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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Aibu to have chosen dc5 over DHs happiness

107 replies

Finallyworkedoutnamechanging · 05/07/2011 08:10

I have name changed just so that people can't search my user name.
We have 4dcs, all was going really well until halfway through the pregnancy with dc4 when dh suddenly had a breakdown, wouldn't get out of bed, lost his job etc. A very difficult time we ended up setting up our own business so that we could work together from home and moving hundreds of miles to live near his family. Dc4 is now about to turn one and I am pregnant, it wasn't planned, is our first unplanned pregnancy. Dh has made it clear that he doesn't want the baby, he has said that it is my choice but it really is crystal clear that he doesn't want it. I can't have an abortion I just can't, we have no other reason NOT to have this baby (financially, space etc) dc4 has had very little impact on him in reality because he does so little baby care etc. He is now slipping back into his old ways, today I was in the bathroom being sick and he was banging around saying he couldn't be bothered with it again. I know this will cause his mental health to deteriorate although to what extent i dont know.

I feel as though I have chosen this baby over him now and I'm starting to feel unreasonable since I have never considered abortion at all even though I know he has but am I? If I get pregnant and he KNOWS that I would not consider abortion (and neither would he have up until 2 years ago when he first started with depression) am I unreasonable to then choose to have the baby even if I know it will cause him to deteriorate again?

OP posts:

MollysChamber · 05/07/2011 09:10

I'm not sure my marriage would survive if I felt that my DH had forced me to have an abortion.

hanmei · 05/07/2011 09:11

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hanmei · 05/07/2011 09:12

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Indigojohn · 05/07/2011 09:16

I don't think it's forcing Molly.

He is clearly under enormous strain and simply not coping.

Original poster

Finallyworkedoutnamechanging · 05/07/2011 09:17

mollyschamber - i dont think mine would either.

OP posts:

ShellyBoobs · 05/07/2011 09:20

"I'm not sure my marriage would survive if I felt that my DH had forced me to have an abortion."

And surely the converse is also true for a man being forced to accept another child that he doesn't want?

Indigojohn · 05/07/2011 09:20

Then she's between a rock and a hard place, isn't she?

Because forcing him to become a father again when he can't cope with it is not a recipe for an enduring marriage, either. Especially as the baby wasn't planned.

If you had planned the baby, I'd be totally on the keep it side but neither of you did and that has to have a bearing on this.

catsmother · 05/07/2011 09:21

Agree that the 2 issues of an unplanned pregnancy and his depression need to be separated. If he's sliding into depression again then the very best thing he can do is to get to the GP pronto and try to nip it in the bud. Not surprisingly, leaving it so it gets worse means that there'll be a larger issue to sort out - which might take longer, and in the meantime he'll be suffering more misery needlessly (speaking from experience BTW so not unsympathetic). Only when his head is as clear as it can be will he be in any real position to look at the pregnancy objectively .... it may well turn out that regardless, he really doesn't want another child, and if that's his dealbreaker, he'll have to consider what he wants to do, but right now, I think it's very hard (for both of you) if his judgement is being clouded.

So far as you're concerned, of course you have every right to decide what to do. Your decision obviously needs to be based on your current circumstances and how you think you'll cope whatever the future turns out like (i.e. regardless of how much support you get from him) but no, you shouldn't agree to abort because that's what he wants. I'm afraid I feel that the responsibility for the pregnancy began when you had sex - even if it was non-penetrative, and if he absolutely wanted no more children, he shouldn't have been taking any chances, however slim. It seems a bit rich to pressure you to abort, yet previously reject the suggestion of a vasectomy because he "wasn't sure". Well, that being the case, he needed to think about how he was going to manage the possibility of pregnancy going forward - quite clearly you didn't get pregnant on your own. If both adults knowingly take a risk (e.g. it wasn't as if you lied about being on the pill or something) then he has no right at all to then demand a potentially traumatic abortion should you fall. Am very sorry for you because right now, you must feel pretty wretched ..... and however logically you look at depression, I shouldn't also wonder if there's not a little bit of you feeling very let down by him failing to support you at the moment, given that you supported him when he needed it ...... and the pregnancy is down to both of you.

How you get him to the GP though I don't know if he's typically reluctant. Trouble is, again speaking from experience, it's a bit of a viscious circle as the more depression sinks in, and the more befuddled your head is, the less likely you are to think entirely rationally about getting help. You can feel so awful you think there's little point in seeing anyone as you can't imagine there's anything they can do ..... and you can think like this even if you've been through depression previously. It's got to be worth speaking to the (new) doctor like you did before though - you've got nothing to lose after all.

oohjarWhatsit · 05/07/2011 09:22

I'm not sure my marriage would survive if I felt that my DH had forced me to have an abortion.

