to ask how many allowances should be made for SN kids?

[PiousPrat]

DS1 is 11 and has a dx of ADHD and is undergoing investigation for Aspbergers. For the most part he adapts to the mainstream way of doing things and we have managed to find coping strategies for him that aren't disruptive for other people and don't draw attention to him unduly. He is however easily distracted, zones out a lot and processes things differently from his peers so despite seeming 'normal' for the most part, he obviously struggles with some things.

There have been a few occasions in the last year that have really riled me at the time, but looking back I wonder if I am being unreasonable in expecting other people (mainly his teachers or parents of his peers, he doesn't really encounter problems with his own age group) to give him a bit of extra time or help rather than getting wound up at him, writing him off as lazy or just excluding him from things.

As an example of the sort of thing I mean, and also the most recent; DS1 goes to scouts. The scouts go canoeing on a local stretch of water every week during the summer. We have a lift share system in place whereby one mum takes 5 of them to the canoeing, stays and brings them home as a) she is a parent helper and b) it is far enough away that it isn't worth leaving and coming home just to go back for them. In exchange for doing this, she then gets out of taking and fetching for the actual scout meetings for the whole year so it actually works out pretty even in terms of times each person takes.

DS1 can be quite slow in getting changed. He gets distracted, he sits and zones out after every piece of clothing unless he is kept on task. As a result of this, the first week they went canoeing the other 4 were waiting for him for nearly 15 minutes. I spoke to DS about it, we came up with ways he could be quicker and I tasked his brother to help in chivvying him along. Next week it took him 10 minutes longer than the others. Not great that they are kept waiting, but an improvement and a sign that he is putting some effort in. I still didn't think it very fair for the others to be kept hanging around, so I spoke to the leaders about sticking their head in the changing room if they got a chance, to remind him of what he needs to be doing and also got him a wetsuit so he only had one thing to take off, then lose and have to find again before finally stuffing it in his bag instead of a whole outfit.

Because he still came out after the others (the leaders didn't have time to pop in and hustle him along) the other mum is now refusing to take him at all. For the sake of those 10-15 minutes, he is missing out on the entire canoeing session which makes up a big part of the group bonding for his scout troup, which is his only social activity.

AIBU to think that it wouldn't kill her to cut him some slack, or perhaps knock on the changing room door herself and keep him on task? Or that the other kids having to wait a bit isn't actually the end of the world and it wouldn't do them any harm to learn a bit of tolerance?

I honestly seem to have lost all perspective on this, as i keep flitting between 'zomg my poor PFB, they are all so mean to him' and 'fair enough, he is inconveniencing other people, he should suck it up and accept it'

I have my big girl pants on, I can take it if the overall response is that I ABU about this specific example, but it also leaves me wondering how much it is reasonable to expect other people to make allowances for those with problems, especially invisible ones (assuming of course that they know about them)

[brass]

But that is your experience and not directly mirrored here. If it's inconvenient for the other mum then surely it's just as inconvenient for the granny who says she won't wait around either?

However she hasn't been slated but the other mum has and in fact all the other people in this scenario have somehow been slagged off.

It's just possible that this is one logistic too far and OP needs to sort it out herself rather than expecting others to do it for her.

In fact sorry, OP hasn't come down either way but many on here have labelled the other children and adults as intolerant.

[thegruffalosma]

YANBU. I was expecting far worse from the OP. It's a very minor allowance to make to wait a wee while for a kid with SN to get changed. If I was the mum in question I would be getting my son to give him a hand when he was changed.

[brass]

she doesn't have a son. Should she get her daughter to help a boy get dressed?

[Pixel]

Well sorry but I still think it's sad. He is part of the group, they are supposed to be his friends.

[Goblinchild]

'It's just possible that this is one logistic too far and OP needs to sort it out herself rather than expecting others to do it for her.'

How about the other parent completing the deal she made, and then next time expecting the Op to sort something different out?
To pull out mid-way is not a responsible thing to do and may mean that the OP's son doesn't complete the course. She should finish what she agreed to do.
Are they working towards an award OP, like Paddlepower Passport or Discover?

[thegruffalosma]

No obviously a daughter wouldn't be able to help - and yes I've just read the OP. But I would be seeing if any of his friends could help. Giving a knock on the door or whatever before saying I wouldn't take him which is just mean imo. Then again I wouldn't refuse to take someone who was just slow at getting dressed who didn't have sn.

[brass]

She probably understood the deal as bring the kids back

not

wait 15 minutes or whatever and then bring the kids back

Either way I really think if the other adults haven't managed it and his brother can't chivvy him and his own granny is unwilling to give up her time then surely it falls to OP to sort something else out.

It's not the fault of the others that OP doesn't drive or that the granny doesn't want to be part of that logistic. Actually that's what is really bugging me. Granny not wanting to do it is ok but anyone else saying sorry but we can't do that is just selfish and intolerant.

So black and white.

[dixiechick1975]

Is it definitely just the time or is that the most polite way to get out of the commitment?

It seems a very odd reason to give.

Have you been to a canoe session - could you go and watch and see what issues arise.

Reading comments with interest as my DD aged 5 has a physical disability.

My instict so far has been to get involved as a helper eg i've applied to be a matron at her dance show to help with the children back stage and I suspect I may get more involved in rainbows (used to be so a young leader so wouldn't mind) eg if they have a trip ask if they need a helper.

[cobweb1979]

'lo Pie ;-)

I think you know my thoughts on this one!

[thegruffalosma]

Must go back and read the thread now but if the granny has refused to wait then I think that is also out of order - providing she is physically capable.

