To be cross with my nanny?

[Maria101]

I have my own internet business and work from home. I have a part time nanny who comes three days a week to look after my 1-year-old. She's generally great, however, at the start of the summer holidays she mentioned (didn't really ask) she might have to bring her 6-year-old son along some days. Tbh I didn't mind this, as she made it sound like an occasional thing, and my daughter likes him and likes having other children around.

However, she started bringing him every single time. During my baby's nap times instead of cleaning the bottles/high chair, making meals etc, like she did before, she would sit and read to him on my sofa while I was working in the next room. Also, all their activities would involve going to the park etc, instead of going to playgroups (presumably because he would get bored). Other things bothered me, such as once my daughter messed her nappy just as the nanny arrived with her son, who wanted toast. She said to me, 'You deal with that (the nappy), while I make him (her son) some toast'. Stupidly I did, even though she had technically started work.

Last week I told her not to bring her son anymore because it's too distracting having him here in the house while I try to work. She was OK about it, and didn't bring him, but today I got a text at 8.30 (she's due here at 9) asking if she could bring him because her sister couldn't have him. She suggested picking my daughter up and taking her to her house. But surely this is childminding? Plus, I had purposefully left some jobs for her to do in nap time (make a shepherds pie). I said not to worry so now I don't have any childcare today.

I'm fuming. My main problems are: a) I don't want her son in my house when I'm trying to work, but equally I don't want my daughter out every single day (her initial solution to my finding her son too distracting). b) I want her to work during my daughter's nap times, and not play with her son or do her own housework (which she'd probably do if my daughter went to her house). c) she treats our arrangement like a casual agreement between friends, when I'm paying her to do a job. For example, there was no apology this morning for letting me down and making me work tonight after my daughter has gone to bed (if I don't work during the day it has to get done at some point).

Should I a) just cancel our contract and look for another childminder/nanny? Tackle it head on Monday morning and then have the awkwardness that would follow?

Sorry for the rant, but I'm furious! PS, I know part of this is my fault for being too laid back with her in the first place but for the most part she's a good nanny but she seems to be getting worse and taking the pi**.

Thanks Cinnabar

Never having been involved with Nannies etc. I didn't know how it worked.

My best friend does what we call "family day care"

She has up to five DC per day (less if she has any SN DC)

Before she began, she had to go to Council run courses, first aid courses (updated every two years) and her home inspected by the council.

She takes the DC to a playgroup once a week, specifically for "family day care families"

She supplies all food, nappies etc.

Childminders earning 4x as much as nannies? That'd be 80-100k then?

OP YANBU, you are not getting the service you are paying for.

However it would be nice to afford your nanny some flexibility, but you would need to sit down and discuss and set boundaries, e.g. Ocassionally if she has childcare issues she can bring her son, but she'd be paid at a reduced rate and you'd still expect x,y and z to be done on those days.

Your nanny is wrong to just assume it's ok to bring her dc in when it isn't a formal arrangement, but you agreed to the odd time and now you aren't telling her that she is now taking the mick!

If it's in your nanny's contract to do chores when the baby sleeps then she really should do them and not entertain her own ds. However it seems a little unfair that the nanny is expected to work through nap times under usual circumstances and not get a break at all! I don't know all the circumstances and the hours she's expected to work though so I may be talking out of turn!

I also agree that it is difficult working as a nanny with a parent at home, my last nanny job was the dh working from home and the dw was off work for 2 months between jobs and just lay around the house while I cleaned around her! It was awful! So on that basis I don't blame your nanny for wanting to get out of the house and have some breathing space. I'm sure you don't watch over her,and I appreciate you're working, but as a nanny you can't help but feel like this is the case when the parent is at home!

I think you definitely need to have a sit down with her and talk to her about what you need from her, and also what she needs from you. That way there won't be misunderstandings of what both of you were expecting! You are her boss after all!

This seems to have gone on for several weeks.
Most of you say your own bossed would not be impressed if you were to take your child to work, understandably. But most people get annual leave and spend this time with their children and have wrap around childcare and holiday play schemes around this. When is the nanny's annual leave?

bosses, not bossed.

(what is wrong with this spellchecker...)

General rule of thumb is that nannies get 4 weeks of annual leave, 2 weeks to be taken at a time of the employer's choosing and 2 weeks at a time of the nanny's choosing. In practice, we've never had any issues agreeing holiday times that all of us were happy with.

I think you need to make it clear what your expectations are as so far I don't think this is clear to your nanny.

If you can negotiate a mutually acceptable arrangement for the holidays thats great, if not get a new nanny.

I had a nanny like this. Her mother had died before she started with us and she asked if she could pick her younger brother (7) up from school and bring him back to ours.

I felt sorry for her and said yes and we eventually had her brother there every day after school and all the holidays as her father worked. We did have issues when she started bringing him when he was off sick and also took my son who was ill out to his school sports day!

