AIBU ... to want to keep SIL at arm's length?

[Bobbymac]

I'm 51 and live in Durham with DH of 20 years and DD (11). SIL (45) and MIL live in London.

For 20 years, SIL has been dismissive and rather offhand with me (which I've ignored), and recently told me she has loathed me since the first day she met me.

From the outset, DH made it clear his sis has emotional problems (big history) and is very self-absorbed. Families are what they are, so I made a big effort with her. Then both SIL and MIL reacted badly to my longed-for PG, with MIL saying that through my relationship with DH, I'd split up her family (she reeled off a list of complaints from SIL about my character). Since then, to appease MIL, I have considered everything with "allowances for SIL" in mind - I've cut her a lot of slack, been supportive in her crises and bent over backwards to make her feel included (even took her on hols with us). I've been sympathetic through the moods, mystery illnesses and accidents (usually occurring when she can't deal with things or can't get what she wants). I have turned a blind eye to her and MIL's manipulations and at times have put SIL's needs above DD's! MIL will do anything to keep her happy and has always expected me to do likewise. I wish I'd taken a firmer line because now, after years of it, I feel like a doormat to a petulant child:

Since we moved from London, SIL refuses all invitations to visit us (we have to go to her), and then, because we can't visit often, she and MIL imply that we marginalise her. She has been increasingly rude to me, seems to delight in undermining my authority in front of DD (and steering DD to do likewise) and acts with total disrespect to DH and myself. It's like a game she plays. She was recently very OTT affectionate with DD, making out she has been cruelly separated from her "special girl" - and yet in the 7 years we lived in London, didn't once offer to read her a story or take DD out (it used to be as if DD was her rival for MIL's attentions).

During a recent abusive tirade, she railed at me aggressively, mocking my role as DD's mother, then suddenly changed tack, ran for DD and sobbed hysterically on her shoulder (as if I'd upset her!) I had to just sit there and take her personal insults, for fear of upsetting MIL and the whole apple cart. (She was a b*h and knows she can get away with it in front of her family). I managed to placate her but now the dust has settled, I've decided I don't want to see her again for a long time - I feel too demoralised.

The thing is, she is hinting that she intends to be DD's mentor and confidante . She seems to think this is her right, irrespective of what us parents think. (She has told DD that when she gets sick of her mother, SIL will be there for her). She also insisted on taking DD's mobile number and has been sending her intensely "chummy" texts.

I feel sorry that she has no kids, but I just don't trust her to act maturely with DD.

Obviously, there's alot to this, but for starters, AIBU to want to keep SIL at arm's length from DD and keep our visits to London to a minimum? (DH is fine with this). Do I lay down boundaries/ground rules? And what do I tell DD (who is totally beguiled with SIL)?

Smearedinfood - MIL insists her son and daughter were very close (though DH is completely flummoxed by this) and that I split them up. SIL also claimed that she and her brother are "more like twins". SIL apparently shut herself in her room and cried, on hearing I was PG - MIL said it was more because she couldn't stand me than anything else.

4 years later, SIL was also mortified when we told her we were moving (she actually turned pale).

They are utterly toxic. Just avoid them where possible. I actually feel a bit sorry for your SIL. If people hadn't allowed her to behave like that she might actually be a nicer person and have a life of her own.

Very sad.

Smearedinfood - MIL insists her son and daughter were very close (though DH is completely flummoxed by this) and that I split them up. SIL also claimed that she and her brother are "more like twins". SIL apparently shut herself in her room and cried, on hearing I was PG - MIL said it was more because she couldn't stand me than anything else.

4 years later, SIL was mortified when we told her we were moving from London(actually turned pale).

It all sounds quite scary.

It's a bit like why we live on the south coast and ILs live in Scotland.

I'd have a complete fit if anyone spoke to me like that in front of DC or not in front of DC.

And then they'd be chucked...pronto and probably for good.

That sounds awful! I did think as much Bobbymac - you faux twin breaker upperer .

Poor DP as well. What's his take on this? Does he take your corner?

It does sound like you have the patience of a saint so far!

There are at least 3 people at fault here.