[Goblinchild]

I'm lucky that my family have all been 100% supportive of DS and the strain that his Asperger's has put on relationships.
Unfortunately, many parents of a child with SN have not got that back up and their relatives can be as rude, disbelieving and embarrassed as the general public often are. Perhaps granny is a member of the latter group.

[youarekidding]

I would wait - but then my DS is the same as yours re getting ready.

I work SN education and before that was a rspire carer. There was a befriending service where children with SN were alocated a 'carer' to accompany them to help. Is a service available in your area? The 'carer' would also provide the transport.

I find it sad that people think its an expectation to wait around for a person with SN - it's not its common courtesy to respect not everyone is the same.

There is a lady in my local supermarket who has had a stoke. She works hard but is slow and laborious especially packing bags - but how rude would I be to tell her to hurry up - she can't help it but at least she is trying to support herself.

[LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726]

smallwhitecat... I have a lot of sympathy for the OP but your posts make me think this is the reason why people back away from doing activities with other people's children. You're extremely judgemental of people whose circumstances you don't even know.

[brass]

gruffalo granny doesn't want to do the canoe drive at all as it means waiting for the duration of the activity i.e driving there, waiting and driving them back.

Dropping them off and leaving is not possible iyswim.

Yet the woman who does wait is being crucified because she doesn't want to hang around another 15 min on top of the time she has already been hanging around. Whatever her circumstances - we don't know - but she is obviously bitch.

So the responsibility of this boy's ability to participate falls entirely on said woman and not on OP or granny.

Sorry but I do think this is really unfair.

[thegruffalosma]

Well I think the granny should do the drive if it's the only way her gs can go but she shouldn't really need to be asked cos the woman who is accompanying all of the kids should just bloody well wait the extra 10 mins! I wonder if she would refuse to wait for the OPs child if he was slow due to a more visible disability - if he was in a wheelchair for example.

[LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726]

smallwhitecat... I'll clarify. Your posts are full of entitlement about what people should be doing, along with some odd comments about 'smelly' posts. Why would you make comments like that?

When we do activities and a parent does a favour for me/my children either taking them somewhere or picking them up or whatever, I'd be chivvying my children along not to inconvenience the other parent. I know that some children can take longer and have different needs... the other parent should be acknowledged and it shouldn't be taken as read that she will wait 15 extra minutes every week.

I understand what you're saying and why - the tone just grates. I've heard posts like yours before, even if they weren't made by you, and I do think that attitudes can change people's minds about whether they want to get involved in activities with other people's children or not. People have to be considerate, yes, but that goes both ways or there's a risk that they won't engage at all.

[thegruffalosma]

I think anyone who offers to help out with a large group of kids and is only held back 10 minutes has got off pretty lightly tbh.

[jubilee10]

pious could you sit ds2 down and explain the situation to him and tell him what a help he could be to his brother? I'm sure he is well aware of his brothers needs. could you form a plan where by ds2 could help ds1 to get changed more quickly? I realise he is not very old but if he was willing (and there would need to be some reward involved) I'm sure he would prove able.

I am in a similar situation as you as my ds1 (15) has ADHD and I rely very much on ds2 (13) to lend a hand. My two boys are now very close and get on really well (this has not always been the case) but ds2 likes to be thought of as the "reliable" one in the family and he also helps out with his little brother.

If he will help then could you approach the other mother and tell her what you are doing and ask if she will at least take him this year and see if it works out?

Just to add, ds1 and ds2 have just arrived home in a taxi (that they organised themselves) after playing in an orchestral concert. If anyone had told me that might happen when ds1 was 11 I would not have believed them so things do improve.

[Jaspants]

OP is the other Mum willing to take your DC so that you only have to resolve the problem of getting your DC home?

You said that Granny is unwilling to take and wait, but could she pick up if other Mum took? Or could you get a taxi to pick up your DCs at the end of the evening.

I realise that that was not the original deal that was agreed, but nor was waiting an extra 15 mins after having hung around for a while, and whilst the other Mum is being vilified for not wanting to wait, it doesn't really resolve the problem of how to ensure your DS can continue to enjoy this activity.

I can totally understand how you feel, having had to fight my own son's corner so many times, but equally have had to encourage DS to consider his behaviour and the impact that it may have on other people's reactions to him.

[amberleaf]

I wonder if people would say the same if it was a physical disability which caused the problem. i'd guess not - why are invisible disabilities different!

I agree, disabilities that mean a child needs for example a wheelchair seem to get much more tolerance than neurological ones.

I think it just boils down to some people not believing that neurological disabilities are 'real'

It pisses me off hugely, its so unfair and people having that attitude just makes everything so much harder.

[Jamillalliamilli]

I'm afraid if you're a parent of an SN child you learn quickly that society is set up for the ease of the majority and many people want it to stay that way, so all these ideas of inclusion etc are dependent on the good will of others, and many people just haven't got that good will. (Thank you to all those who do have)

To those who think that being in a wheelchair would make a difference, it does, people don't volunteer in the first place.

If you're disabled or your children are, then you need to have total independance to stand any chance of being able to do the same things as others and that, costs money. I'm sorry you're in this position but it wont be the only time if you rely on others I'm afraid.

[thegruffalosma]

JustGettingOnWithIt - I'm saddened to hear that you have found that people are reluctant to even volunteer to help a child in a wheelchair

I was just making the point that if the disability is less visible, like in the OP, there may be the feeling that there is no 'real' reason why they can't dress as quickly as the others.

[Jaspants]

I have to agree with JGOWI in terms of my experiences as the parent of a child with a disability.

OP - the [[http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/disabledpeople/financialsupport/dg_10016128 Direct Payments scheme] may be able to help