to think Cancer Research should rethink some of their marketing?

[MrsCarriePooter]

This is a fairly mild AIBU but interested in what you think.

We were in our local Cancer Research shop this morning and in the window they had a big poster of a woman who had survived breast cancer, but the wording was something about "Vanessa wasn't going to let cancer beat her". I said to the volunteer insider when I was paying that I thought that was a bit offensive, as though those who die from cancer just had decided to roll over and "let cancer beat" them. Was I just being overtouchy? Having had relatives die of cancer I know I could be. The volunteer said "she'd pass my views" on to the area manager.

Yanbu.

If only 'fighting' was enough.

My dad did fight it. He kept his humour and dignity, and still did whatever he wanted to, within limits of the disease. You would not know to meet him that he had a terminal disease - there was no way that he would go into remission or 'survive' this illness.

YANBU, well done for saying something. The rhetoric of a battle obviously works well for the wider campaign, but when it's used about individuals the implications are distressing.

Totally agree - it's an appalling message. I think the language of battling, fighting, winning or losing the struggle...it's become a soundbite, I wonder if they gave it much thought at all. But of course it's offensive.

There's a very good book about this called 'Smile or Die' by Barbara Ehrenreich - she developed breast cancer and was horrified by the pink ribbons and the teddy bears and the positive thinking message. It's a good read if you want to read someone moaning for ten chapters about the positive-thinking/self-help industry John Diamond also wrote about this in his book - he got very very angry about it.

Good on you for complaining. And sorry for all of you who've been through it, it's very hard

Oh, this has always angered me.

Why is it only cancer you are expected to go into 'battle' with?

Nobody says you should 'fight' heart disease, emphysema, diabetes, liver disease.....

It makes no sense.

YANBU OP

Interesting article here:
Smile! You've got cancer

Sorry - crossposted with Prune!

VFVF Thank you. It was hard - but it becomes harder when I see things like this. Of all the people to realise - you would think CRUK would!

Oh yeah Ehrenreich is great Prune.
I have to recommend "Emperor of All Maladies" by Siddharta Mukherjee too - it won the Pulitzer Prize for non-fiction this year.
It is one of the best books I have ever read on cancer. Doesn't sound like a cosy nightime book I know - but it reads like a great thriller.
Can't recommend it highly enough.

I have mixed opinions. My dad died of cancer. A horrible, disfiguring, invasive and cruel type that robbed him of one eye, half his face, and his ability to talk properly, and he did have to "fight". He had to battle daily to just be able to eat. He saw it as a fight, and there were times when it got too much, and he just wanted to give up, and those there the days when he needed people around him to encourage him to "fight it".

Sadly, and inevitably, he did lose his fight after years when the cancer returned in a different and inoperable place.

I do beleive that a positive attitude can help in some cases.

If anything, even if people dont like the wording, it has had the effect of getting people talking about it and thinking about their campaign, which in itself is a good thing to me.

Ade Edmunson in the DM

"Ade Edmondson wants to get something off his chest. No one, he says, 'battles' cancer. Neither is it 'a rollercoaster ride'. 'It's just a long, slow, miserable grind,' and he wants me to quote him on that verbatim."

"'So, there is no battle. I hate the word battle. You just get battered with a load of drugs. People want the words "trauma", "battle" and " life-changing", but it's not a great three-part TV drama full of moments, it's a long grind, like a slow car crash that will last five years and then, hopefully, we'll get out.'"

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1322482/Adrian-Edmondson-struggling-help-wife-Jennifer-Saunders-cancer.html

Can I quote Danny Baker, who I think summed it up very well when he had cancer "I am not fighting cancer, the doctors are fighting caner. I am just the battleground".

YANBU.

I'm not a fan of CRUK (crook!). Just 0.3% of their money goes towards childhood cancer which will kill 3 out of the 10 children who will be diagnosed by the end of today.

YANBU. I agree. I'm a cancer survivor. This year, one of my best friends and my father have both died from cancer. My uncle is currently going through treatment.

I have ALWAYS hated the discourse surrounding cancer of war/battles/fights/victory/"beating the disease". Like another poster, I also loathed the TV ads about the survivors saying "They shouldn't be here" - it was like a thump in the gut. This is one of the reasons I don't give to CRUK, and loathe Race for Life with every fibre of my being.

