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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to wonder if posters on here would refer to Islam as "a load of old tosh"..

420 replies

OhdearNigel · 22/09/2011 16:33

...in the same way that they think it is acceptable to ridicule Christianity. If a poster had started a thread about considering joining a mosque I wonder how many people would be prepared to post that Muslims were a bunch of bigoted fools due to their religious belief on homosexuality ? Or that a Hindu's beliefs were, to quote " a load of old tosh" ? If you don't think that would be alright to post, it's not alright to post it about Christianity either.

OP posts:
Cocoflower · 22/09/2011 23:54

TBh Im finding this thread, and the other religion bashing one quite distasteful in light that my old friends 5 year old has just died

She takes great comfort in believing in God and this is what will give her strength to get through this.

If anyone thinks they would like to maybe tell her she deserves ridicule or to be told she is stupid right now....

So no, this doesnt really matter about prawns when something like this happens. It makes you realsie how pointless all this fighting is.

TheBeast · 22/09/2011 23:55

@Sariah

So the Old Testament is tosh, having been superceded. Good, so no Creationism then.

"The law of chastity" - can you please direct me to where in the New Testament this is set out?

I'm still a bit worried that a kind and generous God would not make life easy by telling us exactly what we had to do to go to heaven.

In fact, what I was taught as a Christian was relatively clear: "Accept Jesus as your saviour and you would go to heaven no matter what evil you did"; none of this wishy-washy doing good in the meantime. The drawback of what I was taught was that if you didn't get your timing right you went straight to hell, as you did even if you never even heard of Jesus.

booyhoo · 22/09/2011 23:57

coco i think you need to step back from this. you have had a huge upset and this isn't what you need right now.

Sariah · 22/09/2011 23:59

I don't think we are fighting. Most of us are searching and are trying to figure out what its all about. None of us know for sure how it all began and the scientific theories are just that theories and tbh some of those are as unbelievable as some of the more obscure religious beliefs I have come across. You can be as religious as you like and fail to show compassion and love for your fellow man and you can have no faith in God but yet serve your fellow man. Personally I think you need to have the two and its a combination of faith and works that will help you reach your potential in this life and let you be at your happiest.

Cocoflower · 23/09/2011 00:00

You probably right.

I just suppose it makes all the sneering and ridicule seem rather evil in light of what has happened.

Just let people believe in what they want if it doesnt hurt you. Dont try and hurt them with nasty words. You never know when sometimes people need God to stop the pain, and if it stops the pain then so be it.

MillyR · 23/09/2011 00:06

Beast, your shellfish thing. Supposedly there is a part in the New Testament (not the gospels, a different bit) where Christians are told that they no longer have to follow some of the leviticus cleanliness laws. So they now can wear mixed fibres and eat shellfish, but still can't be gay.

Sariah · 23/09/2011 00:09

No, the beast, its not tosh its just that the Law of Moses was given as a first law. It was a harsh law and it is a law of Justice with no room for Mercy, an eye for an eye and all that. Circumcision would have been another part of this law as was the law of sacrifice. When Jesus died for us, the mosaic law was no longer practiced and so circumcision was not continued and the law of sacrfice was also discontinued as Jesus was the last sacrfice and now we remember his sacrifice through the partaking of the sacrament. This does not mean that the things in the old testament did not happen but that the higher law that Jesus brought to the people, ie turn the other cheek and ultimately- Love thy God with all thy soul and love thy neighbour as thyself beacame the Law. I guess that is why Jewish people still practice these laws as they do not recognise Jesus as the Son of God or the Messiah.

TimothyTheDog · 23/09/2011 00:15

Oh dear, not the shellfish again, that old chestnut!

Look, all the laws in Leviticus etc about eating shellfish, bodily discharges, sacrifices etc etc are MOSAIC, ie Old Testament Law. These laws were all made void by Christ's crucificion - he brought in a new covenant which abolished the old laws.

The trouble is that people with little theological knowlege take little bits of the Bible out of context and use them to base their arguments ridiculing Christianity. The shellfish one is a popular one. How do I know that this happens? Because I did exactly the same myself before I was converted. It's good for me to remember that before I get angry and judgemental, but have to admit I do wish that people who want to to ridicule my beliefs would find out what exactly it is that I believe first!

Spero · 23/09/2011 00:16

coco - I second the suggestion that if you are upset, this certainly isn't a good place for you.

But I have to say it is repulsive that you would seek to make a leap from a person's right to have freedom of expression about religion to suggest that those same people are somehow looking to piss all over a grieving mother.

I have said I don't care if people are offended by my views on religion - how does that mean I seek out people in real desparate pain and start laughing at them? If people want to debate the issue, they have got to be prepared to hear things they don't like. If they leave the debate, I don't hunt them down, come knocking on their doors and insist they listen to me.

Shame on you.

