Would this be a deal breaker with your sister, genuine advice needed.

[kitty4paws]

I have posted before about this but I had the threads removed as they had to much personal information on them , but I would really appreciate some advice.

In summary DH has severe short term memory problems. Can?t remember stuff from 5 minutes ago.

He was originaly diagnosed with dementia but now it is thought to be functional amnesia, no change in his symptoms, just in his diagnosis. But thank god NOT dementia.

DH has spent a lot of time round at MY Sister?s house (His SIL)

I found out by total, total accident that :

a) My sister obtained a signed letter from DH to access DH?s medical notes. DH can not remember having signed a letter at all but I trust / believe that he signed it under his own volition.

b) My sister was due to attend an appointment (without DH or myself being asked to attend) to speak to DH?s GP about DH?s medical notes. DH can not remember even making an appointment but again I have to trust that the appointment was made by my DH.

DH puts all sorts of stuff in his phone so that afterwards he can ?remember?. He calls the phone his ?brain?. He knows that I look through it regularly so I know what?s going on when I am not with him.

No entry in his phone AT ALL about either the notes or the appointment though other medcial stuff he has discussed at my sister?s has been put in his phone.

DH can not remember what he said to my sister (of course) but has NEVER asked anyone else to keep anything from me (the TOTAL opposite is true).

I have had various heated ?discussions? via e-mail with my sister, trying to sort all of this out.

I have asked the following question (Via e-mail (from me) and signed letter (from DH) )

?Did DH specifically say that I was NOT to be told about the notes / GP appointment ??

My sister refuses to answer. She has stated in other e-mails that :

? I do not have to justify my actions in any way?

? My conversations with DH are private and confidential? Though it is ok for the man she cares for to be present for all the conversations ( she is a live-in-carer)

Also (BEFORE the change in diagnosis to functional amnesia) she did not inform me of other medical information and she said that was reasonable because

? at that time I did not see DH?s memory problem as dementia?

Soooooo apparently a man with no memory can ?chose? to tell me stuff and she is deciding his diagnosis rather than his consultant

I have made sure that DH (and his medical information) is ?safe? and my sister has backed off from contact with DH but she expects that over time it will all be ok (the usual way ?stuff? is handled in our family e.g. don?t talk about it just wait untill it all just sort of ?goes away?)

WWYD ?
What reasonable explaination might she have for refusing to give the information?
Would her refusal to answer this be a ?deal breaker? ?
Would you end your relationship with your sister over this ?
Advice greatly appreciated.

If she really thought that you weren´t doing the best for your husband she would be helping & supporting you to do that iyswim.

Not going behind your back & "colluding" with your husband-who will forget so that you only have her word.

She is thinking only of herself & tbh, for the sake of any future people who she might "care" for-I think that you should report her.

I really would complain to the doctor about his/her compliance in this, and demand an explanation. Not request. Demand.

Lee

I did talk to our GP about this and she said that unless DH was actually in the apointment in person to give his permission ( basically to verify the letter) then no information would have been given out. You are right signatures can be forged.

Even though I am his wife I do not ( nor should I) be able to determine who sees DH's medical notes but at the very least DH should be aware of what HE has agreed to.

A scenarieo I feared would be that DH gave permission ( then forgot of course) meanwhile stuff goes in his notes (either from me or DH) that he would NOT want my sister to see but as he has no reason to think that she has access he does not do anything. Sister then reads notes and is privy to informationt aht DH would not have given permission for.

By using his memory in this way he denies his any choice, but my sister just doesn't see it that way ( sigh)

Are your two sisters significantly older than you?

Yes they are, I am the baby of a large famiy.

if a relative or friend of mine behaved in such a dishonest manner I wouldn't trust them to tell me the time.

Your sisters behaviour sounds very odd. I work in the NHS and am only too aware that wrongly, some staff treat people differently when they are/are accompanied by fellow NHS staff, so could understand that if your sister thought you weren't being treated properly or being given all the information that her accompanying OH to appointments may alter the situation, however this would only be acceptable if you and OH wanted that.