Your SIL for 'hating you'
Your MIL for making sure she told you that SIL hated you

and lastly your DH for not telling the pair of them to wind it right back in and treat you and your family with some respect.

I think you have been accommodating enough. This mobile phone business is a joke, change that number asap and refuse to give it to SIL. This SIL is attempting to undermine you at every turn, both she and your MIL are using all means possible to manipulate you, even down to the illness, you are being terrorised by the pair of them.

Change numbers and screen calls. From now on, your DH has contact with them only.

Thanks for the support smearedinfood - you have no idea how much better I feel after today.

DH was appalled - he takes my corner but doesn't want to upset his Mum. It's also going to be very hard for DD to see MIL without SIL being involved (MIL would naturally invite her along and she lives nearby). DH is concerned at prospect of his mother not seeing her GD again.

Yanbu at all, they both sound toxic and nasty. You have been more tolerant and nicer than most of us on here, to the point that you sound a bit of a walkover. O would have nothing to do with them and keep dd far away from them and their toxic ways, unless they change for the better

Your SIL sounds like she has MH issues and needs professional help

yes piglet, and the MIL seems to be a contributory factor to those MH problems

She sounds nutso. I would personally get her in a corner, tell her in your most serious voice to keep the hell away from you, your husband and your duaghter or you will have her killed. Then smile sweetly and deny it if anyone asked but make a cut-throat sign to her when no-one is looking.

Yes she is probably one of those people who use their dc as a crutch and rely on them so much they never fly the nest. My cousin and his mum like that, h in his 50's and he lived with his mum tied onto her apron strings till she died last year.

She sounds like a complete fruit loop to me. I'd go with everyone elses advice and cut all contact and I would also change dd's mobile number

I think deep down she is a nice person, it's just that she has just never grown up emotionally. As a couple of people here have said, MIL over-protecting her hasn't helped.

She's still getting the heave-ho tonight.

No Bobby that can have a huge effect, but its not your problem. You do not have to put up with that shit, if MIL does not change her ways towards you, I suggest that your dd do not see her, as she will say nasty things to you and try and poison her mind, as she sounds very toxic. Yes I would change your dd telephone number too so she cannot pass on her toxic shit over the airwaves.

If she wants to see her gd then she'll have to change her behaviour. Put the onus on her as it is her fault anyway.

Keep strong x

"I think deep down she is a nice person"
I think you are the only one here who thinks that, Bobbymac. I think deep down she is a manipulative pig.

Change your daughters phone number, Im amazed you have put up with this nasty peice of work for so long.

Sorry if I missed this but can you not invite your MIL down to stay? I know SIL won't come, but would MIL, without her?

I was going to say exactly the same as Kelly200, change DDs phone no. and keep SIL away from her as much as possible.

Bobby, you are lovely. I cannot add any advice above what has been already said but I am amazed at your tolerance and understanding for your SIL. From the story you gave here, I really struggle to see how she is a good person, deep down or otherwise . What I do know is that you are more tolerant than me - if someone cried for days at the news of my pregnancy (wtaf?) and then confessed they always disliked me, I would not feel compelled at all to keep in touch.

Change DD's phone number, tell her why and do not waste any more energy on mad SIL. You will feel better for it. It is your job to set up boundaries, you have already been far too reasonable and understanding.

Just want to thank you guys for all the posts - it really has been like a weight lifted. Also, think DH may have had a look at some of this and I think it may have helped give him some perspective.

We had a chat with DD tonight and she is fine about not having any more direct contact with SIL. A firm letter is in progress. We'll probably invite MIL to stay with us, alone (she has done so before). I'm not planning on having any further contact with SIL and will be keeping DD away from her.

I so appreciate all the support and advice and it's good to know there are people out there willing to take the time to chip in. Thanks again.

I personally think a letter is a bad idea. don't write anything down as she will use it against you. Simply get your husband to tell her she is no longer welcome in your lives because she is disrespectful and her awful behaviour to you will not be tolerated anymore and that's it!

And don't male excuses for her - she is a bitch and nothing but a bitch

Okay - letter, email or phone call? I would feel liberated doing this myself but would it be better coming from DH?