or possibly thick/naive to wonder why there are so many staffordshire bull terriers in animal shelters?

[GitAwfMayLend]

I know bugger all about dogs (really really want one but am not going to get one because we are out of the house too much) but am looking on animal shelter websites and getting all dopy and feel sorry for the poor bloody dogs.

Is it because they are too difficult to look after? Or more like they are badly treated.

It's bloody sad.

Thinking of sponsoring a dog because I can't have one.

vallahala are you not aware that dogs are not humans, they are not able to communicate in the same way, you must know as you have extensive knowledge of dogs that they act on instinct, even well trained dogs can only comminucate with their owners up to a certain level and that is because their owner knows them, can hardly go to the vets and tell teh vet something is not quite right

yes i have had some experience, i have known people with rotties and sbt (long long before they were popular and i remember beign told be careful when playing with them purley because even though they looked incredibly cute, they were puppies they are incredibly strong)

basically dogs are not on the same level as humans, they are not equal if they were they would be in parliament now, though i can not argue that they may do a better job

'they are not able to communicate in the same way' - yes but if you know them well enough they are able to communicate quite effectively. Maybe teaching 'doggy language' to young children would help prevent more attacks?

"yes i have had some experience, i have known people with rotties and sbt"

FFS!

Yes dear, and I know several people with doctorates in medicine but that doesn't mean that I can carry out brain surgery.

What a pity there isn't a "point and laugh" emoticon.

i think whatever the dog children should be taught awareness. for very young children pets are often seen as play things i very much discourage my son from playing with our cat when he obviously wants to sleep but he has not always understood that and when is was at an age where everything is about him and playing games when he wants to he got the odd scratch, he has passed that age now but certainly at 2 he was like this, which is pretty normal behaviour

you asked if i had any experience so i answered you. what do you object to someone having an opinion that dogs of such strength (or are they not that strong was i wrong about the bear baiting, i did post i was unsure) are better being homed where there aren't young children and that dogs can never suffer from mental illness

now maybe a dog you have had has been so well trained he/she can take himself off to a vet and have a chat in dog language should you not see the signs he/she is unwell

What do I object to?

I object to people with zero real experience talking bollocks on the issue of Bull breeds - or indeed about dogs in general.

I've got Golden Retrievers. I doubt many people would argue they can make excellent family pets. However, if they wanted to, or had a 'mental breakdown' they would be just as capable as a SBT of causing serious damage to a child or an adult for that matter.

In fact, due to their popularity and therefore the fact that an awful lot of Goldens are puppy farmed or very badly bred, there are now sadly more and more temprement problems within the breed. The one saving grace is that they couldn't look further from 'hard' so in general they aren't owned by idiots who want to have them as status animals. Otherwise, they could easily be in the same position as SBT's are now.

ANY dog can cause damage. The fact is, very, very few dogs are likely to if they are bred and raised correctly and managed appropriately, regardless of their breed.

'the strength of some of these breeds an adult would find hard to fight off so why anyone wants a dog of that strength as a pet around young children is imo just ridiculous. if you want a pet why not get one that can not if they for whatever reason loose control or you do cause that much harm.'

my aunt was bitten by a labrador - her arm was torn open and she needed loads of stitches. if she had been a child then i dread to think what mught have happened.

oddly you don't get many people complaining about evil labradors. i also know two people who have been bitten by border collies, one of them was a pretty bad injury. i have never seen border collies described as evil either.

blame the deed not the breed.

Half the bloody issue is kids not knowing, or being taught how to behave around dogs - going charging up to strange dogs and hugging them or similar. I remember my jaw dropping when two girls very very politely asked me if they could say hello to my dog because it's THAT rare. Granted, I know my dog has a pretty bomb proof personality (unless a squirrel appears and then he loses the plot completely)... incidentally mine's a rescue dog so woooo evils evils evils might be a canine psychopath (but ain't)... but I still really do not fucking like it when kids come charging up to him without asking.

I've met slightly deranged Labradors, umpteen Jack Russells (the one breed I've ever really have issues with - the one dog around here I'll cross the road to avoid is a JRT) with aggression issues and a fair few "handbag" dogs that think they're Rambo... but Dobermanns, Staffies, Rottweilers and German Shepherds that I know of - are all lovely!

Most of these dogs that flip - have been pushed, you read the attack articles again and you see lines like "he would be such a lovely dog, always let the kids pull on his ears and climb all over him"... poor dog has really agonizing earache or backache one day, can't verbalise that "owwww this really hurts" - kid (who should have been taught better to be honest) comes along and climbs on the big furry teddy and that REALLY REALLY REALLY hurts - dog reacts to get the kid to stop doing what's hurting him in the only way he can - with a growl (incdentally I'm sick of growls being automatically labelled as aggression when it's a "bog off that's annoying me now mate"), or a bark, or a snap. Of course - Collies, or Labradors, or Chiuahauas don't make the news when this happens - but the "devil dogs" do... and the Daily Mail gets to break out their usual Staffy photo.

Or you have the dog that's been trained (intentionally or unintentionally) into things like food aggression (paraphrasing the great summary I read of how this happens here and I haven't had a coffee yet so bear with me)... owner wants to check how much in control of his dog he is - so takes dog's food away while eating - dog feels, quite understandably since if a dog's like mine - food is the centre of his world, somewhat aggrieved by this. Few days later dog's hoovering up his lunch again - sees owner coming... remembers what happened last time when he was really into his Pedigree Chum and tells his owner to bog off and leave him alone - dog style, and growls. Owner gets worried by this, thinks his dog's questionning his authority - so goes at it stronger... ignores the growls next time - dog barks and air snaps. Owner now thinks "oh shit I've got an aggressive dog - must let him know I'm in charge" and keeps at it... the growling and barking aren't working... poor dog just wants his meaty chunks in peace so has to escalate things and you end up with a dog who will go ballistic if approached when eating..... not the dog's fault - but an idiot owner who's set those wheels in motion.