I think you need to have a chat with your nanny and set our your expectations more clearly.

exoticfruits, most nannies are expected to do nursery duties which means cooking for their charges, keeping the playroom clean and doing laundry and ironing for their charges. You wouldn't expect cooking, laundering and cleaning for the bosses (ie parents) to be done by the nanny unless the nanny is specifically employed as a nanny housekeeper and those tend to earn more. The last NannyTax annual survey showed that there was a significant trend in nannies beginning to do more of these type of chores/duties because people were trying to cut down on costs and eg getting rid of the cleaner. (My cleaner tells me that she has a lost quite a few jobs because of people cutting back).

I agree about the need for flexibility in an employer/employee relationship and of course that would include being accommodating in emergency situations but if that becomes the "norm" to bring the child to work every day that would not be acceptable to me at all.

Lots of people have had to make their nannies redundant over the past 3/4 years due to job losses and other costs rising. As a result, afaik its an employers market, so I don't think it would be particularly hard to get another nanny.

Oh well, it was nice to talk amongst ourselves :)

Novice - it might be an employers market in some areas of the country but not in others - and even if it is... a nanny that is both good and happy to have a parent working from home is a rare beast. I wouldn't be so quick to tell someone her nanny is easily replaceable.

ChippingIn!

There are worse paid jobs than nannying and people who do those jobs have to find the money for childcare. If her pay is that bad wouldn't tax credits cover most of it anyway?

ChippingIn, yup I see your point about the "market" being different in different types of the country. I hear constantly of people not being happy but are too afraid that they will never get another nanny. I think that's not true (in most walks of life actually) and that people shouldn't be afraid to discuss poor behaviour, discipline or find a new nanny because they are worried. I am only speaking from my personal experience but I work from home, made it clear from the outset, didn't have a problem filling my nanny position and in the end had 3 very good candidates to choose from. I didn't mean to make it sound like the OPs nanny could be easily replaced, more that its not impossible.

It wasn't at all clear from OP if shepherd's pie was just for the DC and part of duties, or for whole family and not anything to do with being a nanny.
I think it might be a huge area of misunderstanding, unless clearly in a contract from the start.

I used to make shepherds pie for the kids and extra for the mum and dad. They appreciated it. MInd you, in all my nanny jobs I always did more than was in my contract.

I've been a nanny in the past and am now of course a parent too. I think the nanny is being unreasonable and disagree with Nanny1 that it was ok for her to "tell" her employer "you change the nappy while I make my son toast". It's inappropriate and suggests that while she is there she is going to put her sons needs before OPs daughter, not saying that she would but it probably made OP feel like that.

To say that the OP ought to be more flexible about the nanny's childcare arrangements is unreasonable too. She is being paid to do a job. I would never routinely take my child into work and assume it was ok. I have the most wonderfully considerate employer but I would still never take the P*. Why is this any different? To suggest that the OP is being overly precious about this is unfair. She is feeling that the needs of her child are not being put first. If this were me I would ask the nanny for a meeting and lay out my concerns and set some boundaries. That might be all that is needed and the nanny might be grateful for the clarity.

I don't know about the shepherds pie and the lunchbreak issue. I suppose if the dd sleeps for quite a long time in the middle of the day then it is reasonable for the OP to expect the nanny to do a job at some point during that time.

Hope you can sort it out!

Thanks for all your replies. To clear a few things up, the pie was for my baby (not me and my husband - I'd never ask her to do that). Nannies make food for the babies/children they're looking after, that's pretty normal. And she works half a day, so I'm not denying her a lunchbreak. She finishes at lunchtime, hence I want her to do stuff during my baby's morning nap which lasts an hour. It's fine for her to have a cup of tea and watch TV if she gets other bits done first (during baby's naptime).

You have your part time nanny make pie for your one year old baby?

Yes, what's wrong with that? I make most of her food, but also expect my nanny to make up some meals for her too. Nannies are nearly always required to make food for the children they care for. You make it sound weird, unusual or precious but it isn't.

Shepherd's pie - seems OK to me as long as she has enough time to do it, and still grab a cup of tea and a minute to herself during the morning !

I am just curious. Apple pie? Or a savoury pie? Not that it matters. I am just surprised that a 1 year old baby likes pie, that is all. And, not being a great pie cook myself, I just imagine it takes a while, and if she is part time, from 9 till lunch, there is very little time to make pie? Especially if baby only sleeps an hour? But, never mind me, I just found it a bit puzzling.

You can easily make shepherd's pie in under an hour and read a magazine while it's cooking! Mash it up a bit, shove it in a few baby-sized pots and whack in the fridge.

She only has your dd for 3 hours a day 3 days a week. In that case yabu to not show some flexibility. Although she is bu for not asking you.

No, not three hours - between 8.30am and 1.30am, so five hours. Anyway, we're getting bogged down in detail people! Thanks for your replies and for all your advice.

You are right, and I am sorry.

I was asking about her annual leave earlier. As, if she had two weeks holiday, it might have been easier for her to find playschemes on either side of her leave, so minimizing on the time she had to bring her own child into work. Must be pretty boring for the boy also.