Cancer survival is not based on your positive mental attitude. It is based on early detection and good treatment. Even then, this may not be enough. Sadly, there are many women (and men) in developing countries dying from preventable and treatable cancers. In this country, our cancer survival rates are not as good as they could be - partly because of health service issues and partly because of poor early diagnosis. British people are literally dying of politeness - we aren't nearly arsey enough in terms of demanding tests and following up on things. One of the saddest things about my friend who died is that a key period of possible diagnosis was missed because a letter from her GP to the hospital was never sent - after three months, she followed up and the system rebooted, but she lost valuable time. We never knew if that could have made the difference in her being here today but I often wonder. So stuff being positive and twinkly. Let's hear it for patients being demanding, stroppy and argumentative. Let's hear it for patients being scared, tired and fed up. Let's hear it for cancer survivors being treated like normal human beings, not being lionized as heroes or patronised as suffering saints. And let' s hear it for a health service that delivers excellent quality care, which is what charities should be focusing on, not guilt trip marketing nonsense.

Oh, and let's burn anything pink and fluffy. [hwink]

Today's Guardian has an interview with the oncologist whose book on cancer, The Emperor's Malady, has just won the Guardian First Book prize. He is very adamant that there is no relationship between a positive mental attitude and surviving cancer.

What's odd is that Cancer Research should endorse this attitude. After all, Cancer Research's raison d'etre is that you beat cancer by finding more effective treatments. If this positive attitude baloney worked, they'd be out of business.

I too am sick of all the stereotypical platitudes associated with cancer. I was diagnosed 2 and a half years ago - I am now lucky enough to be in remission. It's not because I fought hard either, its just that my cancer was detected early and responded very well to treatment.

I still get people saying how brave I am/ was. I'm not brave, I was absolutely shitting myself.

I am another in agreement. All the people I know who have had cancer have been 'strong', 'fighters' etc. This is not something you can pick up a weapon and slay (if only it was!). My nan survived breast cancer when I was a baby, but 10 years later got stomach cancer, which is one of the less survivable (iykwim) and passed away. Work colleague J got lung cancer aged 55, having been diagnosed with chest infections etc, and died 6 weeks later. Auntie J had kidney/adrenal cancer at 45. P who had just become a grandma at 53 - bowel and liver cancer. FIL died earlier this year of multiple tumours, some misdiagnosed as illnesses linked to diabetes. All these were 'battlers' with good reasons to 'fight' (I had DS 3 months after FIL died and he was looking forward to his arrival hugely, Auntie J had 2 teenagers etc) but 'succumbed' (another word I hate when linked to this evil disease).

Cancer research should know better. I also hate their tv ads - the ones at the moment where X was diagnosed, but survived, and then at the end there is an elderly man on his own crying. A few weeks ago we were atching something and this was shown at every break. DH and I tried turning over but we were both sobbing by the 3rd time it came on. DH said it was 'like torture'. :(

YANBU. The strongest person I ever knew died of cancer earlier this year. I'm sure her 11yr old DD would love to know that she doesn't have a mum as she wasn't 'strong' enough!!

hear hear scuttlebutter

I totally agree. I'm sorry I can't read all these posts because it's too close to the bone. I complained to CRUK once about a campaign they were doing about healthy lifestyles preventing cancer. My mother was a health and fitness fanatic and this didn't make a blind bit of difference - cancer still got her. Yes a healthy lifestyle can help prevent SOME cancers, but by no means all. Any campaign that implies a cancer victim can do more to help themselves by living more healthily or fighting harder is both wrong and deeply offensive.

I agree completely. I don't understand how or why the whole terminology of 'fighting a brave battle' is used when it comes to cancer and not other illnesses (not that it should be used for any IMO).

As others have said, it suggests that those who die have just not 'fought' hard enough and have failed somehow. Horrible.

crashdoll - what does the rest of the money go towards?

I agree with Crashdoll - I'm not a fan of CRUK at all. They are often at odds with the World Cancer Research Fund.

Scuttlebutter I completely agree, survival rates in the UK are too low compared with other developed countries. I don't find the UK very good at all, if you have a simple problem they are ok, but if it is complex, multi-systemic or just presents unusually, you have to get past GPs and some of the consultants here use methods they gave up years ago on the continent.

YANBU at all.