Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to not understand the benefits of getting married?

409 replies

RitaMorgan · 12/11/2011 18:15

Putting aside the romantic and religious reasons or the big party/lots of presents (lovely as that would be).

What exactly are the benefits of legally being married over just cohabiting, for a woman with children?

DP very definitely doesn't want to get married, I would quite like a big party/lots of presents but am not sure if there is any point to it beyond that.

AIBU? Should I be insisting on a trip to the Register Office?

OP posts:
scaevola · 12/11/2011 19:22

You cannot become someone's legal next of kin except by marriage.

Many places will accept a different nominee to fulfil the same function as NOK. But if the legal NOK objects, you wouldn't be able to override them.

Bunbaker · 12/11/2011 19:23

I don't care whether people are married or not, but I really resent the assumption that all married people are smug.

OH and I have been together for 33 years and married for 30 of them. We got married because we wanted to, end of.

HeresTheThingBooyhoo · 12/11/2011 19:23

ninky it was the tone of some of the posts from married posters that indicated smugness.

Birdsgottafly · 12/11/2011 19:24

Under the mental health act there is a distinct line of legal next of kin that cannot be over rided by nomination.

SwedishEdith · 12/11/2011 19:25

Who would be the legal NOK if parents are dead and siblings are distant/certainly not easily contactable and no other close relatives?

marthastew · 12/11/2011 19:25

One of the things that was important to me about getting married was us both standing up in front of our families and friends and stating our comitment to each other. It was a definable moment in our relationship where we committed to be with each other forever - and our nearest and dearest witnessed us doing it.

usualsuspect · 12/11/2011 19:26

It works both ways

exoticfruits · 12/11/2011 19:26

If he ever has an accident abroad and you have to deal with the foreign office you would wish you had the 'piece of paper'.

QuintessentialShadow · 12/11/2011 19:27

You need to ensure you are covered in the eventuality that either you or your dp get a stroke or develop Alzheimer, or any illness that affect their functionality. If you are not married, you might find it difficult to handle his accounts or financial affairs for him ....

QuintessentialShadow · 12/11/2011 19:28

Also, for serious medical things, you may not be able to act on his behalf, etc.

Birdsgottafly · 12/11/2011 19:28

Swedish- if that is the case then the doctor can make the decisions, they have to follow the law, they don't have to be nice and reasonable.

SwedishEdith · 12/11/2011 19:29

OK, that's good.

Spero · 12/11/2011 19:29

If you have damaged your career prospects/earning capacity by having children with a man and you dont marry him, you had better be pretty confident that your relationship won't end.

For women in those circumstances, I beg them to get married. The fall out if you don't and then separate can be awful for the economically weaker party. If you're not married you cannot access the Matrimonial Causes Act.

Please see a solicitor if you are in that position.

Bunbaker · 12/11/2011 19:30

"You need to ensure you are covered in the eventuality that either you or your dp get a stroke or develop Alzheimer, or any illness that affect their functionality. If you are not married, you might find it difficult to handle his accounts or financial affairs for him"

You mean power of attorney?

lurkerspeaks · 12/11/2011 19:31

But their fathers name being on their birth certicate only gave him parental responsibilty if they were born after the date the law changed or once you got married

Again, at work, I might a significant cohort of Dad's to older children (ie those > 5 in Scotland) who aren't married when their kids were born and who haven't subsequently applied for PR who then discover that they haven't got it who go absolutely mad.

I've seen security called a few times. In fact my cousin, who was told by me and my sis (solicitor) about PR and how to get it, got caught out as he isn't married, his son had an accident and needed an operation and he couldn't sign the consent form with PR. He now has PR.

I just really wish that people would fully investigate what they are opting out of by choosing not to get married. People like usual and trois who are aware of what they have opted out of it is people who are ignorant of the rights they are waiving that concern me. I'm only really concerned for their future as well. The fact that a child is 'illegitimate' bothers me very little on a daily basis.

NinkyNonker · 12/11/2011 19:32

No, it was the fact many disagree with the perceived benefits. Which is fine, but if those are the reasons someone got wed they are legitimate reasons to them, iyswim.

Want2bSupermum · 12/11/2011 19:33

Trope

"If you have a child out of wedlock the child is illegitimate and historically these children were not recognised as next of kin. Now these children are recognised"

  • ok, so that's not an issue now then

Exactly but only if they are on the birth certificate. From what I understand if you are married the name of DH doesn't have to be on the certificate for them to be recognised as the father.

"but if your OH was run over by a bus Dr's wouldn't be able to speak to you about their medical state"

  • only if you hadn't ensured you were your partners next of kin. Our doctors surgery and hospital have me on their systems as my DPs next of kin. So does every form at his workplace. His family (and mine) know that we are each others next of kin.

I just hope that you don't end up having an issue which requires emergency treatment at another hospital. You are relying on his family not falling out with you. Good luck!

"and any money would be inherited by your DC's. This could cause a problem if you need access to the money before they turn 18."