Furthermore I would still have concerns that she might (depending on where she works) still be accessing his records illegally. A lot of information is held electronically and if she has access to the system she could potentially still be accessing information. This is a sackable offence. If any healthcare professional accesses records that they do not need to, they are usually sacked and struck off -

Hi Kitty - I remember your threads too. I am very pleased to see that it is not dementia. That is great news. Are the memory issues likely to resolve? Or can they not say?

And your sis is def weird. But you know that. I would stay as you are and not have any contact. I would have the chat with your other sister though - just to get your side across.

FWIW I am the oldest of 4 and would be the bossy one. But I would never DREAM of interfering in any of my sisters' lives in this way. I would help in any way I could of course but would not dream of going any further.

It's interesting that someone else asked if your sisters were older than you - I too am the downtrodden youngest sibling who cannot breathe without being lectured about how I should have done it differently .

Kitty I am so sorry that you are going through this- I have read your previous posts, what a self centred cow your sister is.
I don't want to offend anyone, I have only read kitty's posts so no doubt I will repeat what many lovely mnetters have already posted.
Kitty you are not at fault in ANY of this. It beggars belief that someone who professes to care can make such a difficult situation worse.
I agree with those who have suggested an injunction- if your sister believes that this will be swept under the carpet then it will send a very clear message that it won't be. If she is under the impression that time will heal then (without wanting to worry you) could she be plotting to interfere again already?
Do the healthcare teams know that she is a hcp in training? If not then it might be worthwhile making it clear that she is so that there is the threat of being reported if she tries any more of her shit (although I am with those who say report her now- she has totally ignored the most fundamental rule of caring for others).
I don't think you should have any hesitation in cutting this egotistical woman, and others who "support" her out of your lives permanently- all they are doing is causing you more upsetat a time when you need support. YOU are in the right, please don't doubt yourself.
Please take care and please keep posting- mn works wonders with self doubt and wobbling!

I would cut all contact with her.

Thanks once again , my lovely ladies

I do feel better about it all, in all the many replies not one person has said that my sister is anything but out of order and that my reaction to the situation is correct. I knew this but it is very comforting to actually hear it from others.

I actualy feel that she is upset becasue I have shouted at and been rude to her via e-mail. Though I only ever put down the facts and my own feelings ( and I never swore amazingly of course ) but she is just going to have to deal with being upset.

I am sure ( having had such a positive response from all of you) that anyone in our family who REALLY knew all that has gone on would understand my position but I am going to be the adult rise above it all and let HER make a fool of herself if she wants.

I will ensure she has no further conatct with DH under any circumstances.

thanks all,

Good luck to you and your DH kitty

Fingers crossed she's got the message and backs off, and your family will see through any drama she creates.

P.S.

Dh's diagnosis is now that he may well improve , but by how much and how long it will take is anyone guess. BUT there is hope , for which I am very, very greatful. In the mean time life is still , shall we say, interesting, but sooo much better than when we had the dementia diagnosis hanging over us.

Poor you, I remember your earlier posts too

Haven't read this in detail as it's getting late but I do remember previously thinking you'd been pretty patient with her, so I'm sure YANBU

Glad to hear the diagnosis may be a bit better than you'd previously thought

"she is just going to have to deal with being upset"

Yea. You GO, girl! xxx

""she is just going to have to deal with being upset""

She´s an adult, she´ll cope.

And tbh, she might be more miffed at not getting her own way than genuinly upset.

She does rather seem to have the hide if a rhino!

Hi, I remember your earlier posts. You need to cut contact with your sister. Doesn't matter what the rest of the family think, you have to prioritise your marriage and your children. If anybody asks , just tell them that you no longer want to have to repair the damage caused by your sister's deceit.

I appreciate that you don't want to be vindictive, but I really think that you ought to consider contacting the relevant authority to ensure that she cannot access the medical records of your husband or anyone else in your family via her own job. I don't know how you'd go about this, but it would be less vindictive to deny her access than to try to deal with her accessing yours/DH's records after the event, when I'd imagine it becomes a formal disciplinary matter.

Have you thoroughly checked out wills/ house deeds/ financial affairs? You need to be sure that she hasn't got your DH to agree to anything with financial implications- not being able to borrow money off your other sister for the house alterations will be the least of your worries if your DH has signed a will leaving everything to DelusionalSister.