And surely the converse is also true for a man being forced to accept another child that he doesn't want?

agree, i would think that my partner wasnt taking my wishes into consideration whatsoever. It would probably be the end of the relationship for me

MollysChamber · 05/07/2011 09:25

Forcing, coercing, persuading. Call it what you will. If OP doesn't want to do it but does it because DH wants her to the outcome will be the same. A very resentful OP struggling to come to terms with terminating a pregnancy that she didn't want to terminate. At what cost to her own mental health?

Yes, clearly he is struggling however surely the logical thing would be to seek help rather than tell your wife to have an abortion when she doesn't want to?

OP you should speak to GP about him. IME they are generally very helpful when it comes to relatives fears re mental health. If GP isn't sympathetic see a different one.

Omigawd · 05/07/2011 09:26

Lovethesea · 05/07/2011 09:27

It sounds as if your DH is still far from well - and needs more support medically than he is willing to seek. I really feel for you.

I do not think you should go against your conscience on this, you would end up probably resenting or even hating him for it. He chose not to have a vascetomy and he chose to have sex with you. He knew there was a chance of a pregnancy and he knew your thoughts on having an abortion.

You also say he would have been very opposed to you having an abortion before he became ill. Perhaps it is worth also considering how he might feel about it all when he is fully well again in the future. A good friend who had severe depression told me that in hindsight they could see how focused on themselves and their feelings they had become during their lowest time - and how different they now felt about so many things. When well again would he perhaps be horrified at pressuring you in this way and feel very negative about the end of this pregnancy and his part in it?

Right now you sound like you do all the main caring for the 4 children you have and are not daunted by having a 5th in that mix. You are also caring for him. You can't predict how he will be in the years ahead, but you can predict how you will feel about aborting this pregnancy.

I hope he is able to access all the help he needs soon, perhaps this pregnancy will cause a crisis for him but maybe that is what it will take to get him good medical support and longterm wellness.

Original poster

Finallyworkedoutnamechanging · 05/07/2011 09:32

oohjar I HAVE been very supportive to him over the last two years and taken his wishes heavily into consideration, I have worked very hard with him to set up a business I have sold everything I inherited to support us while he was too ill to work (and also too ill to be left alone even if I could find a job) I have also moved 300 miles away from my family and friends so that he felt supported and happier. If he left the relationship because of this I would be devastated but at the same time if I aborted this baby (even if in a few years he decided he wanted another which he may) then even if our marriage survived it would be with that hanging over it. I know it sounds stupid and selfish but it is how i feel. I do feel unreasonable but actually I dont know I want to be reasonable at this point. I should add at this point that I do love him very much and want him to be happy its not that i am standing here going "fuck off im having this baby regardless" I am trying to be sensitive about it even if it may not seem like it.

OP posts:

Original poster

Finallyworkedoutnamechanging · 05/07/2011 09:33

omigawd - added to that i am also breastfeeding and have very irregular cycles - it is a miracle!

OP posts:

Original poster

Finallyworkedoutnamechanging · 05/07/2011 09:35

lovethesea yes before his illness he was very against abortion for anything other than medical reasons so this is a total turn around for him.

OP posts:

fedupofnamechanging · 05/07/2011 09:38

What Lovethesea said.

Also, to the poster who thinks it should be an equal decision between the two 'creators', that's all very well, but if they can't agree, then someone has to have the final say. Really, that has to be the person who is actually pregnant and would have to either give birth or undergo the termination!

MollysChamber · 05/07/2011 09:38

Sounds like you have done everything you can to help him. Some things are just a step too far no matter how much you love someone. I think this is, quite legitimately, one of those times.

Maybe you need to try the tough love approach. Don't make it about the pregnancy. TELL him you think he is becoming unwell again and he must see a doctor. You'll come with him. But he has to seek help. Bloody hell, don't care how ill he is - to want you to abort his baby but not be willing to speak to a GP about his anxiety/depression is completely unreasonable.

BTW I do have experience of living with someone with mental illness. I know it won't be easy but getting him well is the priority.

