To think it will all kick off on here after this is aired?

[MsScarlett]

My mum just texted me to say that tomorrow there is a documentary on BBC3 at 9pm called, "Is Breast Best?".

I predict a bunfight!

gobsmacked so many people still bother to respond to these kind of threads. there will always be some buttmunch who tells you what you are doing is wrong. do what you blinkin' want barring strapping your kid to a radiator (and you can only do that if they are REALLY naughty). get a freakin' grip and have a glass of wine.

I have found that women making the decision for that reason to be in the minority. Of the mothers I know who bottle fed were:

1 who had the choice of breast feed and be unlikely to see their dd's first birthday or ff, start chemo and have a chance of seeing her grow up. You could call that selfish but that makes me smile that she is in remission and her dd has started school.

2 severe arthitis with rapid progression either breast feed and be unable to do anything else for her ds as he grew up as she was fast losing mobility or ff and try and maintain what mobility se still had by taking medication.

3 she had triplets and felt unable to keep up. Yes I know people have but it is an understandable feeling imo.

1. had to have a series of operations so chose to ff so the baby could still be fed while she was in hospital. She is still alive because of those operations.

mothers 5 and 6 had experiences like me with their first with milk not being produced and baby not latching on. They found this is stressful and affected their health mentally and physically that when they had their second they felt they decided to go straight to formula.

There was only one I came across who didn't want to because she though it would make her 'boobs sag'.

Some may call mothers 1-6 selfish but I don't but then I am a demon ff idiot.

All other mothers I know bf as far as I know.

i bottle fed because i wanted to.

I personally have no issue at all with people who ff - most of my friends/family ff their babies. Just wish bf was more popular and viewed as being as 'normal' as ff, especially after the first few weeks - mainly so that me & others who do bf feel more comfortable about doing it, particularly in public. Not sure why there is so much hostility between those who bf and those who don't especially on here! Plenty of people do both.

i couldn't give a monkeys either way. unless its popped out of my foof you can do what you want. i cant stand people saying do it this way or your a bad parent or do it this way and your still a bad parent. do what you blinkin' want. i cant stand people saying you MUST do this or you are a terrible person. sort what pops out of your foof and stick with that.

Thank you for the clarification kerrymumbles. Going by some of the reactions I have seen (here and IRL) of people when they say they judge people, I had assumed you meant 'ZOMG you ff so are evil and neglectful' which I realise was me being judgey of judgeyness which is why I asked. Glad to see I got the wrong end of the stick :)

FWIW although I am pro-personal choice, I do have to restrain myself from asking mothers I know of who say 'I CBA' if they have been arsed to actually look into bf-ing as I am of course aware that if only from a 'not having to faff about sterilising bottles 4 times a day' POV that bf-ing is easier, if you can do it. I don't say anything, because that would be incredibly rude and there could be a whole back story I am not privvy to, and of course it is none of my damn business, but I will admit to thinking it on occasion.

'Thats not what boobs are for' makes me see red, but for entirely different reasons, but that is mainly due to my rampant feminist side copping a nark at Page 3 and its ilk.

FF, BF, mix feed. I don't give a shit. Do what works for you as a family. If you decide to FF as a result of long consideration and contemplation, good on you. If you have put that much thought into it, you are obviously trying to do what is best all round. If you decide to BF after the same thought, good on you. Mix feed? Have a double good on you for covering all the bases while simultaneously risking the wrath of militants on both sides. I couldn't give a shit how people feed their babies, so long as the babies get fed and the parents give some degree of thought to it, as with any major decision like that.

You sound a nice person, Exteris - lovely to meet you.

What I find really sad is that there've been some real heartfelt posts on here from people who have FF....

Totally ignored by SOME BF crusaders who will no doubt also spend the whole of today (as well as yesterday) preaching the cause...and patting themselves on the backs when/IF they get a convert.

Do these people not work or have any sort of real life going on?

Yes...we ALL know the message..so why harp on!?
It's soooo boring.

AGAIN - It's individual choice...it's infant feeding not abuse FFS

To all the FF mothers who made their choice but who feel attacked here and judged....be assured that you did what you thought was right for you and your baby..and for perfectly valid reasons. You don't have to justify what you did to anyone with an opposing view.

Don't let this all get to you....and enjoy your day!

Speaking as the daughter of a consultant pediatrician whose children were ALL FF

....and whose children all grew up healthy and strong.

Time for a name change soon...probably

All I will say to those you judge FF'ers is this.

You will never even begin to understand the pain and torment that I have and still continue to go through from not BF'ing DS. He is nearly 18 months and I still continue to come to terms with my feelings. This caused me to have PND, whereby I was self harming and used to will bad things to happen to me to punish me. This pain, will never ever leave me.

So next time you judge, just remember it's very likely there is a story behind that mother and baby and it's probably a very sad one.

Can I just say IME the issue isn't FF not being supported - have never seen anyone criticising mothers for BFing either directly or indirectly. Health professionals IME try to encourage BFing but when the woman can't/won't there hasn't been any criticism I have seen. Maybe individual experience is different but on the whole BFing is the minority issue and FF is so common and accepted not sure why FFs think someone is giving them a hard time.

