To be a fan of the Oxford comma?

[MrMan]

Sentences just seem so wrong otherwise.

FreeButtonBee - may I say that your list and semicolons is perfection itself. Ex-managment consultant here and its how we were told to do it to avoid ambiguity with clients. I still use the convention all the time. Interesting you are a lawyer.

Hurrah for the semicolon!

BelfastBloke - hurrah for split infinitives too. DW is a pedant on this. She edits my letters and I've given up fighting but her corrections of my split infinitives look unatural and wrong.

To be perfectly honest though, all my days at Oxford I never once met an adherent to the Oxford comma convention. I was a sciency / economisty sort though.

Some years ago a local newspaper carried a story about an application for planning permission which was being opposed by (let us say) Mr Brown and Mrs White; in any event by a man and a woman. And let us call the place Blanktown.

The paper had a photo of them under which the caption should have read:

Mrs White, who lives in a caravan at Blanktown, with Mr Brown.

Unfortunately the sub-editor missed out the second comma and it costs the paper a lot of money.

So be careful with commas!

That sentence doesn't make sense with two commas - there's no verb in the clause 'Mrs White with Mr Brown'. Sorry.

I am almost positive that the Oxford Guide to Style says it's ok to split infinitives now, especially if it makes it read more easily. I will check later...

Shall we start a perservation society then for it- like the one for apostrophes?
I shall carry on using it anyway.

So that i can write:
I like fish and chips, and apple crumble and custard.

perservation? how about preservation?

IHeartKingThistle That sentence doesn't make sense with two commas - there's no verb in the clause 'Mrs White with Mr Brown'. Sorry.

it does actually. with 2 commas it means she lives in a caravan, and the other person in the photograph ( this is a caption) is Mr Brown.

Without the 2nd comma is reads that Mrs W lives in the caravan WITH Mr Brown.

strawberry

Surely that is because it is not actually a complete sentence - it is caption, a sentence fragment? You don't normally write under a photo 'This is Fred with Ted'; you write 'Fred and Ted'.

Also MoreBeta and FreeButton, your semi-colon-filled sentences might be clear but they are also incorrect! Surely a semi-colon separates clauses which could exist as sentences independently? So you can say,

I walked into the room; I sat down because those two clauses could be 2 different sentences, but you can't say,

Walking into the room; I sat down because they couldn't.

Ergo a list of noun phrases separated by semi-colons is WRONG!

Oohh I don't like it at all! It goes against everything I've ever been taught.... But it makes so much sense in certain scenarios! I'm torn! Thanks a lot OP, now I'm going to be constantly worried about whether to use it or not

I am a fan of the Oxford comma. It makes written communication clearer in some circumstances, which is the whole point of grammar.

Oh yes - it's a caption. Sorry, ignore me.

Oh and unignore me again for a minute. Peasant - separating long noun phrases (in a list, for example) is another function of the semi-colon. Otherwise, your point is perfect!

Got SO excited about this thread. I thought I was the only one.

Revolting

What I was pointing out was that the 2nd comma had a point- and without it then the sentence was ambiguous.

If you want to talk copy and standfirsts that's another thread.....!

Iheartkingt yes, semi colons can separate nouns clauses but they are not interchangeable with the Oxford comma, which is used after a list which includes "and" in the penultimate position, before the final phrase which also contains "and".

So if you wrote a list of long noun phrases, all separated with semi-colons, what would you put before the final 'and'?

Not being difficult, just wondering!

morebeta did they teach you spelling at oxford ?

I don't like it at all. I hate overuse of the comma, particularly when read aloud. Very head girl.

So if you wrote a list of long noun phrases, all separated with semi-colons, what would you put before the final 'and'?

Not being difficult, just wondering!

I suppose it would depend on the sense of what you were writing.

Iwould be tempted to use a comma or maybe nothing at all.

eg.

The menu offered: egg and chips; sausage and chips; salad, potatoes and cheese; chicken curry and rice, or anything the chef could cook.

Or

it could be the same as above until:
.......chicken curry and rice; the chef would cook anything if asked.

YANBU

I love the Oxford comma. And semicolons. And the post by Belfast Bloke.

I am definitely a fan. There are times when it works perfectly.
But I'm really posting to empathise with all thoe who have their CORRECT grammar 'amended' by idiot bosses who know nothing. It makes my blood boil.

They are taking the apostrophe out of the GCSE syllabus? Jesus wept.

YADNBU. It is not clunky at all - it adds clarity. Sentences without it can be clunky though, and ambiguous.

I LOVE this thread. I am so indescribably glad to realise I am not the only pedant who gets annoyed with this!

I was beginning to think I was the only person who cared about apostrophes...

I trained in news and find it slightly jarring working on magazines where they talk about sells rather than standfirsts. It's not a huge deal and it expresses what they are, but standfirst just seems better, somehow.