I don't even personally like Staffies btw - don't like that size or sort of bull breed in general... but I still get fucking pissed off that a single breed is taking all this shit as a whole.

I had to have my beloved Staffie PTS recently at the grand old age of 16. She was the most placid dog you would want to meet. She was very patient with DS and didn't show any jealousy at all when he was born when she was 13 after years of being my 'baby'.

People believe the hype and malign a gentle, loving breed of dog. I wouldn't hesitate to have another one.

The rescue which I and my DDs help out at take on the difficult dogs that the likes of the Dogs Trust and RSPCA won't. Hence they have several epileptic dogs, some oldies, many large breeds and several Staffies, first Staffie crosses, Bull breeds and large, traditionally mistrusted breeds. They're a no kill rescue and so they do NOT murder dogs just because they have behavioural problems, a fact which is relevent when comparing the breeds and crosses which they have.

They have about 60 dogs atm. Off the top of my head, about a dozen of these are SBT... and all of them love everyone and interact regularly with my own children and I.

Of the 8 or so GSD, two have attitude problems and one as a result is a permanent resident. All but that one are fine with me and both children except Major, who dislikes DD2 for some reason. One GSD wasn't fond of women when he first arrived but training has improved that greatly. I would happily take all but the permanent resident home with me and my DDs - even the one who currently doesn't like DD2 is perfectly possible to turn round. He's a real GSD-lovers dog.

The two Rotties are absolutely fantastic, beautiful dogs, great with everyone. I'd take them home in a hearbeat if I had room.

The GSD x Doberman and the fuck-off sized Anatolian Shepherd X love everyone and have been raised with babies/toddlers. The Mastiff X Boxer abandoned when the owner had twins as a "risk" to them shares his kennel, armchair, toys and space with my DD2 when she visits him clean his kennel and play with and fuss him. We have great video footage of this. :)

The cute, cheeky Jack Russell adores us (and we him) but is a little fecker in a home and has bitten.

Of the two Golden Retrievers, one hates children and the other is a biter (and hence permanent resident).

One of the chocolate Labs is a biter too - she's a permanent resident.

So is one of the rescue's Labrador/retrievers - she's a permanent resident as well.

Are the doubters and the anti-Staffie brigade getting the point yet?

And my own dogs? My younger GSD is bombproof and everyone's friend, my elder one a little nervy but loves my children and I as we do him but my Labrador is like me - he has a positive dislike of other people's small children, drunks and arrogant men.

Now try fitting those dogs into your stereotype-shaped holes!

My adult dd has an Irish staffie ,so she is bigger in the body with longer legs.She is the most loving dog i have ever met.when we go over to visit,i only have to sit down for 5 mins and she is up on my lap ! Seeing as i am only tiny you can imagine how odd this looks,she also follows me upstairs to the toilet.My dd and i think maybe she thinks we are the same person as we both sound the same !! Dd also tells her that "nanny is coming " where she will then jump up to the window to watch for us. [ the dog not my dd ] I never for one minute in my life thought i would be a grandmother to a dog

I have just added a picture of my "canine grandaughter"

mummylin I thought Irish Staffie was another name for a pitbull? Irish Staffies

I would rehome a staffy if I could in an heartbeat. Every one I have met has always been so happy and loving. Ahhhh!

Wouldn't bloody buy one from some dickhead from Gumtree though

in a heartbeat not an!

AmyStake, a tiny minority tried to describe and sell dogs as PBT (whether they were or not!) without saying it directly and attracting police attention. Hence they used various terms - "red nosed Staffie", "long legged Staffie" etc and, when they ran out of variations, coined "Irish SBT" for their own use.

In fact, Irish Staffies are not a recognised breed here in the UK but neither are they PBT. They were purpose bred in Ireland for badger hunting and soforth and were bred to a leaner, leggier standard than the known and recognised Staffordshire Bull Terrier.

Nothing wrong with either EXCEPT for the fact that the Irish (effectively a crossbreed) is often mistaken for or viewed as a PBT and by being bred away from the standard is now a dog at significant risk of being killed under UK law for looking like a Pit Bull type of dog... which is pretty much all the Dangerous Dogs Act needs to justify killing a totally harmless dog.

I had no idea it wasnt recognised as a breed.whatever ,she is lovely.

Vallhala that sounds shocking that dogs like her could be put to sleep for doing nothing.she really is a very gentle dog .In fact she is a softie.wont go out if it rains,wont go through the dog flap because it makes a noise when it closes,all silly things ,but i can completely understand anyone would be frightened if they didnt know her.I in fact used to be very wary of Gs until a friend got a puppy and i actually knew the dog.

Ahh OK! Thanks. Mummylin I wasn't knocking your daughter's dog, she's beautiful. Just the only time I've heard someone describing an Irish Staffie was on TV and they were referring to a pit bull type dog. :)

I saw a full breed pit bull once in the South of France, it was a police dog and was being patrolled up and down the train station. It looked terrifying! All muscle. Eek.

Thats ok .i didnt think you were