YANBU.

She sounds slightly unhinged. But I honestly don't understand her behaviour - what's her motivation for behaving like this?

Inertia has made some very good points there.

It is a betrayal of trust, she didn't come to you and say "I think I can help" she went behind your back and took advantage of someone very vulnerable, someone suffering from a memory loss condition. What else could she have got him to sign which he then forgot and she didn't mention to you?

I agree with those who say cut contact. This is a huge betrayal of trust. I would also check out anything else she might have got him to sign.

Well done for getting through all that you have so far.
I would inform you other sisters at least and maybe any more family members that put pressure on you instead of supporting you.
Just go for coffee somewhere public and lay it all out and then go and leave her digest it.
TI hate all this keep it from so and so in the family, best for her to know all the facts and what she does with those facts are then up to her.
But you want support.
Good luck

I remember your last threads. I think your sisters are both narcissists. What were your parents like?

It seems to me that they do not see you as a separate person in your own right, and so they see what is happening to you and your family as happening to THEM. Particularly the sister with no family of her own.

She must have shown this sort of trait previously though. The sister who will lend you money as long as you do what she wants you to do is classic narc in action. If you then stand up to her and say you don't want to do as she says, she withdraws the offer in a sulk.

The other sister is using triangulation to put a rift between you and your money lending sister, which is also classic narc behaviour. They control all family relationships, and divide and conquer in this way, as everything happening in the family goes through them, and is twisted to cause friction.

The DH-controlling sister though....she sounds malignant. It seems to me that she thinks your husband is HER husband, and cannot separate you from her. This would normally be the actions of a mother or a father, but as you say she is older than you, she is acting as a narc mother would act.

You have now stood up to her, and she will be in a narc rage. This does not end well! If your sisters are as I suspect, narcs, there is no point reasoning with them, or trying to get them to see your point of view, as they are unable to do this.

My mother is unable to see me as a separate person, and I tell her NOTHING, EVER, and allow her no information about my life at all, as she thinks I am her, and therefore reacts to everything about me as though it were happening to her. This means that she would control everything as she did when I was a child. Go against her and you see their narc-rage in all its gory glory.

The fact that they cannot see you as a person in your own right means of course that they trample all over your boundaries, as they cannot see that there are any!

She also sees your children as HER children and so of course thinks she knows it all when it comes to rearing them, as in her head THEY ARE HERS.

The only answer if I am correct in my judgement is to get tough with your sisters. Hit them where it hurts and hit them hard. Then they will respect you, and may leave you alone.

They will not change as they cannot. They are Personality Disordered, and that is for life I am afraid.

I remember your threads too - glad your DH has a "better" diagnosis and that your Sis is steering clear.
stoatie and Inertia make very good points. All medical records nowadays are stored on national record systems and many HCPs have varying levels of access from Doctors, to Nurses, to Biomedical Scientists etc. etc.
I'd be concerned in your shoes kitty and although you sound like a very fair-minded and generous-hearted person, I doubt your sister has your sense of honour. Please consider alerting her professional body to her inappropriate behaviour regarding your DHs medical history.

Interestingly, I too wondered if you were the "baby" sister - you are being subtly bullied.

I remember your previous threads but never commented but reading this through the words that kept coming to mind is "munchie", as in Munchausen Syndrome by Proxy, someone who likes to know someone who is ill so that they can feel important or someone who inflicts injury on people (usually their child to get access to hospital). I would report your sister to which ever professional body she belongs to, her actions are not one of any rational person and I wouldn't want her looking after any one vulnerable. She is definitely unhinged and possibly dangerous.

I wondered about Munchaushens as well. People with munchausens often work in health care settings.

A lot of us remember you and how brave you're having to be for your family, Kitty. I'm really really glad that it's not demetia and I hope that your husband does improve, this whole situation would be heartbreaking enough without your sister involved.

You don't need yet another person telling you that your sister is being utterly appalling, which of course she is, so I'll concentrate on telling you how wonderful you're being and how lucky your family are to have you.