to be completely shocked and disgusted at the leaflet I've just been given by my mw???

[mummylovesnancy]

This leaflet, titled 'Raised BMI in Pregnancy' was passed on to me by my midwife at my booking in appointment yesterday. Along with the words 'You can't have a home birth, you probably won't deliver naturally and you'll be given consultant led care.'
I'm 28, I have 2 PERFECTLY healthy children who both have perfect height to weight ratios, eat well, are active and are generally normal children. I weigh 13st and I'm 5'2 which puts me in the 'obese' catagory according to the good ol' BMI index of wonder. I have been roughly this weight and exactly this height for all of my adult life. I am overweight, I accept that, but what I don't accept is being told to read this sodding leaflet which tells me, among various other little pearlers, that:
*I will have raised blood pressure. (Not 'I may', 'I WILL')
*I will be prone to urinary tract infections. (never had one in my life!)
*'Bigger Ladies' (exact wordage) get more blood clots. (Dumb Fuck)
*Examinations will be difficult. (Why? Because you have to part all my layers of fat to get to my vag?! How fucking degrading)
*I will have restricted mobilisation. (Will I? Because I don't now, will it automatically come with being fat and preggers?)
*Putting in a drip will be difficult. (yeah because my hands are so freaking chubby.)
*Breastfeeding will be challenging (I've managed it with two babies, now because you've changed your guidelines I think I might struggle.)
And my favourite one yet:
*The risk of stillbirth or your baby dying in the first 28 days is increased in 'larger ladies' (Thanks for that one, nhs, I just had a misscarriage 8 weeks ago. Was it because I'm fat?)

It also mentions on about 7 occasions that I may want an epidural. Is that to keep me quiet?! It also offers to refer me to a dietician and a counsellor.

I have been overweight (or a larger or bigger lady, as the nhs prefers) and given birth naturally twice with absolutely no complications and one of them was a home birth. I can't believe I have to read all this shit. The idiot who wrote this doesn't even know how to place an apostrophe or comma ffs!

Does anyone agree with me that this is a disgusting, degrading, scare mongering piece of shit or am I being an unreasonable pregnant wreck??

There are huge numbers of (particularly middle class) women who giggle about it being Wine O clock and then quaff half or a full bottle of red every night because they're worth it or they have had a few hours with a small child or because they think it's part of a lifestyle or their bored or just whatever.

I feel as eeeked about these women as I do about those who think they are fit and healthy at 15 stone.

It's the stuff going on and on about overweight people being in denial, it's the speculation about how they feed their children. It's the assumption that someone who has a different view about BMI and approaches to weight must be overweight themselves.

All those things are evidence of prejudice against overweight people.

TheQueenoftheDead, if you said that people would be living in a healthy way if they ate a good nutritious diet, took plenty of exercise, didn't drink a lot, didn't smoke and got plenty of sleep, then I'd agree with you. But actually it's not true that a 13 stone woman would be necessarily be healthier just by weighing less, not if she goes on an extreme diet, or she smokes or starts sticking her fingers down her throat - which is what some people do to maintain a lower weight, not if she was drinking a bottle of wine a night. Unless someone is at the extreme ends of the weight scale, it is not possible to tell about health through weight alone. I don't understand why that's such a dificult concept to grasp.

"I feel as eeeked about these women as I do about those who think they are fit and healthy at 15 stone."

Let's see the threads about them then. I'll accept that people are just as willing to judge drinking habits as weight when there are lots of threads about the habits of people who drink and the denial they are supposedly all in.

You are still healthier by weighing a decent weight , regardless of what else you do to your body.

An obese smoker is at greater risk of disease than a slim smoker.

Being fat is bad for you. End of. Smoking is bad for you. End of. drinking too much is bad for you. end of. They are not all mutually exclusive.

I think the information in that leaflet could be damaging. It is giving a clear message that pregnancy is dangerous for overweight women and could encourage women to opt for a medicalised birth that may be inappropriate.

There is a big drive to tackle obesity in pregnant women with good reason as there are risks attached to being overweight but I don't think they have the message right.

They need to target women who are not yet pregnant and encourage them to maintain a healthy weight before getting pregnant.

Before my second pregnancy my bmi was within the normal range but I put on 3.5 stone, the majority of the weight was gained in the last 10 weeks, I actually managed to put on 10 lb in a week right at the end.

I was given a telling-off by a registrar because my bmi had gone from normal to obese and told that there could be complications. But I can't didn't know how I had put on so much weight. My blood pressure remained very low during the pregnancy.