  • only if you don't have a will that says otherwise.

Good luck. So many people do not have a will. Huge amount of trust is required, esp. if the father is not named on the birth cert.

Basically - planning ahead can cover these issues - so marriage is not the only solution! No judgement at all on those who marry - each to their own, but it isn't the only way to handle these issues!

No marriage isn't the only way to handle things but it is a darn sight easier than getting legal documentation drawn up that basically commits you to each other as if you were married.

Birdsgottafly · 12/11/2011 19:33

Bunbaker- they then come under the mental capacity act (see my other posts) if they then need EMI care, you won't have a say unless you are married, power of attorney is a grey area, when someone loses 'capacity'.

trope · 12/11/2011 19:36

OK - have done some quick googling on next of kin to refresh my memory. It seems from what i've read (today and in the past when researching this) that in the UK there is no such thing as a legal next of kin (supported by wikipedia) As mentioned by a couple of posters above there is an exemption under the mental health act though that is worth considering if mental health issues are a concern. (to be clear here, I understand lots of people suffer mental health issues and they can occur at any time, to anyone, not saying only those who are already mentally ill need to consider this, just that individuals need to decide how much weight to place on this risk to their ability to inform decision making for their partner in a specific set of circumstances).

Further info on being a next of kin in the UK is here

Also ninkynonker I don't think it's fair to characterise all of the responses from non married people in this way - I don't believe i've been rude to anyone about their personal choice to get married, merely commented on other ways to handle the legal issues for those who do not wish to get married.

Regarding "big legal fees" - making a will is not that expensive and is easily done for the price (or far far less in many cases) of a wedding! Particularly if you come from a family as large as mine!! Wink If you check out willaid you can do a will very cheaply during this November as well! Grin

youtalkintome · 12/11/2011 19:36

I wouldn't have thought all the legal crap is reason enough to get married as you can sort EVERYTHING out with a solicitor and probably cheaper than a wedding. Likewise marriage means fuck all if one of you enters into it unwillingly or doesn't take there vows seriously. So, basically there is no reason to get married apart from both of you to really want to commit to each other in that way, publicly.

I resent the smug married comments, i don't think i have been commenting from a smug married point of view. I do think the illegitimate comment was a bit of a fuckwit thing to say Shock.

lurkerspeaks · 12/11/2011 19:36

The 'big legal fees' come because sorting out your choice to not get married and decline it's legal protection eg. inheritance tax dodges, ensuring that all the loose ends are tied up will cost more than a straightforward "I leave everything to my spouse and if we die together I leave everything to our children" will.

Bascially you have to pay a solicitor to make sure you haven't forgotten about anything.

youtalkintome · 12/11/2011 19:38

Chances are by the time you need someone to take control of your finances ie power of attorney, it will be one of your children anyway.

lurkerspeaks · 12/11/2011 19:42

You can't sort everything out with a solicitor!

The inheritance tax thing can't be fixed.

However I agree everything else can be. However IMO and I agree it is only my opinion getting married is easier than stressing about what you might have forgotten. The problem with 'fixing' it is that most people don't bother (or don't ever realise they had to and their inaction ends them up in a whole pile of doo doo.

I suspect that the posters arguing vociferously about the advantages of not being married are self selecting. In the same way that I am self selecting in that I am aware of the protection that marriage provides and feel strongly that it is something that I would choose. However most people aren't so well informed and aren't so proactive and end up in the shit. You only ahve to look at how many Britons die intestate to know that people aren't very good at planning to deal with disaster.

BTW being classed in with the "Smug marrieds" is making me laugh as I am single!

trope · 12/11/2011 19:42

want2besupermum - DP has had emergency medical treatment and has had a number of operations - as his named next of kin on all of his hospital forms all hospital staff have fully respected my right to be kept informed. I understand there are cases where this hasn't happened for some people, but I don't know that getting married just in case, is the right solution for me and DP.

Why wouldn't I put DP on the birth certificate? We aren't talking about people who know nothing about these issues and have done no planning and whether it's better / safer for their family unit if they are married - we're talking about whether there is a compelling reason for 2 people to get married if they feel no personal need to.

Regarding relying on not falling out with family, our families know each other, we spend lots of time together and we all respect each other (despite our many many differences). If we had a falling out that couldn't be fixed then yes, we would probably take legal advice on the best way to protect DP and I, but I'm not going to do something i'm idealogically opposed to just in case something very unlikely happens.

Birdsgottafly · 12/11/2011 19:43

Youtalkintome-Mental health conditions can strike at any age, as said my dh's was caused through cancer, which isn't that uncommon. Car accidents now account fort a lot of MH problems, as can something like PND. I would rather my chosen partner have a say than my crank of a mother.

I see daily the effect of people not having legal protection in my job as a cP SW and my voluntary job in welfare rights. Whilst there is a 'best practice' policy, it isn't always followed, whereas the law has to be followed.