AIBU to think Bs at GCSE are ok?

[catwalker]

Some issues with DS and GCSEs/6th form. He didn't get the grades he was predicted (As and As) but then I didn't expect him to as he doesn't put much effort into anything apart from his x box. He got mainly Bs, a couple of As, a couple of Cs and a couple of Ds. I was quite happy until I started reading the secondary education forum where people are tearing their hair out because their dc's didn't get straight As and may have blown their oxbridge chances. I get the impression that anything less than an A just isn't worth the paper it's written on. He could have done loads better but Bs are OK aren't they?

sun, 'hands off' on the school front doesn't mean hands off a DC's life -very different. I use the term to mean not being overly interventionist, scanning coursework, micro-managing uni courses and choices etc. The antithesis of 'pushy' in effect. I don't use the term to mean disinterested, not one bit.

Xenia has smartened up the spelling and grammar almost unrecognisably in the past couple of days, but nothing she says is internally inconsistent, indeed 'plenty of [state school children] do fairly well' is completely consistent. And quite funny as well.

No, it just depends on the day and topic and post.

There are a lot of topics I never write about so people don't hear those views and may be those have come out on this thread. As for typos it just depends on how fast I am typing and what I write . My spelling is always very good but I don't bother to check for typos which is a very different issue.

There may well be people who cannot iamgine that any man or any woman who works full time can possibly like children. That's just a myth put out by sexists and housewives. Many many good parents work full time just as plenty of useless people who hate children become housewives.

I also think children sometimes need the chance to be themselves and we have the privilege of observing them and borrowing them as the poem says.

Back to the issue, every parents needs to find a balance that works with a particular child in terms of hands on or hands off. Children most like contented parents so it's often worth working on your own contentment and seeing achieving that as a gift to the child rather than seeing it necessarily as selfishness, within reason.

I thnk if you bring them up well when they are little and give them the tools to take wise decisions then you can let them loose abroad alone as they get older and know that whatever scrap they get into (and we want them to have scrapes as it's only by getting out of scrapes they can learn to look after themselves) they have the resilience to get out of it. Eg I think one of mine may be planning a train across Syria shortly which given its uprising may be a little difficult but I am content to leave her to it. Another seems to be taking everything apart at the moment and putting it back together and I am letting him get on with it,.

There may well be people who cannot iamgine that any man or any woman who works full time can possibly like children. That's just a myth put out by sexists and housewives.

Sometimes it seems that what you're trying to say has some sense to it, Xenia. But why do you express things in this way?

sexists and houseswives

OMFG!

How can you imagine you're doing yourself or anyone else any favours when you say these things?

I think that I would agree with everything that you say Xenia-if you changed your language.

Yellow, no. I don't think either applicant self-selection or our selection processes are infallible. But I think the happy people at Oxbridge could probably be thus described. Anyone thin-skinned or in search of a calm and rounded life is very truly happier elsewhere.

Just look at All Souls - Oxford only. Virtually all male. Nobody there teaches more than 16 hours a YEAR. 90 k per annum plus housing allowances. All your energy can be focused on you and your research. Neurosis guaranteed. Vampires preferred. Hiring now.

I could cite quite a few (?dozens of?) sweeping negative generalisations ("sneery" statements) made by Xenia in the past about State education. EG:

"There's little a mother can do better for her chidlren in the UK than choosing a career when enables her to pay school fees."

I agree with a lot of what Xenia says, particularly about taking a hands off approach as the children get older.

Not so sure about private always being the b-all and end all, though.

If the 6% of children at private schools get 50% of the best university places and 83% of the judiciary and whatever it is of the cabinet and poistions of power etc etc how can my statement be wrong - "There's little a mother can do better for her chidlren in the UK than choosing a career when enables her to pay school fees.""

paying school fees is the easy bit. no effort needed at all, just sign the cheque.

being there for your children is more important.

money is not everything xenia to you it maybe but not to others,

are school fees so easy to pay,i always thought beyond means of most?
and yes folk blaber on on m how they cut back to pay fees and i l always think whaaaaaaat £13k handbags and holidays and fripperies who spends that?

cutting back is no waitrose,go tesco
no fancy smellies but those in themselves wont pay a set of school fees,surely

They are about £10k a year. Given most people have 2 children that is likely to be the net salary of one half of the couple - wife goes back to work full time on £35k a year and I would imagine that would pay school fees.

Most parents at private schools tend to be pretty good at giving their chidlren attention and helping which is why you may be not that bright but still do well at a private school because the parental stuff at home tends to be superior too.
Mst working mothers and fathers put a lot of time and effort into their chidlren and plenty of housewives site around being there but not interacting because they are lazy or depressed. Just beacause you are home on a fat or thin bottom all day does not mean you interact with children and I've been working all day but still found time to work with some of the children in ivy clearance - we were swiming on massive vines from trees like tarzan. As they are at private school they get longer holidays so interact with parents even more Win win all round.

more than £10k in glasgow and edinburgh for private school

I just tried to look up the Haberdashers girls' fees herts but the site seems to be down. From memory it's not that much over £10k a year and for one of the best schools for A level results in England. Inner London can be more expensive. Boys' schools can be a bit m ore. Day schools attached to boarding schools can be more expensive. Manchester grammar is just under £10k a year.

I haven't read all 30 pages, but I do hope someone has pointed out that getting into uni is not just about grades. They are just the start. You have to show your commitment to your chosen area of study, you need work experience, a good interview etc etc. We should be encouraging the development of well-rounded teenagers, not just straight-A kids with little more to them.