I was actually back to my ore-pregnancy weight within 6 weeks of the birth without dieting so I think the majority of the weight was water. I was very swollen.

You're still focusing on the wrong things Lookattheears.

There are women who are a "normal" weight who have done a huge amount of damage to their bodies through dieting because of the anti-fat messages they receive. It is far too simplistic to say slim=good, overweight=bad.

Weight needs to be treated as a side-effect not a cause. It's the unhealthy lifestyle that's the problem whatever form it takes and whatever results from it. Until weight is treated as a side-effect we'll still have the diet industry, extreme dieting, eating disorders, gastric-bypass surgery etc etc. None of these things are worth aiming for.

I'm not sure what I'd be in denial about. Do tell.

Weight, unless someone is at the extreme ends of the scale, is not a good way to ascertain a person's health. It's not complicated.

thunder that is why I used the phrase "all things being equal".

But lets be honest the vast majority of obese people don't get that way eating a balanced nutritious diet. They get that way because they over eat the worst sort of foods.

Someone who has a poor diet at 9 stone has the problems that having a poor diet brings.

Someone who has a poor diet at 13 stone has the the problems that having a poor diet brings in addition to the problems associated with being grossly overweight.

And you have separated out the problems of a poor diet and the problems of being overweight how exactly TQOTD?

Thunder "weight" might not be a good marker of health but "fat" is.

So if the scales tell you you are 14 stone but you are a professional rower and you look in the mirror an see lean muscle then all is well.

On the other hand if you weigh 10 stone and can grab the flab round your middle with both hands then you are fat and all is not well.

That is not complicated.

Leaving pregnancy aside the obesity problem in this country is a great concern and needs to be tackled. Not sure how, too softly softly and people won't take it in but if you come down too hard on people they will resent it and rebel.

My weight has crept up on me in the last year and although not officially overweight I look plump and feel so much better when I am smaller. It's easy to see how people put on weight I was at a pub recently and was looking at their menu on my iPhone app and there was only one dish under 1000 calories.

I asked an overweight relative if she wanted to lose weight with me but she refused because she feels healthy, despite having type 2 diabetes that started with pregnancy. There are so many more obese people around that it has become the norm to look overweight. The real problems will come when people reach their 60's, might not feel so healthy then.

"On the other hand if you weigh 10 stone and can grab the flab round your middle with both hands then you are fat and all is not well.

That is not complicated."

It's not complicated, you'd have to explain why it's right though.

Some problems are particular to being over weight - extra strain on the joints for example. Vitamin defficiency can be a problem in those with a poor diet whatever their weight. Extra strain on your joints is unlikely to trouble you if you are 9 stone.

But Custard, you said that talking about sticking fingers down the throat was denial crap. It was me who mentioned it. So what am I in denial about?

Thunder are you trying to say that it is healthy to have more than a handful of fat round your middle?

If not I don't understand the point you are trying to make

How heavy does a person have to be before joint strain is an issue.

Also joint strain whilst not pleasant is hardly high up on the list of health risks, not when you look at the real dangers of a poor diet, drinking too much, smoking etc.

I don't understand why people are so resistant to the idea that it's healthy living that should be promoted, not this illogical focus on people's size to the exclusion of all else.

QueenoftheDead, I"m saying you need to get over your fat hatred, because that story about grabbing handfuls of fat certainly sounds like exactly that, and start focusing on healthy lifestyles instead.

Anorexia/bulimia has no relevance at all to obesity.

I speak as an ex anorexic who later became overweight.

Saying that anorexia/bulimia is also unhealthy is totally irrelevant to saying obesity is unhealthy and is a red herring.

It is healthy to have a steady, healthy weight within the bmi guidelines for the vast majority of people.

Anyone who is obese and sequates becoming thinner with becoming anorexia is just plain stupid/in massive denial.

spugglers interesting point about it being the norm to look overweight.

I don't live in the UK and my sister just visited. She is a size 14. She commented that in the UK she never really feels overweight (although she knows she is) as compared to most of the people she comes into contact with she is similar or smaller.

I am smaller than her but here feel big because the norm is slim.

Forty percent of women are dieting at any one time. That's what fat hatred does to us:

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3454099.stm

Throw away the scales, eat healthily, take exercise, take care of yourself, and respect that your body will find the right weight for itself, but the weight isn't the issue, what you feed yourself and how you treat your body is the important thing.