to be totally wound up and pissed off....very very very long story (sorry)

[Stars82]

Ok I need to set the scene for ya

I work in the care industry, we are often subjected to many forms of abuse (not just from those we are care for either) We get bitten, scratched, sworn at, punched, and recieve an abundance of verbal abuse....

I was involved in an incident today which has been playing on my mind at little...

All names have been changed
CAPITALS are used for the raised voices in the convo

Bad timing is a particular bug bare of mine, I detest being late for anything. I arrived at Bett and Bills at 0923 (for a 0930 call)

I went into the house and greeted them in a polite, happy and professional manner only to be greeted back with moans and looks of disgust, general rudeness (not unusual sometimes). The convo is as follows

Bill: You are very early stars
Me: only 5 minutes, my sheet say 0930
Bill: (huffs and pants, clearly pissed off) It is meant to be 0945 on a Friday
Me: honestly Bill I am not lying (shows my sheet)
Bill: Don't care what it says on there it is 0945, Our breakfast is going to be ruined now
Me: sorry bill but seen as I don;t come here regulary I am unaware of betts particular timings, I just follow my sheet. I will wait until 0930 and if 2nd carer doesn't arrive I will call office and wait in the car (getting a little wound up at this point)
Bill: THE OFFICE BLOODY KNOW THE TIMINGS..

at this point 2nd carer walks in to more groans and huffs etc

Bill: here's another one that is too early
2nd Carer: Sorry????
Bill: you are not meant to be here until 0945 (very angry now)
2nd Carer: my sheet also states 0930 Bill....
Bill: I'm not having this I'm going to eat upstairs.....
Me: I will go outside and call office
2nd Carer: (reminds bill of timings policy etc)
Bill: WELL THAT DOESN'T BLOODY COUNT IN THIS HOUSE
2nd carer: well it clearly does bill
Me: right I am going to call office
Bill: WHATS THE BLOODY POINT
Me: well yu are clearly annoyed at something that has been way beyond our control bill and I feel I need to talk to the office. You are being very rude and aggress
Bill: I AM NOT BEING AGGRESSIVE
2nd carer: you are bill

We then go outside, inform office to be told that Bill has a reputation for being extremely hostile, to try to do what we can, and remember we are not paid to take abuse of any kind. The office will call Bill

We return....

Me: Bill the office are going to call you
Bill: well don't bother
Bill: you ahve totally ruined our breakfast...(has a rant about nurses and timings and other appts)
Me: again Bill I am NOT physic
Bill: just stop talking, you are delaying breakfast even further
Me: hang on a minute, this has been a two way convo, we are both delaying breakfast
2nd carer: bill there is not need to be so rude
Bett: (to me) and you turned up at 0920!!!!
Me: I actually turned up at 0923, and in all the times I have been to you Bett, I have always been either on time or very slightly early and not ONCE have you ever said that you didn;t like it. I have even turned up to find a carer has already started and again noting has been said. You can't pick and chose when you feel it is going to be acceptable to accept a carer early!!!!!
Bett: OH JUST SHUT UP!!!! (also has rep for being rude and nasty at times)
Me: and we don;t get paid enoughto take ANY FORM OF ABUSE
Bill: right thats it

Bill moves in to grab my arm which I doige

Bill: go on and get out
Me: I am more than happy to leave but DO NOT TOUCH ME, I have no objections being asked to leave but you will not lay a finger on me

We both get our things and head to door, at this point bill panics..
bill: no 2nd carer you can stay
2nd Carer: no bill this has also involved me, you have been rude to me and I havebeen involved in this arguement, If we leave we both leave I have also said my fair share today

Called office etc etc

AIBU to think that this situation is totally out of order?? I feel really wound up by it and I keep replaying it in my head :(

I am always polite and professional and have a good rep at work and feel that this will cast a shadow. Totally annoyed

[purplepidjin]

"Attack time!!!"

Where?

"why do people think it acceptable to talk to people like they are a piece of shit!!!!"

Because we deal with people who operate outside of acceptable social behaviour. It's why they need carers.

"I believe I have had more than enough training"

This makes you out to be inexperienced and naive. You can never ever have enough training, because you need to combine that with experience in order to improve at your job.

"this was the first EVER time anything like this has happened to me"

This makes you very inexperienced. Have you been in the job long? How about your colleague? If a job required 2 carers, surely you should have waited for them to arrive before entering?

"With regards to turning up early so I can go early is utter bull shit.... "

You are one of many faceless people invading this couple's home to help them with tasks they believe they should be capable of performing for themselves. Just because you arrive early and stay late doesn't mean that everyone else does. You are not a person to your clients, just Staff.

