MIL, is she or am i?

[JingleMum]

brief history - we get on well, very different people but we care for eachother. i respect her, she is a good gran to my DD, but she has underminded my authority on a good few occassions but i've always let it go.

1 day per week MIL looks after DD for a few hours as i'm working (don't need her to, could put DD in nursery the same as i do the other 2 days that i am working but MIL insists she wants to take care of DD on this particular day)

i informed her last week that we had a day out planned and it fell on the day that MIL usually has DD (my god daughter's birthday day out so couldn't be re-arranged) i wouldn't be working that day but MIL could come up that evening for a visit once we were back from our day out. she says that's fine.

today she tells me that her sister wants to see DD on this particular day, i remind MIL of the plans i have. MIL says i can get on with my plans but she'll have DD and take her to her sisters of course i say no as it will be a lovely day out for DD and my god daughter is really looking forward to it. she then tells me it's the only day convenient for her sister and repeats that she will take DD to sisters. i got a bit pissed off and said "NO, she's coming with me" feel a bit shitty now for being so honest??? but this isn't the first time she has put me on the spot like this. she then tells me that her sister put her on the spot wanting to see DD and now she supposes she'll have to phone her and tell her no.

AIBU or is she?

also, whilst on the subject, MIL holidays quite a lot (3 times per year on average for 2 weeks at a time), leaving me stuck for childcare on this particular day that she insists on taking care of DD. i'm stuck as DP works, as does my mum, sister and aunt. it's gotten to the point where i would rather put DD in nursery on this day as it's just all round easier for me, but if i do this she will insist on another day where she has DD and i don't really want to do that as the time off that i have i want to spend with my child. WWYD in that situation? don't want to upset anyone or cause issues.

SORRY FOR THE LONG POST!!!

thanks guys, i guess she really does have a sense of entitlement. it's strange because she is as nice as pie when she is trying to organise arrangements with me. it's not like "i'm having your DD and that's that" she does it in a nice way, albeit slightly undermining.

MissyKLo it's not that she's blatantly nasty, she plays it differently than that. she just has this look on her face that i can't describe.

i do try to be a good DIL, i don't want to make life difficult for anybody. i know it might not seem like it but we do get on, we have a decent enough relationship but since DD has arived things have changed.

Completely feel for you JingleMum - having a baby really does change the dynamics! If I were you I'd worry a little bit less about being liked, or worrying what she will think if you go against her wishes, and start doing things your way a bit more - hopefully MIL will back off a bit and the balance will be redressed!

She should really be happy that your DD is getting to spend some quality time with her other grandmother - and benefiting from that relationship too! And just because your DM has had her overnight does not mean you owe MIL anything - don't feel obliged to give her extra time because your Mum had her overnight!

She also needs to realise that your daughter may well resent being forced to spend time with her as she gets older and is able to voice her own opinions - the more laid back she is, the more likely it is her GD will want to spend time with her.

Some people are very good at manipulation. Your MIL is not going to say 'I'm having your DD, no matter what', because that strategy won't work. It would put your back up and you would say 'no' outright. So she plays it differently, knowing that it is very hard to say no to someone who is as nice as pie and seemingly very reasonable. But she is playing you nonetheless.

I found that my relationship with my ILs changed when I had my first child. Until that point, I had been quite happy to fit in with them and go along with their way of doing things. Once I had my baby, I wanted to make the parenting decisions, rather than let someone else dominate me. Believe me, my ILs tried. I don't want to project my experiences onto you, because everyone is different, but reading this from the outside, I honestly do think that you have some problems here with your MIl that you have to deal with. You sound like a lovely, caring DIL (you are far nicer than me) but your MIL is taking advantage of your niceness to get what she wants and she seems not to really care how you and your DP feel about it.

"MIL definitely wants time alone with DD, she never wants DP or i to visit the family with them unfortunately. "

But that really isn´t up to her, is it?

Sorry, but it´s starting to sound a bit obsessive tbh.

You had something planned & MIL couldn´t have your daughter on her "usual" day.

If it´s not convenient, I really don´t see why that day has to be "made up" or why you can´t all do something at the weekend-if you must!

MaryThornbar "And just because your DM has had her overnight does not mean you owe MIL anything - don't feel obliged to give her extra time because your Mum had her overnight!" i really need to remember this and not feel any guilt over it. you are so right, i don't owe her anything.

Karmabeliever thank you, i do try and be a good DIL as i know some mothers of sons can feel slightly left out due to DIL being close to their own mothers. i don't really "get it" myself but i know it happens. if you knew me personally you would know that i'm far from a walk over, i do hate hurting people's feelings but if i feel the piss is being taken out of me then i will fight my corner until the other person backs down. it's just this MIL of mine!!! i go out of my way to keep the peace.

diddl she doesn't come out and say "no, you and DP aren't coming" she just doesn't ask us. if we suggest that we will come she tries to put us off

"diddl she doesn't come out and say "no, you and DP aren't coming" she just doesn't ask us. if we suggest that we will come she tries to put us off"

But surely you don´t need her permission to visit family?

And of course she can only take your daughter out without you if you let her.

diddl true, i think it's got to be one of them things were she is just told that we are coming along, not asked.

I think that you maybe give in to her because she "helps you out"

But by the sounds of it she is doing it for herself, so I think it´s OK to sometimes say no, you can´t take DD out, we need/want family time.

(Or if you are feeling generous, ask MIL along too)

Oh & yes, it can be hard especially if your husband is a bit ambivalent.

