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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to be fed up that we still have Page 3 in 2011?

302 replies

JessinAvalon · 16/02/2011 11:30

If you are too, please vote for 38 Degrees to take it on as a campaign.

38degrees.uservoice.com/forums/78585-campaign-suggestions/suggestions/1492713-banning-page-3-as-it-symbolises-the-sexism-misogy?ref=comments

OP posts:

freshmint · 16/02/2011 20:00

what about my choice of not wanting to be abused by builders who see that in the papers and think its ok to treat women like a pair of walking tits?

go topless as much as you want, just don't put it in a national newspaper

PlanetEarth · 16/02/2011 20:01

Guess we all have our own interpretations of feminism but I for one don't believe that feminists have suffered years of struggle in order to allow us the choice to bare our breasts for drooling men .

LadyOfTheManor · 16/02/2011 20:02

Isn't that the whole point? They "struggled" for years for that very reason, so we can have the choice to do whatever the hell we want with our breasts?

I believe men treated women a certain way before page 3 was around.

NonnoMum · 16/02/2011 20:03

Regardless of the ethics of it, it just seems incredibly DATED. It would be like putting on the TV and seeing the Black and White Minstrel show on prime time.

Time to go.

For so many reasons.

PlanetEarth · 16/02/2011 20:06

But feminists haven't struggle for this, have they? Women have struggled for the vote, for equal pay, for property rights. Never heard of women struggling for the right to strip off for national newspapers.

LadyOfTheManor · 16/02/2011 20:10

I don't believe women have "struggled" to create a hierarchy of women who try to restrict the rights of other women.

doggiesayswoof · 16/02/2011 20:10

YANBU at all. I hate it.

And can we please get rid of the myth that feminism is only about women having the freedom to make choices? There seems to be a belief that any choice made by a woman is a good one, by definition, because she is fortunate enough to have the freedom to make it. Some choices are shit and anti-women.

doggiesayswoof · 16/02/2011 20:12

yy Nonnomum - it makes me think of Jim Davidson.

SardineQueen · 16/02/2011 20:13

Feminists struggle for equality, an end to gender based discrimination, stopping male on female violence and rape, that sort of thing.

In our society, which is not equal, and where women are subjected to sexual harrassment by random men from puberty through to menopause, with little recourse, page 3 is not fine. It perpetuates the idea that the point of women is for men to look at, that a woman's worth is nothing more than how aroused she can make a man feel, it makes many women feel uncomfortable when they are simply going about their daily business.

I wonder, the people defending it, would you honestly be really sad to see it go? Would it spoil your day not to be able to have a look at some breasts in your morning paper? Why does it mean so much to you?

giyadas · 16/02/2011 20:13

I'm going to go out on a limb here and claim that if feminism hadn't existed, we could probably have relied on men to fight for our right to bare our tits in a national newspaper.

LadyOfTheManor · 16/02/2011 20:14

Sardine- I don't read The Sun so I don't care.

ifancyashandy · 16/02/2011 20:18

FFS.

Pankhurst, Simone, Germaine et al were not campaigning for the right to sell ones body or not.

It was / is about the right to be seen as an equal. As a woman who is not seen as either sexual / maternal / decorative.

And if you TRUELY believe it's about 'right' to get your baps out on Page Three, then may I suggest this

SardineQueen · 16/02/2011 20:18

Why is "struggled" in speech marks like that?

I don't know my history that well but I do know that women died, were imprisoned, went on hunger strike and so on. I understand that there were marches and violence and arson. That seems like a genuine struggle to me. Rather than a "struggle".

Women have fought for the right for married women to own property, for women to have a right to their children, to divorce, to work. It was fairly recently that rape within marriage was recognised as a crime, that wouldn't have happened without people with women's rights on their minds.

How is all of that so easily dismissed?

SardineQueen · 16/02/2011 20:20

Should say to decent, paid work, rather than just work. Obviously women have always worked.

smugaboo · 16/02/2011 20:20

I don't understand why some posters here are defending page 3 on the basis that its the woman's right to be photographed topless and get paid for it. God, that isn't the point at all.

The point is that soft pornography is wrapped up with daily life. This isn't even a discussion about pornography, it is about the normalisation of the sexualisation of women and girls to the point that it is consumed as part of the daily paper. News, tick. Politics, tick. Sport, tick. Tits, tick. If you think that these kind of things don't feed into a society's expectations of women and perceptions of sexuality, you're mad.

And - I don't know some of you are not more embarrassed by it frankly. Sorry but it makes you look like a nation of giggling school boys. I know these kind of papers are balanced by excellent, world class publications (I also reserve the right to be an intellectual snob) but when so many people read this crap and accept a big pair of fake tits over breakfast, you wonder about British attitudes to sexuality. I do anyway.

SardineQueen · 16/02/2011 20:22

Ladyofthemanor are you positioning yourself as someone who is defending page3 then, which is not what you have been saying previously on teh thread.

ifancyashandy · 16/02/2011 20:25

As an aside - I don't think they have silicone on Page 3 (The Sun anyway). They put it to the readers vote years ago (nice ) and natural won.

May have changed but it did happen back in the early 90's.

Still don't make it right.

JamieLeeCurtis · 16/02/2011 20:28

Lady - no I don't buy the Sun, but I can't the people who are reading it in public, nor the effect it (and the acceptability of existance of it) has on them on wider society.

GColdtimer · 16/02/2011 20:28

Really surprised to see so many women on here who think this outdated shit is fine to have in a so called newspaper. I just can't see that women tied themselves to the railings so that men could leer over a pair of tits whilst eating their bacon sarnie. I thought they campaigned for the right to vote and to be treated equally.

JamieLeeCurtis · 16/02/2011 20:29

Lady - no I don't buy the Sun, but I can't avoid the people who are reading it in public, nor the effect it (and the acceptability of existance of it) has on them and on wider society.

freshmint · 16/02/2011 20:37

sardine queen and glyadas I think I love you

I wish women would take the time to educate themselves about feminism

not spout shit like "pole dancing naked is empowering"

SardineQueen · 16/02/2011 20:42

Oh that's nice freshmint

(Did you know that there is a feminism/women's rights topic on MN? Feel free to pop over if you would like )

giyadas · 16/02/2011 20:54

c'mon over freshmint.

HandDivedScallopsrgreat · 16/02/2011 21:13

YANBU - voted as well.

Unrulysun · 16/02/2011 21:32

Yes twofalls I think I missed the image of la Pankhurst chaining herself to railings for the right to get her thruppennies out in a low-literacy daily. Could someone provide a link?

Choice my arse - some people really don't get equality do they?

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