To be cross with my nanny?

[Maria101]

I have my own internet business and work from home. I have a part time nanny who comes three days a week to look after my 1-year-old. She's generally great, however, at the start of the summer holidays she mentioned (didn't really ask) she might have to bring her 6-year-old son along some days. Tbh I didn't mind this, as she made it sound like an occasional thing, and my daughter likes him and likes having other children around.

However, she started bringing him every single time. During my baby's nap times instead of cleaning the bottles/high chair, making meals etc, like she did before, she would sit and read to him on my sofa while I was working in the next room. Also, all their activities would involve going to the park etc, instead of going to playgroups (presumably because he would get bored). Other things bothered me, such as once my daughter messed her nappy just as the nanny arrived with her son, who wanted toast. She said to me, 'You deal with that (the nappy), while I make him (her son) some toast'. Stupidly I did, even though she had technically started work.

Last week I told her not to bring her son anymore because it's too distracting having him here in the house while I try to work. She was OK about it, and didn't bring him, but today I got a text at 8.30 (she's due here at 9) asking if she could bring him because her sister couldn't have him. She suggested picking my daughter up and taking her to her house. But surely this is childminding? Plus, I had purposefully left some jobs for her to do in nap time (make a shepherds pie). I said not to worry so now I don't have any childcare today.

I'm fuming. My main problems are: a) I don't want her son in my house when I'm trying to work, but equally I don't want my daughter out every single day (her initial solution to my finding her son too distracting). b) I want her to work during my daughter's nap times, and not play with her son or do her own housework (which she'd probably do if my daughter went to her house). c) she treats our arrangement like a casual agreement between friends, when I'm paying her to do a job. For example, there was no apology this morning for letting me down and making me work tonight after my daughter has gone to bed (if I don't work during the day it has to get done at some point).

Should I a) just cancel our contract and look for another childminder/nanny? Tackle it head on Monday morning and then have the awkwardness that would follow?

Sorry for the rant, but I'm furious! PS, I know part of this is my fault for being too laid back with her in the first place but for the most part she's a good nanny but she seems to be getting worse and taking the pi**.

OP sorry haven't read the whole thread but yanbu. There is a company called Nanny Plus One (or something similar) where you pay for a nanny at a reduced rate because they bring their child too, and suits both parties - you could suggest to her that for days she is bringing her son along that you will expect an appropriate discount but that these days are to be limited to x number (as suits) to ensure that the job role suits your expectations as well. I am sure she isn't intentionally taking the piss and if you are happy with her generally then it's probably best to sort it out and don't worry about any uncomfortableness afterwards, I am sure it would be short lived - good luck and sorry if this has already been suggested, didn't have time to read all the posts! But you are the boss and also I think you are right in that if she takes your dd to her house, that's childminding and if she isn't registered or insured then this also raises issues. I think as a nanny you can have the child in your own home for a max of 2 or 3 hours a day. This could have changed now though

YANBU, this isnt the basis you employed your nanny on.

If you really wantto keep her then I would sit down and say that she can bring her child in the hols providing she still attends x groups and does the jobs she is meant to do and takes a decent cut in wages to compensate that care is no longer one to one.

Personally, i'd find a new nanny and dismiss the old one whilst she still has under 12 months service.

nannyl, I don't accept that its all part of employing parents and if you spouted that nonsense in other workplaces it wouldn't get you very far either. In real life if one wants to a) get taken seriously and b) not piss off your colleagues all parents make damn sure to take responsibility for ensuring that their care issues are not the issue of their employer or their colleagues. Eg you don't see children in the office or the fire station or hospital just because its the summer and their parent has childcare issues. If something goes wrong, then people take a day or two annual leave off and then sort something out pretty quickly. Bringing your child to work continuously to disrupt your ability to do a proper job or disrupt your boss/colleagues is just not even an option. Why should this nanny and employer be any different? Also, nannies are the most expensive of all childcare options but people who go for that option do so because it affords the greatest flexibility to the employer parent and means you get to say exactly how you want child's day to be structured. If you're paying a premium for this, then that's what you should get.

I agree with Nanny. I am a childminder and my sister has a nanny so I see it from both angles.

I think she sounds nice and I think you'd be cutting off your nose so to speak,however the saying goes.

She listens to your requests,she's clearly experienced and your child gets to play with other children. You also have her doing housework when she should be having a break.

Nannies do get paid shit wages and many will have children which they will be unable to pay childcare for.

In my experience the most successful childcare arrangements are those that involve flexibility on both sides.I don't think you're being flexible.

If you change to a childminder your dc will be minded with other children anyway and said childminder will be taking a well earned rest during naptime anyway.You could go for a younger nanny that your child has never met but it's very disruptive and personally as a mum I'd favour a nanny who is experienced.

If it was me I'd perhaps except that during the holidays things will be slightly different.As a compromise you could say look I know there is a childcare issue how about you bring him 3 days but not 2. You also need to ensure she has an hour for lunch and a couple of tea breaks.No way would I want anybody looking after my dc all day without breaks at opportune moments like naptime.I couldn't do it with my own so I wouldn't expect anybody else to.

Your housework is yours. Great if the nanny can kindly fit it in around getting a break herself but as her job is to care for your child I don't think you can get upset because she didn't make your shepherds pie.

Re toddler groups Nanny is right most close and I'd rather have my dc out in the fresh air exploring the real world instead of being cooped up in a town hall.Mostly mums just chat and the dc are left to play.Having a break from said groups is surely a good thing.

I to would be upset but she would be unable to take your dd to playgroups as they tend to stop over school holidays

Have you had a word with her Maria?

Why don't you agree she can bring him a few days a week but the rest of the time she's got to get child care.

