Private companies running classes in state schools, DD can't go because we are poor, AIBU to complain??

[PollyPeppa]

We are below the poverty line as we have 3 DC's and DH and I are full time uni students. We worked in low paid jobs and decided enough was enough and are now hoping to get better ones after university.

DD's school had just started up after school Spanish club. We sent her along to the trial session and she loved it. We had foolishly assumed there would be a concessionary rate (as there usually is with after school clubs) but there is not as it is run by a private company so we can't afford for her to go again.

I feel this is very unfair to offer this as only children whose parents can afford to send them can go, I think it creates a divide in the 'state' system.

Personally as an ex teacher who used to teach in deprived areas I'd rather any spare tax went on teaching parents to talk and read to their children instead of hiding behind mobiles and X Boxes all day.

I'd also like any spare cash to go towards helping children with poor literacy become literate,Rolls Royce Spanish lessons for all I'll pass on thanks.

Anyhow surely Mandarin would be far more useful for todays kids to be learning.

it wouldn't be an efficient use of funds to pay for 7 spanish lessons if the parents can't afford to carry on spanish lessons once this class is finished

While I totally agree on the importance of supporting "disadvantaged" children and providing them with support in breaking out of the cycle. Are the OPs children truly disadvantaged, or are the family just temporarily hard up. Many people are tightening belts, many children are moving onto FSM, many families are making decisions on what they can and cannot afford. Does it make them all disadvantaged? Or is the children in the categories mentioned earlier in the thread? Single disabled mum with five children under 8, terminally ill dad, living in a refuge due to DV, etc.

These are private lessons.

They will be attended by a minority.

Not all the children who attended them will be from well off families.

The children that do not attend will not be disadvantaged.

This OP is NOT about the plight of the poor.

It is about somebody wanting something 'extra' for her kids and she cant afford it at the moment.

Its not the Road to fecking Wigan Pier FFS.

I live in the arse end of East London. I have lots of kids, a disabled OH and a disabled DS. We are on a low income.

Our finacial situation is precarious.

I work with families who live in one room and have no recourse to public funds. Kids who dont have toys and kids who cant go out because they cant get a wheelchair.

I spend a lot of time thinking about the plight of poor children and a put fair bit of effort into trying to do something about it.

I still dont think this OP is about poverty. Its about somebody wanting something she cannot afford at the moment. Not a necessity, not even one of those things that we dont need but help to stop kids feeling excluded - birthday parties, a nice new coat, a decent haircut.

The only difference between these Spanish Lessons and the Kumon maths classes that I cant afford is the Spanish Lessons are in rented space in a school.

Spanish is available in many high schools now.

I agree about Mandarin - possibly much more challenging though.

bumbleymummy Fri 16-Sep-11 20:58:44

It's hardly essential education though Electra. How exactly is basic Spanish going to get them out of the poverty cycle exactly?

Well, we'll never find out now so what does it matter?

This thread disgusts me. Education should be free - particularly to children.

Education is free for children. If they want to a a 7 week spanish course which realistically is more for fun than anything else then they have to pay in this case.

The child is still getting an education though. She will still get a chance to learn MFL at secondary school age, if not younger.

Education is free - the school is not saying we won't teach your child to read if you don't pay. This is an extra class, which hardly any children will be taking. This is on top of education and is no different to art club, football club or dancing.

Stuck education is free,over priced unnecessary language lessons however thankfully are not.

Learning a foreign language is NOT comparable to pony riding or football or any other hobby.

It's not about one set of Spanish lessons though is it?

Learning a foreign language is good, which is why they get to do it for free at school.

" Education should be free - particularly to children" errr???? It is.
Or if you mean all the private clubs how do you expect swimming teachers, langauge teachers, karate teachers, dancing teachers, etc. to earn a living? Or do you expect them to do it out of the goodness of their hearts for the children. Then what happens to their children? They really would be below the poverty line if a parent is expected to work for free.

I would argue that the reason most people don't do these lessons is because they aren't interested in studying them. As I said earlier so many children don't want to do extra lessons.

You know, just in case it slipped by anyone's attention, even the OP didn't expect it to be free.

."Learning a foreign language is NOT comparable to pony riding or football or any other hobby."
StuckInTheMiddleWithYou - is that because people don't play football as a job? or dance or play any sport professionally?

FWIW i speak spanish fluently, other than ordering food on holiday it has been of no use to me in everyday life at all.

After-school activities can be free because staff give their time for free and the school doesn't pass any of the overheads to the parents.
If a private company uses the school premises to offer language classes obviously they won't be free. If they were using the local village hall as a venue then probably there wouldn't be the same accusations of unfair treatment.

I will probably get flamed for this but I cant believe you would be so irresponsible to deliberatley put yourself below the poverty line with three children so you can BOTH go to uni at the same time. And then to crow about being poor? WTF?

For the FIFTH and final time we have more money now than when we were both working minimum wag. Read the thread before making cretinous ill informed comments

yes, very irresponsible to want to be better qualified so you can do a better job of providing for your family.

When did MN get so mean minded and judgmental?

wage

Good god. Does nobody have a broader sense of perspective here?

Who thinks the Germans or the Spanish or the French are offering voluntary "after school" English language lessons after school to only those primary school children who can afford it?

My daughters are in a mid range independent school and guess what - they have been studying Spanish and French since the age of seven - and the same will be going on in independent schools across the country - but just because this government is so backward, modern foreign languages are not even compulsory in the state sector until GCSE. So hardly anyone from the state sector gets to study MFL at university. It is outrageous.

But there are some constructive things you can do OP instead of just moaning. How about e.g:

• getting together with some other keen parents and seeing if you can collaborate with a local independent school - they are desperate to justify their charitable status - research their websites to see what their "charitable" collaborations are, build some momentum and and see whether you can put together a proposal;
• target a few big employers e.g. Barclays capital, PWC, KPMG - all desperate to demonstrate their sense of "corporate social responsibility", especially after the riots etc - and plead for a subsidy to enable your school to offer Spanish to all - link up with another school?
• get your daughter a Spanish pen friend, listen to a Spanish online pop station etc etc

If it really matters to you, do something about it.

So if you are better off financially now then why are you moaning about having to pay for an activity? If you want your child to do it that much then take it out of the tax credits or child benefit

Very few people make their living as a professional footballer. It's hardly comparable.

Knowledge of a foreign language is not only useful for ordering food on holiday, but it improves language skills in general; mainly because it forces you to think about grammer in general and even makes parts of the English vocabulary more comprehensible. That's before you even get to the possibility of using a foreign language in a work or academic environment.

Foreign languages should be taught right from the beginning of primary school.