Once when visiting ILs, MIL wanted to take PFB to see a neighbour.

Fine.

But she couldn´t get the reins on & said "Oh, it´s OK, he´ll hold my hand"

Er, no-that´s why we´ve got the reins.

"Oh, but he´ll do it for Gran, won´t he?"

Well let´s not take the chance!!

So I just got up & went with her.

(They live along a main rd)

diddl i always take DP and his feelings into account. i don't want him to ever think i am being unneccesarily unfair to his parents. he obviously loves them but there was a time, not long ago, when i felt that he would put their feelings before mine (with regards to DD) he is seeing my P.O.V now and that does give me more confidence to put my foot down more.

It can be hard, can´t it?

My MIL was always tiptoed around in case she was told anything that might upset her

Husband was so used to it he couldn´t see it as odd or why I might find it hard.

Not that I wanted to deliberately upset her of course.

Ended up with me saying virtually nothing as by the time I´d mulled it over, the moment had passed

But of course, she was in the habit of saying anything to anyone without any thought for their feelings at all!

But that was often overlooked because it was "just the way she is"

stayfrosty yes, it was me who had the situation with the dog (MIL took DD to her home behind my back) although i have name changed since then.

we agreed after that "incident" that she must carry her mobile so we can contact her to see where she is. also she must give us the home number of whoever she is visitng that day with DD and we ring and check everything is ok and that she is actually is where she said she would be. it's worked fine up to now. i honestly don't believe she would risk it again as she was told by both DP and i that she would never have unsupervised access again if she lied.

thanks stayfrosty it's always good to see it from an outsiders point of view, because sometimes i worry that it's me being a bit unreasonable. it's the way she does it, she's nicey nice about it all, full of apologies if she oversteps the boundary (as in the case of the dog) and i always look like the bad one.

you are right with "every time you set a boundary she has to push it" i'm starting to notice the pattern now.

i'm just waiting for the next push of the boundary because i've quite honestly had enough and will be letting her know. you've all been a big help with your advice so far, so thank you.

stayfrosty do you know what? she actually doesn't seem to be like this with other people in her life. i've never known her to fall out with anyone. the only issues i'm aware of are that her 2 sons didn't really see her MIL (their grandmother) i know that MIL didn't really get on with FIL's family and she never visited them, but would allow FIL to take the boys occassionally for a visit. MIL's family, however, practically raised her boys. could this be why she is the way she is? she's scared that this could happen to her as the MIL?

just want to add, she gets on ok now with FIL's family and actually sees them socially occassionally, it was just when the boys were babies and children. MIL has never told me this, FIL did in confidence.

stayfrost wow, it's getting rather complex now isn't it? it's nice that you think i seem kind and tolerant, as i said before, i sometimes wonder if it is me being slightly unreasonable?

FIL is around. lovely man but very docile. we get on well, but i don't trust him alone with DD (dropped her on her head at 6 weeks old amongst other slightly dangerous things!) but yeah, we get on well.

a couple of months ago, out of the blue, he started telling me how he regrets not seeing his mother more, how he wishes his boys would have been closer to her. he actually said it was his biggest regret in life i tried to push him for me but then he kind of backed off before asking me to swear that i wouldn't repeat what had been said. he also mentioned how MIL never really visted his mother and how things were different back then?

push him for more, not push him for me!

Sounds to me like he is warning you in his own way. He is basically saying that your MIL cut him and his children off from his own family and is trying to tell you not to let her do this to your family. Already she is trying to take over your DD and keep her from your own mother. She honestly doesn't respect you as the most important person in your DDs and DPs lives and keeps asserting her own authority.

I remember your other thread too and if this was me I would not wait for something else to happen. stayfrosty said earlier that every time you set a boundary she pushes it. I think the time has come to take control back. I would end this one to one time except as an occasional thing, like you do with your own mum and I would simply no longer allow her to decide what happens and when. You don't have to explain this or justify it to her. The more I read, the more I think this woman should have minimal involvement and that this would be the best thing for your DD and for your relationship with DP.

god, it sounds so strange seeing it from this P.O.V. she really seems so lovely to those that meet her and i'm finding it difficult to get my head around the fact that she could be that much of a game player? i just thought that she was a little over enthusiastic with DD and was starting to undermine me without realising.

i have had thoughts that there's more to her than meets the eye, when i've mentioned to DP that i think that a bit of game playing may be going on, he just won't have it. he says no way, she's a lovely woman and is not like that. he thinks she's a bit of a saint to be honest.

the whole thing with my mum... MIL knows how close i am to her and knows she has my DD overnight occassionally. she doesn't actually say anything about it, it's just this look on her face as if she's trying to act like she's not bothered but clearly is? my DD adores my mother and they have a great relationship even though mum doesn't always get weekly one on one time with DD, so that proves to me that a grandparent doesn't always need that with a grandchild for them to both enjoy a great relationship.

Have you talked to your mum about this? it might be helpful to you to get her take on things, because she knows all the people concerned.

Wrt your DP, I think he won't see a problem because he loves his mum and also he doesn't want to see it.

It's a hard thing to fight because manipulative people are very good at presenting their best face to the world, which means that you can't judge them by what they say, only by what they do. Looking at this thread,no matter what your MIL is saying, she ends up doing precisely what she wants.

I am very cynical and mistrustful (have been on the receiving end of manipulative ILs), so I really would urge you to have a chat with your mum and get her perspective.