To be Disturbed by this woman in a Burka? ......

[Gingefringe]

I saw a very strange event in Debenhams make-up counter this week-end which on reflection, I found very disturbing.
A woman in a full burka (including her eyes covered in thin veil) came up to the make-up counter with a man (presumably DH). The man then proceeded to ask about foundation for the woman and had a conversation with the sales assistant which rarely included the woman at all (apart from trying on a sample colour on her hand).
I felt so sorry for the poor woman - not only to be forced to wear this ridiculous veil but she wasn't allowed even to chose her own make-up!
I did give the man my best evil looks but he didn't seem to notice - perhaps because I was a woman!! I was too cowardly to say anything.

On the day that France bans the burka I wonder whether you would have said anything?

Freedom to express yourself in anyway you wish, unless you're a muslim country.

enjinsky where did you et social interaction is limited and education is limited, the majorit of niqaabis i know decided to wear it while at university#! lol and that is a presumption why would education be limited? as for social interaction why would that be limited? when i see niqaabis in the street or school ates i talk to them same way i would anyone else, if you dont thats your issue not theirs, and niqaabis o to mother and toddler roups, they work, study etc so have same interaction except they dont socialise with men

France has banned it so live by it.

England has not mores the pity so wear it.

So now it's about living in the western way eh?..so no oppression here huh?..if you read what i said earlier I agree it's about education...

Should be all be wearing flat caps and getting from a to b in red double deckers? What is the Western way...please define it for me.

Ladyof the manor

HOW DARE YOU SUGGEST THAT I GO AROUND SHOWING MY BREASTS?

YOU ARE REVEALING YOURSELF A RACIST NOW

Goodbye- It won't be banned here, so you'll have to make friends with people from the EDL.

Urm, re read my post. I don't recall personally naming you.

Some women wear it because they choose to. Some wear it because they are forced to. And some wear it because they live in a patriarcal society, where men call all the shots, and burka wearing, even if not forced, is one way of gaining male approval.

Either way, it represents an attitude toward women and womens bodies that is surely not acceptable in an era where we are at least striving for equality.

If such extreme modesty of dress were demanded of both men and women, then fine, its your religion, cover up if you must. ALL OF YOU COVER UP.

However, the minute a more stringent standard of modesty, dress and behaviour is demanded of one sex and not the other, then it is immediately unacceptable because it is straightforward sexual discrimination.

Objecting to that has nothing to do with sectarianism or racism, its an objection to a view of womens roles and womens bodies that that people have fought for a century to be rid of. Its like emancipation never happened and i do object to seeing the clock roled back in this country or any other modern democracy.

The day I see a muslim couple tripping down the road in matching burkas (rather than one a pair of jeans and a t shirt and one covered from head to toe), then I will accept it as religious practice and respect their piety. Until that day I will object to the burka and describe the wearing of it as what it is, subjugation.

"they are human beings, just like everyone else"

I guess they are, but you cant actually tell. Could be wombles.

Yeah because the English should ban it too..so those women should feel to stay in their homes...

When did I comment on race or creed? I said the posters who want the burka banned.

The western way is abiding by the law of the land.

lotm.................dont be so cock sure of yourself.

Passport control i just flick it up show my face and be fone,i don't ask togo to a different area. Although some have oulled me to the side to be discreet which was nice of them.

I did get stopped once one the way back from
Holiday,me and dh were followed and then questioned. When i was asked what my job was,and i told them the women was quite shocked and said so you havr a degree? To which i replied and a masters! She assumed and made assumptions about me,just because how me and dh were dressed! They followed us from the plane until we nearly left the passport control.

I have also been stopped, baggage opened,suitcase damage when going to the states, and asked to lift my hijaab so my hairline was visible to make sure it was me in my passport! To be honest when i face hostility i just smile and laugh and dont let it affect me.

Live and let live as i said before

what is it with this allowed, i dont want male friends, and in the work to help vulnerable women, overnors, stay and play, school ates there arent many men even if i did want to, but who would stop me if i did want male friends, and how?

mama2plusbump - you ask where i get my stupid facts from. as i said before its from working with abused women, including muslim abused women
but they arent my facts - they are figures from the police and registered voluntary organisaions that showed the higher than average need for help for abused muslim women which has resulted in additional funding

"they work, study etc so have same interaction except they dont socialise with men"

Ah! and there we have it. How does one work and not socialise with men? What is wrong with men anyway?

Women who wear burkhas can wear high heels at the same time you know!.. and make up too... .

YouaretooniceNOT, what exactly is your complaint?

You think british democratic freedoms should only apply to non muslims, because some muslim countries oppress their own people?

Your arguments make no sense at all.

monty...........WELL SAID.

You are not allowed to have male friends..it isn't a secret..just admit.

You are not being unreasonable, but I think you may have been robbed. Sounds like he was trying to distract you whilst she was stashing it all under her burka.

"The day I see a muslim couple tripping down the road in matching burkas (rather than one a pair of jeans and a t shirt and one covered from head to toe), then I will accept it as religious practice and respect their piety. Until that day I will object to the burka and describe the wearing of it as what it is, subjugation."

Absolutely.

"However, the minute a more stringent standard of modesty, dress and behaviour is demanded of one sex and not the other, then it is immediately unacceptable because it is straightforward sexual discrimination. "

i thouht its allowed for men to walk around topless but not women? or am i missin somethin?

"he day I see a muslim couple tripping down the road in matching burkas (rather than one a pair of jeans and a t shirt and one covered from head to toe), then I will accept it as religious practice and respect their piety. Until that day I will object to the burka and describe the wearing of it as what it is, subjugation."

thats what i said i would like to have. me and hubby both in jilbaabs/thobe, it is very common here to see couples where man wears thobe/jilbaab like the women, however if i was to force my dh it would be an oppression on him, thats his choice and this is mine, so whats wron with that? he didnt ask me to dress the way i dress, he loves me reardless of how i dress it is irrelevant to him.

Excellent post montysma1