Having reread your OP both you and the other carer were inflammatory to the situation. People impose routine on their lives because they need to feel in control. Bill is obviously terrified of the loss of control he's experiencing, and humiliated because he's lost his independence. He is incapable and that makes him feel vulnerable.

This is not an attack. It's an analysis of the situation from the point of view of your line manager and Service Users.

[floosiemcwoosie]

So who assisted Bett when you two left?

[Whorulestheroost]

I agree with snickers reflective practice is really useful, it's the only way we really learn. I used to think that if somebody was arsey with me then I should be arsey back but it gets you no where. You always end up being the better person by staying calm, even if inside your head you are swearing like mad. This may sound stupid but I often imagine that I'm being recorded by one of those panorama programmes about nurses, and if I saw myself on the recording how would I come across?!

[millie30]

OP, you were dealing with an elderly man who has lost his independence and has to rely upon a stranger coming into his house to assist him. His routine is dictated by this, so it is understandable that he may become a bit pre occupied by exact times, mealtimes etc. No people shouldn't be rude but sometimes they will be, that's part of dealing with a vulnerable client group.

[shelfy74]

Having worked in similar fields to this (as a psychiatric social worder and now as a probation officer) I find humour and empathy go an awful long way to diffusing difficult situations. If you take a clients annoyance so personally that you feel you need to 'stand up for yourself' then something has gone wrong. When you turned up bill was annoyed with timings which could have been deflected by ex

[aliceliddell]

Sorry that happened; it must be really hard. FWIW, it'sa tough situation. I'm disabled and I resent being dependant on other people, not the people themselves. I often feel I'd sooner have the privacy than the help. It is a very frustrating position to be in; I hope I don't express that too often, but I know I do to dp sometimes. It's possibly that. Not anything you did, just the whole aggravation of it all.

[shelfy74]

Oops sOrry pressed wrong key (breastfeeding and posting) ... Deflected by explaining that there had obviously been a mix up, you were sorry and would ensure it wouldn't happen again by highlighting it to the office. By arguing the toss you directed bills annoyance at you personally. You can never have too much training, never reflect too much, it's a tough job. How long have you been in it op?

[SocialButterfly]

Well I think you are being quite defensive in your replies to peoples comments, you obviously think you were in the right so Im not sure why you posted in the first place.

No one should have to tolerate abuse from their clients, I work with young adults with autism, I have had a black eye, have numerous scars on my arms from scratches and always have some form of bruises. Its not right but it happens.

I dont think you should have argued the point regarding the time, sometimes you have to just accept in your head you know you are right and that it is easier to agree with a person that continue with an arguement. I also dont think you should have said anything regarding no being paid enough, that was unprofessional.

All in all I think it was a storm in a teacup and will blow over, however you do give the impression that you could be quite antagonistic with clients and that may well cast a shadow.

[NonnoMum]

Brilliant post purple.

You do come across as quite defensive. What did you want from this thread? Everyone agreeing that Bill and Bett are shits? Well, we don't. You just have to think about things from their point of view a bit more. They might have had a terrible night, they might be in pain, they might have had to get in their mobility scooter this morning to buy their breakfast, then take great pains in cooking in, perhaps with arthritic hands. Perhaps they were both fantastically sucessful in their careers and used to people listening to them. Perhaps they had just sat down to eat thinking they had a final 15 minutes to themselves when you interrupted them.

And then you spoke to them like that.

[catwoman2011]

At the end of the day, you just argued with someone who pays your wages however much that might be. To top it all you entered their home without an invitation and when they showed annoyance of this invasion of privacy, you threw your teddy in the corner and left..... Agree, the client should not have tried to make contact but by the sounds of it, you and carer #2 escalated the situation to level 3 when it could have been left at level 1.

When was the last time you did Managing Challenging Behaviour? This course covers everything you need to know about disengaging a situation with a challenging, paying client. I should know, its my job to know! If you had had training it would show to everyone, people are picking up that this might not be the case and you have to wonder why.

If you were scheduled to turn up for an appointment at 0930, you should be knocking on their door at 0930. If the client does not welcome you at that time you excuse yourself and call the office in private. They will then advise further, maybe after a call to the clients to confirm timings. To get into a slanging match with the client is not professional. if you are not getting enough time to do all the jobs required, you should write down the tasks you are asked to do and present this to the office so they can negotiate an increase in contact time with the clients. This is the problem, carers try to be more and more caring and can get taken for a ride. The clients don't mind, they are saving money on your generosity but if you do extra work for no pay, that is always going to be your problem and not something you can hold against them.

[HowlingBitch]

You came across as very patronizing to a man that was clearly aggravated obviously he should never put his hands on you but I think that could of been avoided if the situation hadn't escalated to that point. A simple "Oh right I see we are both abit muddled here I'll just go check let the office know so it doesn't happen in future and let you get back to your breakfast" probably would have been kinder.

