to wonder what the fuss is regarding Private Schools?

[peppapigandhumf]

A friend has 2 kids at a local prep school. She doesnt really bang on about the school to me etc but i wonder why bother pay for education when schooling is free.

Is it really just about small class sizes and fancy expensive uniforms?

I wouldn't say the gvernemt would see them as not important, but the state can't fund things like instruments for every child that wants to be in an orchestra or international trips. Having a theatre and things like that is not important, until you have a child that is particularly gifted in that area and it can make a worls of difference.

The main advantage of private schools must as others have said be class size......especially at primary. But some DC do thrive in larger classes. All my 6 went to the same village primary and one went through with a class of 13 another had 46 in his year. Surprisingly the class of 13 was more trouble than the class of 46!

It does depend on where you live. In rural areas like ours almost everyone goes to local village primary and then onto the catchment comp......even those with money/very bright DC! It is a proper comprehensive though no 11+.

Would disagree that private schools offer wider range of subjects too. I went to our year 9 options evening this week. the range of subjects on offer was unbelievable.

The taxpayer can't foot the bill for every activity you might want your child to do. State schools do provide 'extras' but often - sadly but realistically - only if the parent can contribute.

Would disagree that private schools offer wider range of subjects too

many it will actually be considerably narrower than a comp - because it'll be basically academic subjects, with some arts/techs, and hardly any '... Studies' type of subjects.

i always assumed that pushy parents send their kids to pvt schools

Agree with nagynolonger re the range of subjects.

The range of hard academic subjects is likely to be wide at highly performing private schools (e.g. every variety of A level and Further Maths, Russian and Mandarin as well as French, Spanish or German etc..) but lots of other interesting subjects are deliberately not offered as they're seen as unlikely to get the pupils into top universities (psychology, media studies, photography etc...).

I'm surprised no-one has mentioned academically selective schooling?

If you have a very academic child, there are many benefits to sending them to a selective school, where their peers will be similarly academic, and the school will be geared up to deal with it.

Certain parts of this country have academically selective state schools (i.e. grammars). Many parts (including London) do not. So, if you want selective schooling in much of the country, you have to pay for it.

No, not just pushy parents.
I suspect that there are some but to dismiss a large number of people as snobby twits is a bit dim isn't it?

I send my dcs to private schools fir a load of reasons. I would have sent them to state schools if there had met the same sort of criteria.

My preference (and ds1s) was for single sex.
I wanted schools in walking distance if poss.
I wanted lots of activities within school time as after school hours are difficult.
I wanted lots of pe/sport.
I wanted good support for academic pupils (dd doesn't need this so much
I wanted really good pastoral support as home life a bit complicated.

I looked at all schools with this things in mind. I ended up with two private. Dd would have gone to a state primary but it was quite a bit further to walk that thevindependent school

nasynolonger I would say that indie schools offer more choice at primary level, but less at GCSE.

The two funnels seem to go in different directions.

Better grades, better start in life - I would want my kids to go to both types of school though...if only to understand the breadth and range of abilities and backgrounds there are.

Some reason why my 2 DS go private:

DH went there and loved it - his fav teacher is now headmaster
Small classes
10 minutes drive away
Excellent clubs
Excellent academic results

I went to state school, loved it, but they wouldn't even consider my boys as I have not brought them up Catholic

Litchick....I'm sure you're right. At primary I did have to pay for private music lessons because all school offered was singing. Mine never did french either put I'm sure they do now in primary. Many say there is no competetive sport in state schools, but mine did loads of sport. A lot depends on the HT.

peppapigandhumf Fri 21-Jan-11 16:01:22
"i always assumed that pushy parents send their kids to pvt schools"

Isn't that as offensive (and stupid) as saying 'I always assumed that parents who send their children to state schools don't care about their education'?

Started both boys off in state schools, a major thing for me was the lack of discipline.

For example, a teacher in my older son's primary school would play Eminem to the class and laugh and joke with them. It was chaos, no homework and bullying was rife.Results were low and the class failed its Ofsted. Nothing was done and complaints were met with the comment that I should consider another school if I wasn't satisfied!

My younger son was in a class where the teacher seemed to have no interest in her job and would play disney films several afternoons a week, even when the weather was lovely and the children could have gone outside.Thank goodness the teaching assistant was excellent, but she was having to do the job of someone who basically couldn't do it/couldn't be bothered.His class failed Ofsted inspection too.