And if this thread is going to descend into uni wars, please consider how much merit there is in league tables. What does best mean to you? I work in higher education, and the best advice I can give is find the right course first. Then, if you need to decide between two or more HEIs, look at their graduate employment levels and their results in the National Student Survey. But,when looking at the NSS results, also consider the response rate. A uni can have 99 per cent student satisfaction, but on closer inspection, you might find that only 60 per cent of the previous year's grads took part. Other places with have lower ratings on a higher response rate. And others (like my employer) have a high response rate and a high result - giving a fairly accurate picture of performance. The students are the customers - listen to them.

A degree from Oxford or Cambridge isn't going to be much use if it doesn't lead to a career you will enjoy and excel in.

Gosh, from what I remember of my private school, about 10% of the sixth form was off to the Priory for various stress/depression/drug/eating disorders, which is probably fab nowadays, because as well as going to all those "meet the old girls at Oxbridge/working in Law/banking etc." away days, you can widen your horizons by meeting loads of celebs too.

Okay Xenia Haberdasher's girls is cheap! I never realised, the girls schools around here are £4000 minimum and £5000 for most (that is 11+) plus extras.
The local co-ed minor public school is £10000.
Which is why lots of us cannot afford private schools.

Well people inHE though need to ensure students are told that in many careers, usually the best careers and the best paid ones there is pecking order and it might be the b est lo viest most appreciated course ni the country at Middlesex Poly but that will totally close off XYZ career to you because it's not in the top 10 universities. All the satisfiaction in student life in the world is not much comfort if you wanted to get a jobs at ABC and that is now denied to you.

Well mt plenty of parents move where their chidlren will best be educated and make that sacrifice. In fact virtually all schools with the best A levels are in the SE amazingly which is really strange. I don't understand it. Okay you get the odd school ike Manchester Grammar out of London which is good but the vast majority state and private with the best A levels are in the SE> Perhaps we need to add to advice that the best thing a mother can do is work full time earning over £100k a year in terms of best benefit to her children but also move to the SE where the chidlren will get jobs, higher aspirations and the best schools.

Gosh Xenia if I had to move my family back to the SE where I grew up I'm sure my kids would all be desperate to do Tourism GCSE as a form of mental escape. They love having the sea at the end of the garden.

MGS is far from alone in being a beacon of excellence outside the SE, there are plenty of excellent schools scattered around. I thought MCS in Oxford had just won the top accolade anyhow, that would be a far pleasanter place to live than the fringes of London.

Casper why do you suppose straight-A kids have little to them? Good grades and other talents are hardly mutually exclusive. And why would a degree from Oxford or Cambridge hinder a student particularly in facilitating his chosen career? I don't quite get the thinking.

It's all changed hasn't it?? I got, at GCSE, 6 As, 1 B and 3 Cs. At "A" level 1 A and 2 Bs. A 2:1 degree from a Russell Group (didn't know it was before joining this site!) university.

I thought grade B was OK! You live and learn...

Sorry I did'nt mean easy to pay for those who do not earn great money [ie ME] I meant if you earn the money all it is is signing a cheque being a great parent is far more than money can buy.

And I have not read anything Xenia has said so excuse me if something has been covered.

"All the satisfiaction in student life in the world is not much comfort if you wanted to get a jobs at ABC and that is now denied to you."

What utter tosh. Employers want people who can do the job, they don't care where you studied - just that you know your subject. The NSS is not about "student life". It's not about how much you enjoyed getting drunk every night for three/four years. It rates teaching, facilities, student support, assessment and much, much more. With the changing financial climate in HE, it is more important than ever that students find and choose the right course. If they want to be journalists, they should study journalism instead of wasting time with a more general arts degree just to get Oxbridge on their CV. There are more than 130 higher education institutions in the UK - do you honestly believe that people can only get good jobs by going to one of the top 10?

As as I said before, which top 10 do you choose? Top 10 for graduate employment? Top 10 for student satisfaction? Top 10 for having the most students from private secondaries? League tables are extremely hollow.

yellowstone. I didn't say that all straight A students are not well-rounded. Just that in some instances the student with the lower grades might be preferable for entry to a course because they are judged to be more suitable. Of course, it's imperative these days to get top grades and work experience/background knowledge. If you want to go to vet school, you can have all the As in the world, but you won't get in unless you can demonstrate both compassion for and wider knowledge of animals

I have seen too many prospective students who think grades alone will get that what they want, and that is just not true. And too many parents who phone up to complain that their PFB has got straight As, so "why were they rejected from the course?", when actually the child in question had no interest in - and therefore no knowledge of - the subject.

Too many helicopters whizzing around these parts, so I am off. OP - just rest assured that if your son works out what he wants to do, and can realistically achieve all that he needs to get there, he'll do just fine. And once he has reached his first or second graduation job (should he choose the university path) his GCSE and A-level grades, and in some cases the strength of his degree, will no longer even factor when he is being interviewed for new positions. Good luck to you and him.

CurlyCasper, I wish that what you are saying is true. Top law firms, top accountancy firms, top investment banks etc are staffed mostly by people who went to "Top Ten" universities. They tend to recruit from the same places. IME they don't care about the relative quality of courses.

'if your son works out what he wants to do, and can realistically achieve all that he needs to get there, he'll do just fine'.

That's reassuring then!

In some jobs employers and selectors will look back to degree (provenance and class), A Levels and GCSE's, even after several post graduation jobs. I do.

That's right grovel because some institutions are perceived to be more rigorous than others and better at producing graduates who can think, and think originally.