This issue about FFs needing support is a bit daft surely? Fair enough if you want to FF you can but why support? What is difficult about it? Are you asked to go into a toilet to feed your baby or tutted at when you put the bottle in a baby's mouth?

Meant to say criticising FFing mothers not BFing.

To the person that said there is likely to be a sad story behind women who FF - I say 'come on'! Isn't that a bit dramatic? There are probably loads of women who try and can't BF and I feel sorry for them but on the whole women who FF choose to do this. Many for convenience sake. Not judging just telling it how it is.

"on the whole women who FF choose to do this. Many for convenience sake"

I disagree, I'm not going to google the stats right now, because, frankly, you should have done that before you came out with such a silly statement. BUt, from the top of my head 25% of new mothers don't initiate breastfeeding but of the 75% that do very few are still breastfeeding by 6 weeks - I think most people are in agreement that this is down to poor support and not because those women now "want to ff".

God the subject is the most boring load of repetitive crapola ever discussed on MN. No one really gives a toss how anyone feeds their children and has anyone in real life ever even mentioned or criticised your choice?

I chose to FF. I did not want to breast feed, I have no problem with other people feeding their babies however they want. I am only concerned for my childrens nutritional welfare.

I love the freedom ff gave me, Dh could take over, I got nights off. I was comfortable feeding wherever. BF was never an option for me.

I chose not to BF. No amount of literature or advice would have changed my mind. There was no 'story' behind my choice I just chose not to. In the same way some women choose to go back to work, or choose to use a dummy or choose to wean early or late etc. Your baby your choice.

I've read about half of the thread but I'm just wondering why, again, ffers are saying they are made to feel guilty or judged. If you chose to ff then surely that was an informed decision that you are happy with so why would you feel guilty about it and why would you care if someone was judging you for it? We all judge and get judged about something.

For those who tried to bf and had to give up for whatever reason - you shouldn't feel guilty - you tried and things didn't work out. If you had problems that you couldn't overcome yourself then you should be annoyed at the lack of support and you should be grateful that there are women who feel so passionate about bf that they are out there trying to change things and make sure that every woman is able to bf her baby if that is what she wants to do. I don't think anyone judges you either - most comments you see on mn in response to those situations are supportive. Obviously it is an emotive issue but you can't interpret every positive comment about bf as an attack against you for ff.

If everyone just 'minded their own business' and 'didn't give a crap' about how mothers were feeding their babies there would be many more disappointed women out there who had their decision to bf their baby taken away from them.

why bother coming on the thread then noddy?

I blame this programme for giving me weird dreams last night - that I was breastfeeding my husband's friends

Can I just say that I thought that on the whole the documentary last night was quite good and balanced.

You had the extremes; the teenagers who wouldn't bf because it was "icky" and the "lactivists" (who btw weren't a good advert for the claim that bf helps you lose weight or doesn't give you horrible boobs!).

But in the middle there was the documentary maker who had tried her hardest but gave up and felt guilty about it, the darling little 19 yo who was also trying her best but finding it hard, and the mum form Paignton (my home town - I actually had a bag of baby clothes off freecycle from this woman - small world!) who was trying to cope with the difficulties of going back to work and bfing.

Most of us "normal" mums fall into this middle band I think, we all try our best but fate and circumstance decided which ones of us manage to bf successfully long term. And it IS hard for most of us.

Overall quite a good programme IMO.

And btw even though it accurately portrayed the "reality" of bfing in that it is often VERY difficult, I think it still made me feel that I was glad I had continued to bf and would still make most viewers who hadn't had children feel that they wanted to bf.

I think that is the problem with most antenatal "preparation" that we get for bfing. It is too scared to accurately portray just how hard it can be. I know I was shocked at just how hard it was. This, I believe, causes many poeple who intended to bf to give up. I personally lasted til 10 weeks, then I had a period of mixed feeding as actually I decided to give up but then my breasts wouldn't let me! I was so engorged I had to keep giving her the odd feed and then eventually I came to feel better about bfing as I didn't feel so "trapped". I am back to EBF now (she is still only 14 weesk so it was only really a short break) and I really enjoy it.

I wish someone had told me to be prepared for it being hard, and that is was ok to give the odd bottle of formula (I too wept the first time I gave my DD formula). Then maybe I wouldn't have had 10 weeks of basically abject misery as I hated every second of bfing up until then and only did it because of guilt. I am pretty sure I had PND as well. A period of mixed feeding allowed me to "breathe".

Perhaps if the documentary maker last night had been supported to do this, instead of just being told "keep breastfeeding at all costs" she may have been able to continue and not now feel so awful?

Oh and it brought back memories of that wincing pain when they first latch on... OUCH! (Thankfully don't get that anymore).

Ok I'll shut up now.

I thought it was quite a naive programme and rather than show 'average' people they showed the extremes, to allow viewers to point and laugh or tut and shake heads. The closest to average they had on there was the 19 year old, doing her best, but clearly in need of a little support to ger her started (as so many first times mums often need). She said herself that she'd be happier if she saw other mums feeding more often but not even this programme showed average brreastfeeders going about their lives. We live in a time/society/culture/whatever that means people don't usually witness their family and friends feeding or generally caring for babies and it all comes as a big shock to new mums and all gets considered weird and private. We are humans after all and learn by seeing and copying.