I haven't seen any "attacks" on this threads just people pointing out that you could of handled it better and I don't get the whole "standing up for myself" attitude you are a professional career working with vulnerable people. Not to say you should not stand up for yourself but I suggest a little more compassion in this case.

[HowlingBitch]

[NonnoMum]

The more I think about it, the more this thread bothers me.

What bothers me most, is that you don't think that you could have handled it differently, or that you might consider that you need more training.

You've had some brilliant advice on this thread, from people who are in this line of work. I think you should go back to your employer and demand more training, or, if you really think that your behaviour was acceptable, you should consider a career change.

One piece of advice I was given once was "Don't fight fire with fire. Fight fire with water."

i.e instead of "You were here at 9.20" - "No, it was 9.23" try something like, "Just thought I'd get here nice and early for you, Betty, but I can see you're enjoying those lovely sausages (where'd do you get 'em by the way, there's a good offer in Tesco's at the mo...) but I'll just wait quietly in your hall/in my car til you're ready. Lovely day, by the way, should I get your light top out for you - the one you looked so smart in last week? Be in the car til you wave from the window..."

[PaisleyLeaf]

He tried to grab your arm after you'd raised your voice at him, which he shouldn't have - but it really sounds like the pair of you were trying to wind him up.

Lack of training, or just the wrong sort of personality - I agree you're in the wrong job.

[Cutelittlecatlover]

I've worked in the same kind of job and been on the receiving end of aggression for the same kind of thing. It sounds harsh but to the office staff these people are just names on a piece of paper, they probably promised them a 9.45 call and didn't bother to change the timesheets.

Of course its shit to have to deal with this kind of thing at work but you don't know how often this kind of thing has happened to Bill and Bett or what the office have promised them so you can't really blame them for getting annoyed.

[HowlingBitch]

That's so sad Cutelittlecat.

[purplepidjin]

Sad but true, Cutie and Howling.

Service Users get sent a faceless carer in uniform, who has little knowledge of their needs and no relationship or time to build one.

Carers are just names on a rota, which is juggled and moaned about in an office somewhere.

This is why I normally steer well clear of "moaning about work" threads

[frantic51]

Ah, didn't realise they they got their own meals and you were just there to assist in personal care for Bett. So you walked in in the middle of, or just as they were sitting down to, their breakfast? And you call them "difficult" because they were "clearly pissed off"? You clearly don't think they have any rights to a life of their own in any way because they are unfortunate enough to need help with personal care, do you?

I get "pretty pissed off" when parents decide to just drop off their DC a "few minutes" early, because the "traffic was better than usual" or "I have to try and fit in shopping while he/she's at their lesson, when maybe I'm having a meal, or trying to finish a job or am engaged with a previous pupil ( I always leave a window of 15 mins between lessons just in case I want/need to do something, make a cuppa, go to the loo etc, in between).

It's really annoying when you have your routine set out and yet are forced to accept someone waltzing in and f*ing up that routine just because you are in your home and there is no escape. And that's from the point of view of a reasonably fit, fully functioning adult! How these elderly, vulnerable people feel I can only imagine.

FWIW My aunt and uncle have recently had to have carers to help my aunt wash and dress as my uncle is becoming too infirm to carry on alone. (they are 87 and 89) My aunt is an ex headmistress and my uncle used to be quite a high ranking civil servant. I would hate to think that they would be put into that kind of position by someone they must see as "a bit of a girl" (anyone under about 45! ) I really think you are in the wrong profession.

[diddl]

Would it really not have worked to let them finish breakfast?

Which may have happened in the time it took for the arguing?

[purplepidjin]

Well put, frantic

OP, why didn't you wait for the other carer before entering? And why din't you ring the doorbell or call a cheerful greeting so they knew you were there? Common courtesy would suggest you call "hiya, am I ok to come in?" As you enter. Next you apologise for being early and ask if there's anything they want like the washing up done. Then you ask Bet if she's ready, would she like a shower or bath, the white blouse or the pink, cardi or jumper. All the time giving her time to try for herself. "Would you like a hand with that" when she struggles eg with buttons or to reach somewhere that needs washing.

Thus avoiding the original situation completely.

If he is still grumpy (because in your op that's all he was) you say "sorry Bill. I had a few minutes spare and thought you might have extra jobs that you wanted done" if he doesn't you go outside and yell at the office about the mix up. Best case is he is pleased and offers you a cuppa. Then you can have a chat and listen while he tells you the real reason he's upset

[purplepidjin]

Ta, Verity

Afaik they do attempt to hammer that point home in training. Whether everyone "gets it" or not is up to the recipient

[purplepidjin]

Ta, Verity

Afaik they do attempt to hammer that point home in training. Whether everyone "gets it" or not is up to the recipient