Cocoflower · 23/09/2011 00:18

Uncalled for spero

You actually made me feel quite sick

booyhoo · 23/09/2011 00:19

i can only speak for myself here but i definitelydont enter these discussions to sneer or ridicule.

i was born into a catholic family, taught in a presbyterian primary school, attended mass weekly until the age of 12, but i always knew that what i was taught, in mass and in school wasn't real. it wasn't a case of me choosing not to believe or just being awkward (thanks mum), i honestly thought that everyone else knew it was just stories. even before i knew santa wasn't real, i would listen to the stories in school and think, that's a nice story. and i really truly thought that everyone thought the same. i could'tbeleive itwhen i got to secondary school (catholic) and other pupils would be blessing themselves as we waked past the chapel.

to this day i still dont understand why people believe in a higher power which is why i do get involve in these types of discussions. i want o understand whypeople believeinwhat they do. as fr as i can tell, it's either "i just do" or "i get alot out of it" which is fine, who a i to say wy you should believe in smething. i'm hoping through sittingin on these types of threads i will ge a bit closer to an answer that isn't so vague.

MillyR · 23/09/2011 00:21

The bit in the New Testament is in Acts 10.

Cocoflower · 23/09/2011 00:22

"how does that mean I seek out people in real desparate pain and start laughing at them"

Yet you in this very thread are calling someone "repulsive" and they should feel "shame". YOU have seeked me out, who is going through pain to write such an awful message to make me feel like shit on purpose

Happy you made someone cry? I hope MN removes both these posts. You awful, awful person

Sariah · 23/09/2011 00:25

I was brought up in an athiest home but went to a catholic school. I can remember talking to me Dad when I was a teenager and saying to him, how could people believe in God. I thought it was only for those who needed a crutch in life and who could not cope with the realities of life and death. Even though he was an athiest, I remember him saying to me, not to knock peoples faiths that no one knows what lies ahead of them and that some people got comfort etc from their faiths. It always perplexed him that otherwise seemingly intelligent people could have so much faith in something that he couldnt get his logical mind around. I still find it hard to get my head around the things I can not see ie God and Jesus but I love the principles that Gospel teaches and I know that since I have put them into practice my life has become much more straightforward and of a much better quality.

booyhoo · 23/09/2011 00:25

coco you aren't in a good place to be dealing with this right now. please think about hiding the thread. you aren't being kind to yourself by staying on and reading this.

MillyR · 23/09/2011 00:27

Timothy the dog, I think you have to separate your beliefs from the beliefs of Christians in general. I was brought up within a denomination that has the same teachings as you refer to about the crucifixion. But not all denominations believe that; some do still use old testament laws, just not the shellfish ones and similar because of them being specifically mentioned in the new testament.

SlackSally · 23/09/2011 00:28

Erm, Cocoflower. You suddenly threw the curveball about your friend's tragic situation into the thread.

You can't blame everyone else for not knowing about it. You were on here discussing religion with everyone else.

And actually, it DOES read as though you are using the situation to win points. No one else could have done - they didn't know about it.

Cocoflower · 23/09/2011 00:29

You think I would use someone death to SCORE POINTS

I am speechless

THIS IS THE LOWEST I HAVE EVER SEEN MUMSNET

Meteorite · 23/09/2011 00:29

TheBeast
a) a Christian is someone who has decided to follow Jesus.
b) The teachings of Jesus in a nutshell were to love God and love our neighbour as ourselves.

"What do you actually believe in that (a) makes you a Christian and (b) is worth spreading by whatever means?"

Spero · 23/09/2011 00:29

coco - I don't think you need any help from me to feel bad about what you are posting.

I am not going to apologise for being angry about the link you have tried to draw.

Cocoflower · 23/09/2011 00:31

There is something deeply wrong with you

SlackSally · 23/09/2011 00:32

I said it reads like that, yes.

YOU mentioned it out of the blue. YOU accused someone else of making you cry.

I assume this is because you are very upset and not thinking straight.

Meteorite · 23/09/2011 00:32

Loving your questions TheBeast :o You're very consise :)

Please stop waffling and let us know which of the following are true:

  1. Creationism - it's a metaphor. The order of events is the same as evolution.
  2. Virgin Birth - quite possible
  3. The resurrection - true
  4. Eternal life -true
  5. Reincarnation - untrue
  6. Heaven - yep
  7. Hell - equals separation from God (love)
  8. Purgatory - nope
  9. Your belief is the only true belief - I believe it's true, and that other religions have a lot in common with my own beliefs, with a few differences.
Spero · 23/09/2011 00:33

I remain shocked that you would chose to make the link you have. And even more shocked that you can't seem to see it and would rather make this all about my terribleness as a person.

So be it.

Meteorite · 23/09/2011 00:34

Is eating prawns wrong? Only if you don't heat them through thoroughly...

Swipe left for the next trending thread