Poppet45 · 05/07/2011 09:39

Oh goodness you really are between a rock and a hard place. FWIW five kids and you're still in your 20s? I can see why it would be a huge mental strain... I'd have gone gaga long ago and I'm sure that sort of pressure (as well as thoughts that there must be more to life in your 20s than just raising kids, and well frankly there is) would get to a lot of people.
However he can't pressure you into an abortion. It's not right. On the flipside though, you can't pressure him to stay if it will ruin his health and life... so you have to weigh up your determination not to have a termination, with your determination to keep your husband. I know he played 50 per cent in making this baby (however it occurred I'm confused too ) but it's so hard that the question of what to do is somewhat out of his hands. I think if you have the final say on the baby, you'll have to accept he has the final say on how best to preserve his own wellbeing. It's not nice and sounds selfish but depression is the most hideous, selfish illness I can think of.

ChaoticAngelinLimbo · 05/07/2011 09:42

I cannot believe that some posters are suggesting the OP should consider having an abortion, even though she has said she doesn't want one, because that's what her DH wants

There are several threads on here where the OP is told she cannot force her DH into having a vasectomy because it's "his body, his choice". Apparently sexism is alive and well on here, just not the way a pp suggested.

OP don't have an abortion unless you 100% want one. If you do so against your will you may end up with mental health problems which won't be good for the DC you already have.

Sewmuchtodo · 05/07/2011 09:42

What a horrible situation.

You need to be honest with your DH. Explain that not having this baby is not an option for you and you need to find a way forward that is best for the family (all 7 of you). Depression is an illness but it is also a choice not to contiue with medication, I realise the side effects can be horrid (my own dh has suffered on and off for a decade) but there are other options that he coule explore with his doctor as opposed to simply stopping the prescribed medication.

You have said you re-located nearer to your dh's family, are they aware of your current situation? Are they supportive of you both? (you need support too).

mummytime · 05/07/2011 09:45

He is ill. He needs to get help. You are not responsible. In life we cannot control every tiny thing, he needs to be well enough to cope with that.
He needs to see his GP.

You need to not be forced into an abortion, which I find an absolutely horrible concept. He can't use his illness to blackmail you, and you need to not allow it.

You have given up a lot for him, he needs to start taking responsibility for his own well being. If that means taking his medicine despite the side-effects, then that is what he should do. Ultimately you cannot make him get better. You can help relieve pressure to help him cope, which you seem to have done massively. But you can't take responsibility for this, he has to.

It is sad. Good luck!

fedupofnamechanging · 05/07/2011 09:49

Finally, because your husband is not in his right mind at the moment, I don't think that what he is saying now is definitely his real opinion. It's the illness talking. The man you married would have viewed this pg completely differently. With that in mind I think you should keep the baby, because when he has recovered that is what he would have wanted you to do.

It's not his fault that he is ill, but it's still a huge thing for you to be living with and it sounds like you have made a lot of personal sacrifices in order to help him. I don't think you should give up your baby too - when he is better he will hate that he made you do this and I think if you do it without it being what you want, you will always blame your husband on some level and your marriage won't recover.

I do think that you have to explain to your husband what your thinking is on this matter though, so he knows you are not just disregarding his feelings.

ZombiePlan · 05/07/2011 09:51

I think your DH needs to get his arse down to the doctor. He is being extraordinarily unreasonable to try to pressurise you into having an unwanted abortion (with all the attendant risks to your MH) when he refuses to address his own MH issues. He is effectively pushing off all responsibility for his own health onto you, whch isn't ok. Is he maybe too used to you being "the strong one" while he is the one who needs support?

I am kind of getting the impression that he had decided that he simply cannot cope with a fifth DC (e.g. his behaviour when you were throwing up - does he normally treat you like that when you're ill? I assume not, in which case it's got to be because you're pregnant. Which makes me think he's made up his mind that he Just Can't Do It.) I think that at the very least he owes it to you to actually discuss the matter, rather than just make his mind up and expect you to fall in line.

Can I just point out that when you're making the decision to abort or not, "reasonableness" should simply not be a factor. It's about how you feel, not about how well you can "justify it on paper". So even if there were 999 reasons to have an abortion and the sole reason against it is that you fundamentally don't want to, then you shouldn't do it.

TheOriginalFAB · 05/07/2011 09:58

This is such a terrible situation as you can't have half an abortion just as you can't have half a baby when one wants one and the other doesn't. It comes down to the best case scenario.

Keep the baby and run the risk of DH leaving/resenting you and the baby forever.
Terminate the pregnancy and run the risk of hating DH so your marriage is ruined.

There is no easy answer.

Omigawd · 05/07/2011 10:01

"Keep the baby and run the risk of DH leaving/resenting you and the baby forever.
Terminate the pregnancy and run the risk of hating DH so your marriage is ruined.

There is no easy answer."

Which of these gives the best outcome to the other 4 DC's - they have a big stake in this too.

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