Both at private school now, not what I wanted or would have wished for 5 years ago,but they are thriving there.

smallwhitecat - no, I simply observe that I got better grades at my comp than my colleagues did at private school. Therefore, I infer that they had special needs by comparison. i.e. they would have done even worse in a state school.

It was meant in jest to people who took it in jest.

I must pick up an earlier point that teachers at private schools do not have to be qualified. It is grossly inaccurate and to be honest, very insulting.

Not many people have mentioned the child - but often certain child do better in the private system. Some children are so together and bright they would be able to be left in a jungle and come out with all their gcses.

My situation is a little different - health issues mean that I need all the pastoral care they can give me - hence why we wanted to go into the private system in the first place. Currently my daughter is able to stay at school until 9pm, with lots of clubs and supervised prep.

Of course education should be one size fits all - state schools should provide all we need. But it's not an ideal world.

Be careful though - I have had some very negative experiences too with one school in particular - where academic results were all they cared about. I even had my family doctor (indiscretely) telling us that she treats a lot of girls from that school for stress and depression. So all is not perfect.

Pushy parents? Perhaps - in some cases. But there are children who need pushing - I was an example. My parents were very laissez-faire and I floated.

Personal choice of course but bloody hell, I never ever see myself as better. Why should I? An idiot can spend money, after all. But we have made a personal choice based on our circumstances....

BrianAndHisBalls: that was my assumption as i thought that the state education is better already and you would need a special reason to pay

The kids i know off, who go to Prep Schools seem to be pushed (i suppose they prefer to say we want to achieve maximum potential) so my concern is why are state kids not pushed.

To be fair to teachers and schools, a lot of parents don't want children pushed.

They see it as a bad thing and leap up and down shouting about pressure.

The words hothouse and factory start being used. Anecdotes of colleagues with anorexia and depression start being thrown around like confetti.

There are pushy parents at all schools I would imagine! You can't really avoid them at primary school. It becomes less of a problem at secondary. You only have to survive school peformances and parents' evenings. Maybe school sports is another area pushy parents come to the fore.....could I be one of them.

I think what private schools give people (purely from personal experience) is this extra confidence and the little touches of upper/middle classness that are often required to progress in the UK.

I think they do provide superficially exam results at school, but research seems to indicate that they do less well at university where more self-reliance and talent is required.

Failure to get into two outstanding oversubscribed state schools is why we went private. Personally, I can't wait till my DD is back in the State sector for Sixth Form, so she gets out of this bubble she's been living in, surrounded by friends who live in gorgeous houses, and go on holiday, and have mothers who don't (need to) work and fathers who earn a fortune. Then maybe she'd stop looking down on the rest of her family for being unable to provide all of the above :(

Check out the MN threads on Education!

Wow, I'm amazed by what's not been mentioned:

• better school leadership. School leadership is the single thing most strongly correlated with a school's academic success
• better teachers. Private schools can potentially pay more, and the successful ones do. Teaching quality is also very strongly correlated with a school's academic success
• Less disruption from other children.
• Less chance of your children mixing with other children you don't approve of. People won't own up to this, but by God it's true, as is the converse (more chance of mixing with children you do approve of)

Interestingly, while parents value smaller class sizes, it's not strongly correlated with academic success (esp. if you look internationally).

I think someone else has touched upon this but some public schools can be very good for people who are slightly different in some way.

I was a very eccentric child who was obsessed with reading and I would have been eaten alive at state school.

I went to a very high achieving girls school (a famous one which often has the word hothouse applied to it, and yes anorexia was rife but it was also an all-female environment). One of its boasts was that it fostered individuality and I was certainly more tolerated than I would have been at a state school. Plus the English teacher indulged me utterly with books - I doubt a state school teacher would have had the time.

The sense of entitlement that goes with it has been very useful in projecting an air of confidence and that has definitely helped me 'get on'.

I have never had recourse to the old girl network but it is impressive - a best-selling author, a writer for Vogue, a very successful painter who was on the cover of the Sunday Times Magazine recently, someone else has 3 kids and is a director in a major travel PR company yada yada.

Would they have got on so well without the school? I don't know the answer to that but if you want the best for your children it's very seductive.