I would suggest you pay her a reduced rate if she is actually looking after her own child too. It's effectively a nanny share and should be treated as such. She may sort out child care arrangements if her pay is halved?

OP - it takes two to create a casual atmosphere - don't blame your nanny because she acts as casually as you about things. She should have asked if it would be OK to bring her son with her and come to some arrangement with you - whether that was a slightly reduced rate or whether she'd take them out most days or whatever - but you should have both been happy with the arrangement, especially as you work from home.

However, one thing you need to keep firmly in mind is that it is NOT easy to find a good nanny who is happy to have the parents at home during the day and understandably so. You have had her 10 months and this is the first time this has been an issue, so it's not ALL school holidays etc.

I would leave it until these ones are over and then talk to her about any upcoming holidays and what you are or aren't happy for her to do - but if she can't find alternative care for her DS (and if I was a nanny I wouldn't even want to - well not for everyday, but I would have arranged this in advance) don't be too suprised if she finds another job where it is OK for her to take him and this will leave you looking for another nanny who is happy that you work from home.

Microflight - a nanny bringing her own child would not charge only half. She would charge maybe 20% less. It is not the same as being in a nanny share.

OP you really would do better to get this thread moved to the childminding/nanny section.

agree with chipping.... a nanny share does not equal a drop in wages by half.

and for some very lucky nannies it doesnt equal a wage drop at all!

I would have a meeting with her and talk about it. If she is not doing what was agreed when you hired her, and the meeting doesn't resolve it, I would look for someone else. Hopefully she will be able to find child care for her son and you can carry on as you were before she began bringing him all of the time.

I agree entirely with nannyl. We have a nanny, and although she doesn't have children of her own there have been several occasions recently where she has brought a friend's children to our house (the friend has just lost her father and is a single parent; the friends children are 4 and 2; mine are 3 and 1).

Yes, it's not as convenient as when she's just looking after my children only. But IMO the employee/employer relationship between nanny/mother is different from any other. Our nanny is great about working late at short notice (for example if my train is late) and will go out of her way for all of us time and again (for example including bits of my shopping when she shops for the children, or putting the bins out if I forget, or hanging up my washing to dry - none of which I ask for, and isn't in her contract, but she does anyway because she's just nice).

By all means pay your nanny a reduced rate if she has her son with her (ours offered to not be paid when she had her friend's children - I didn't accept). But I can't for the life if me see what you achieved by telling her not to come in. And I don't see what's so bad about your daughter spending more time out of your house.

The one thing I do think you have a point over is that I would expect a 6 year old to be more capable of entertaining himself while your nanny does your chores.

Have a meeting and go over contracted arrangement.

Also you need to be aware many,many nannies in our area are switching to childminding. Yes they have mountains of paperwork but they can earn 4X as much,care for their own children,work in their own home and not have to partake of somebody else's housework.

It is extremely difficult to find a good nanny now in our area and you often have to pay massive agency fees.

If it was me I'd prefer to have a nanny(although I think some of the paperwork c/ms do is seriously lacking in nannying eg Paed 1st aid,accident books etc) as dc have the security of their own home and not the inconvenience of dropping off and picking up.If you have a nanny that your child loves and who is very good at caring for your child you are very lucky and might regret loosing her.

Also what giraffs said but you need to listen to her too and be ever so slightly flexible. Again this is where some c/m paperwork is good ie written contracts are obligatory.

I'd like to point out that Nannying certainly isn't the only job where you can take your children with you when you're stuck for childcare. People have done it for years. I remember being taken out in my DF's lorry as a child and the local children's centre nursery is swamped with with older kids on INSET days and in holidays. I've known teachers who've taken their kids in. Another friend in an office takes her child and says others do the same.
The common factor is staff and fellow colleagues who understand the meaning of give and take and an accommodating management/head that realises they must be flexible if they want their staff to work on those days.

I, too, think you'll have problems recruiting another Nanny who'd be happy with you working from home. A Nanny at our Playgroup said her MB worked from home and she hated it - felt like she was under observation the whole time.

In fairness to op she didn't say that the shepherds pie was for her. Maybe it was for the child, it which case it is part of the nanny's duties (as long as she has some break).

I would prefer my child to skip the playgroup and go to the park in August and i would welcome the company of a 6 yo as it is good for toddlers to be sometimes with older children, they learn a lot.

Of course we're talking amongst ourselves again...

Is she employed as a Nanny or a Cook/Housekeeper?

Maybe she is only doing the cooking/cleaning out of the goodness of her heart.

I don't know. Is the rate of pay the same for a Nanny who simply looks after the child and a Cook?

Agree with Tanith my dp works in IT and has very flexible employers ie if I'm working and we have things like the teacher strike or medical stuff,poorly kids he's allowed to work from home.He's very strict about making up any hours lost.A lot of employers are flexible re childcare,they have to be with both parents often working now.

Also research shows employees work better if employers have good working conditions which would include flexibility with childcare.

Angels, nannies are typically contracted to do cooking, washing and cleaning for the children, but not for the parents. So it's perfectly reasonable to expect a nanny to make shepherd's pie for the kids, but it would be unusual for the parents to eat it too (although, that said, our nanny cooked for me once when I was ill and DH was away - but she certainly didn't have to).

Ages ago I asked if nannies were expected to cook-but no one replied. She sounds more like a mother's help to me. If I was a nanny I wouldn't be doing housework, other than the DCs room and I wouldn't be cooking, other than for the DC. Was there ever a job description? It sounds to me as if it didn't start off on a very professional level and so she is treating it in the same casual way.

It often ends up like that Gwendoline, though the OP does sometimes make a reappearance.

MilaMae, written contracts are obligatory in nannying as well... it's part of UK Employment legislation. Though not every employer seems to know that, so I do see your point.

Basically a nanny does everything for the children that a parent would do if s/he were at home instead.