a few years ago they bought out lovely little bear key rings. I bought lots for friends. The only thing is that they called them 'survivour bears'. Do those that dont survive not matter then? Are they an embaressment?

4c4good · 05/12/2011 17:45

I agree too OP. The whole terminology of fights and battles adds a furtehr burden to those already dealing with a massive issue in their lives. And it also suggests that those who die, somehow didn't fight hard enough, think positively enough.

It's pernicious. There is a great book by Barbara Ehrenreich called, I think 'brightsiding' or similar - how this naive belief in being positive and working hard will inevitably lead to success ( or 'victory') Very protestant work ethic, very american, and very wrong, IMHO.

If success comes most to those who work hardest, then field workers in sub-saharan Africa and children in clothing factories in India would be rich beyond price.

OhDoAdmitMrsDeVere · 05/12/2011 17:46

Does anyone have a link to the poster so I can see it before I complain about it. It sounds rubbish but I think I should see it first!

KinkyDoritoWithFairyLightsOn · 05/12/2011 17:51

It's not something you can win or lose! It isn't competing with you.

Yuk.

I'm speaking from the perspective of a parent whose child has cancer.

YANBU

hester · 05/12/2011 17:54

This whole thing of 'I'm not a victim I'm a survivor/ what doesn't kill you makes you stronger/ I live with this disease, not under it, and it has made me grow so much as a person' seemed to really flourish in the late 80s and early 90s, particularly in relation to the HIV epidemic. I do get why it has happened, and it's not all oppressive. BUT it seems to curdle in with our (understandable) taboo around death in a very unfortunate way, that silences people's real experiences - whatever they may be - and sets up a new orthodoxy about appropriate behaviour.

A friend of mine lost his dad to mouth cancer last year. Towards the end it was just horrific - the poor guy had no tongue left, no lower jaw, was a skeletal weight and suffering very badly. His family were FURIOUS with the doctor who suggested further treatment may not be in his best interests: "How dare he? Our dad's a fighter, he wouldn't ever want to give up" etc. Well, I don't know. He wasn't my dad, they may have been right, but also maybe not. I don't think my friend knew whether he was right or not, because he wouldn't even discuss the issue with his dad (easy to avoid when the poor man couldn't talk). Poor, poor man.

JugglingWithGoldandMyrhh · 05/12/2011 17:54

MrsDV I'm glad to know more about your dd. I'm so sorry you lost her. Sad

A lot of the talk about fighting cancer and brave heroes is for the benefit of Joe Bloggs. So we don't have to face our fear that there are scary things out there that we can do very little about.

hester · 05/12/2011 17:55

Huge sympathies to everyone on this thread who has a loved one with cancer, or who has lost a loved one to cancer.

AliGrylls · 05/12/2011 17:56

Agree with you OP it is completely down to luck whether you die of cancer or not. DH and I both hate this. I hope someone from cancer research reads this thread.

LadyBeagleBaublesAndBells · 05/12/2011 17:58

But it's not just this particular poster is it.
It's everywhere in the media.
Whether you're a celebrity or not, you've got to be brave.
I was lucky with my breast cancer, I had a mastectomy and then 5 years with tamoxifen, at the end of the day it's about luck, nothing to do with fighting it.
I remember the mother that spent her last few years cycling and breaking records.
The media worshipped her because she was 'doing something about it', instead of spending her last few years with her children
Respect to her (someone may remember her name) and she was praised for her courage.
I myself just didn't get it.

JinglePosyPerkin · 05/12/2011 17:59

YANBU. My dad died of cancer after "fighting" for 2 years. My mum has an incurable form of cancer at the moment, which she is "fighting" with chemo.

Using words like that does somehow seem to suggest that my dad could have survived if only he'd "fought" a bit harder Xmas Sad.

KinkyDoritoWithFairyLightsOn · 05/12/2011 18:00

DD isn't fighting cancer as she has fuck all control over the situation.

JinglePosyPerkin · 05/12/2011 18:00

LadyBeagle Jane Tomlinson.

piffpoff · 05/12/2011 18:04

I soo agree Mrs Devere, I too hate these (usually z list) celebs with their 'scare', show me some one who has never had one. I can't imagine how I would cope with my child having cancer and I hear your rage about those trying to jump on the sympathy band wagon.
My dad died young from cancer and I have always been bothered by talk of 'fighting it' and positive mental attitude and all that, it may help people to deal with their illness but does not IMO help you to survive.
On a slightly different note I used to have a direct debit set up to pay monthly to Cancer research and they were always phoning me asking me to increase the amount donated, I felt quite irrtated by this as though what I was
contributing was not enough. Now that I'm back in the UK after living abroad I'm reluctant to do this again as it feels as though they don't really value your contributions.