To be Disturbed by this woman in a Burka? ......

[Gingefringe]

I saw a very strange event in Debenhams make-up counter this week-end which on reflection, I found very disturbing.
A woman in a full burka (including her eyes covered in thin veil) came up to the make-up counter with a man (presumably DH). The man then proceeded to ask about foundation for the woman and had a conversation with the sales assistant which rarely included the woman at all (apart from trying on a sample colour on her hand).
I felt so sorry for the poor woman - not only to be forced to wear this ridiculous veil but she wasn't allowed even to chose her own make-up!
I did give the man my best evil looks but he didn't seem to notice - perhaps because I was a woman!! I was too cowardly to say anything.

On the day that France bans the burka I wonder whether you would have said anything?

Cote, I'm from North Africa originally, I also speak French. This does not excuse the French Govt. from being misogynistic.

Couldn't the same be said about the bra?

Not really. My bra holds my tits in place...my husband doesn't have any (yet)

Through work years ago I met some very interesting, highly educated women in Germany who wore semi-burka when outside of the home - whenever in the street basically, between places. It made them feel safer to do so. They were refugees and separated from their male family members temporarily, so they went out in 2s and 3s dressed this way. It did not stop them having PhD's in engineering or medicine, being incredibly interesting, kind, hospitable and thoughtful friends.

OP you should reflect on this next time you stare, or give anyone "evil" looks. What an idiotic response.

I disagree, LadyoftheManor. As I have already stated, I believe the burqua to be detrimental to the image of women as a whole. Freedoms do not come without responsibility. Lots of things in society are banned. Does that mean that we are all oppressed? Or that we are taking steps to improve our society?

but a man dictating what a woman can and can't wear isn't detrimental?

I do think it was silly to give the man evil looks, though!

Youaretoonice

Your experience really doesn't speak for everyone's. I'm married to a muslim man who was raised in a muslim country. He has four sisters who all work, wear what they want (ranges from tight skinny jeans/heels/daily blowdry to hijab) go out alone, go out in the evenings to meet friends and even boyfriends (discreetly, but nonetheless) and my DH has no judgemental opinion on my clothing, social life, work, friends or anything else. So you married into a shitty family - means nothing really. I could just as easily say no muslim women are oppressed because the ones I've met haven't been

LadyoftheManor - it's not just a man. As a woman, I support the burqua ban, as does Cote d'Azur, and as do many other women I have spoken to. It's not just Sarkozy making a decision all by himself; there are women in the French govt too, you know.

I do not find it detrimental when men dictate many things. It depends what is being dictated. Was it detrimental to be dictated to that I should wear a seatbelt?

What worries me about the Burka ban in France is women are not allowed to 'go out in public' in a Bburka..so they will stay home? you think that wont happen? and what about the women who want to wear the burka?..or are they so indoctrinated they don't have the right to do what they want?..talk about oppression on all levels..

Mumincentre - yes, that's a serious risk, that women may be confined to the home if they can't go out wearing the burka. Will be interesting to see how it works out in practice.

Did i say ALL?

The family i was involed with, the extended family, my neighbours, quite few actually.., friends i have met etc

ven boyfriends (discreetly, but nonetheless)..lucky you!! lol

What about the women who want to wear the burqua? Well, where does one person's freedom end and another's start? What about the right of other, non-burqua-wearing women to live in a society free from the burqua mentality, free from such open displays of misogyny?

Youare- Did you live in an Islamic country?

Might aswell have!!!

French government is not being "misogynistic". Quite the contrary, if anything.

You may speak French but you can't have followed the intense debates in France that preceded today's Burqa ban.

This is not about patronizing women into conforming into the fashion of the day. This is about shunning the mentality that women should be hidden from view and treated differently because of their chosen dogma.

If you know anything about France and the French, you should know that their culture and mentality is very far away from theirs. And if people expect to live in a way that is so unacceptable to the French, perhaps France is not the best place for them to live.

Why do tits need to be held in a place, surely they find their own place?

Why is it unacceptable, in our culture, to have your tits swinging naturally?

What about crippling shoes? Women in our culture totter about in ridiculous shoes that restrict movement and damage our feet. Why would anyone 'choose' such a painful and restrictive dress code?

Many western women accept these limitations happily as part of our public image, yet the minute the door's shut, the bra is whipped off and it's crocs or slippers.

It seems a perfectly reasonable comparision to me.

Then perhaps France should have thought about that before dominating North African countries.

you said muslim women are mostly oppressed.

Well said Wubbly. I don't think a lot of posters realise they are in a patriarchal web of nonsense even though they don't wear the burka !!

Women in Britain EVERY single day go out of their way to please men the minute they leave their house.

It grates me...it really does..education is key... and time..but you cannot legislate love or respect and that is what France is trying to do..it will imo drive some women underground...virtual prisoners..do you really think they will say their husbands forced them to wear the Burkha?....I don't think this was well thought out at all , just a knee-jerk reaction

Perhaps I should mention that I live in a place with a sizeable Muslim population (Turkish Muslims), and until recently the burqua was unheard of. Suddely I keep seeing more and more of them. I do not think it is a free choice. I think it comes from pressure within their community.

A bit like exposing breasts. It's pressure from western culture and the advertising conglomerate we're influenced by. Still it won't be banned will it?

good point, wubblybubbly. It would be nice to see the back of high heeled shoes too. Thank goodness they are not part of religion, and I can hope they might go out of fashion.

yes, that's true, re exposing breasts, Lady. Perhaps I can just hope that lots of things will go out of fashion!

mostly they are

why not admit that it happens instead of utter denial?