Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2 3 4

Original poster

to be concerned about the personal hygiene of my friend and her baby?

76 replies

taintedsnow · 11/12/2010 12:22

Background is that I've known this friend for about 10 years, but we have become closer friends in the past 18 months. She is a lovely person, sweethearted, kind and very loyal.

Problem is, she has appauling personal hygiene. It is bad enough that I am beginning to not want her in my house. I feel terrible about even feeling that way because she's such a nice person and I consider her a close friend, but the smell is unbearable. I find myself holding my breath if she walks past me. It is a combination of body odour and dirt. I don't believe she washes her clothes very often if at all tbh.

The same thing seems to be happening with her DS. He is a baby and she claims to be bathing him nightly but he always has a certain scent to him and it isn't nice. It's not a pooey smell, it's a definite unwashed smell. I can't work out whether it's coming from his clothes (which never look clean) or from being held by his mum IYSWIM.

Their home is quite dirty as well. I don't think it gets cleaned and smells very bad also. I limit the amount of time I spend in there and do not take DN with me when I go. There is cat poo on the floor and dirty nappies strewn everywhere, for example.

What can I do? I feel awful to be even talking about this, but the smell my friend brings in with her when she comes to my house is getting quite unbearable. My DN is not a huggy child with other people, so it's not such an issue with him, but I know she'll want to hold my baby and she's so lovely and know she'll make a great 'aunt' if not for these issues.

How do I handle this? I can't bear the idea of hurting her feelings by telling her how bad she smells, but for her sake as much as anyone else's, it's not in my nature to let things deteriorate further.

OP posts:

PonceyMcPonce · 11/12/2010 12:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

EricNorthpolesChristmas · 11/12/2010 12:27

I think you have to risk hurting her feelings. Has she always been like this, or has it got worse recently? Could she be depressed or not coping well? Of course she might just be a minger, but IME people who have very poor personal hygeine always have a psychological reason why...poor self esteem, depression, abuse history or similar. With my clients I find a direct but kind approach is best. Offer practical support, help her with a deep clean, help her make a schedule for laundry etc. It's hard but it may need a good friend to help her sort it out.

TottWriter · 11/12/2010 12:29

Well if there is cat poo and dirty nappies on the floor, that is a massive health concern for her baby, and you need to say something. To someone. Anyone.

Faecal matter lying around the house is putting her child at risk from some pretty horrible illnesses. She would need help to re-educate her about what is an acceptable living condition. Untidiness is one thing and not to be judged by others. Literally having shit on the floor is a big no no. That's a welfare concern IMO.

Has she always been this bad, or has it begun to get worse recently? In other words, is it a problem with her upbringing and education, or could it be apathy or lethargy about everything brought on by undiagnosed PND?

Either way, I think your friend needs help, from you or from a social worker. If the situation really is as you decribe, there's only so much that her feelings can come into it.

Original poster

taintedsnow · 11/12/2010 12:31

Thanks for responses. :)

As to whether to has always been like this....I think to some degree, yes. She has never been a person who takes pride in her appearance, other than her weight.

I've dropped hints about the HV having an issue with the state of the house before, but she will clean once and then it won't get done again. I've also helped her clean the house on occasion, but unless I'm up her arse about it, I know it will just get back into the state it was before, she simply will not maintain the cleanliness.

I always want to strip her DS's clothes off him and wash them and him whenever he is with me. :(

OP posts:

Original poster

taintedsnow · 11/12/2010 12:32

As to whether to she, is what I meant.

OP posts:

sarah293 · 11/12/2010 12:33

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

BoysAreLikeDogs · 11/12/2010 12:35

living in squalid conditions is a form of neglect

I think you need to contact her HV to get her some help - she might have PND, or be able to access a Home Start volunteer

Original poster

taintedsnow · 11/12/2010 12:43

How would I contact the HV? I have no idea how to get in touch with her or even find out who she is, as my friend lives outside my local district IYSWIM. Also, would they be able to help her without the involvement of SS? I know it's a bad situation, and that the baby must be the priority, but it would obviously be better if things would get resolved without SS having to be informed.

OP posts:

BoysAreLikeDogs · 11/12/2010 12:51

SS involvement is not always bad

Sorry, I made an assumption that your friend lived close by and that you knew which was her GP surgery/centre where the HVs are based and so could easily contact

ModreB · 11/12/2010 13:15

Can I agree that SS involvement is not always bad. They will be able to refer her to support services that she needs, from what you say there is a definate need for support here.

Original poster

taintedsnow · 11/12/2010 13:24

Do you think I should contact SS? Would that make me a terrible friend for doing that? If I thought I could make a difference by just talking to her myself, I think I'd suck it up and do it. But she hasn't taken hints or kept things clean before.

I don't know what to do, but I know her DS is going to suffer if someone doesn't do something.

OP posts:

geraldinetheluckygoat · 11/12/2010 13:25

Is there any way you could just have a really frank discussion about it? In a "I'm really worried about you and the baby" way? It's very difficult, I would definitely struggle to bring this up too.
At the end of the day though, if this carries on, the little one is going to get bullied at school for being smelly and dirty and that would be horrid.

geraldinetheluckygoat · 11/12/2010 13:25

Does she have any other visitors to the house?

BoysAreLikeDogs · 11/12/2010 13:28

no you will not be a terrible friend, in fact the opposite, you have the best interests of her baby in your heart

why not ring NSPCC and chat to them, get RL pointers as to how to help

here you go

BellyLikeABowlFullOfJelly · 11/12/2010 13:29

If you are sure you've always noticed the dirty smell on her (AND NOT JUST SINCE GETTING PREGNANT!!) I would contact SS, they won't take a child away just because of an untidy house but it might push her in to keeping it clean

Original poster

taintedsnow · 11/12/2010 13:33

She doesn't have many visitors at all really, she doesn't have much in the way of friends or family, but those she does have live in my area, so she generally drives over this way and sees a few people a day, which actually does make sense I think, but it means not many people see the state of her home.

I've always said to myself, kidding myself probably, that if her DS got to nursery age and nothing improved, I would definitely say something as I would never want to see him shunned by other children for being smelly. But it's since I've realised the prospect of my friend holding my baby almost repulses me that I've thought I can't leave this unsaid until then.

I think she'd be devastated if I said anything directly to her, and I don't want to push her away (which is what I suspect the result may be), I just want her to realise things can't carry on like this.

OP posts:

melezka · 11/12/2010 13:34

Used to live in a town where a lot of people had similar hygiene issues - because, they said, once you stop putting all those nasty chemicals on your body it went into a kind of homeostatic self-cleaning mode, and did not smell.

Perhaps they couldn't smell themselves because they'd got used to it. But it always made us cringe no matter how much we liked the people concerned.

Maybe you really do need to tell her. She'll be getting judged on all kinds of levels and it won't be making anything easier for her.

scouserabroad · 11/12/2010 13:36

You def should say something. I had this problem with a neighbour (see thread ) and his problem was more extreme than your friends', but it's a problem that isn't going to go away on it's own. As everyone says if there is cat poo on the floor & dirty nappies lying around it's a hygiene issue, not just lack of tidyness.

I would try to talk to her about it first, but if that doesn't work try social services / HV. As someone else said, SS will probably just try to help her in the first instance.

Pancakeflipper · 11/12/2010 13:38

Depending on where you live there may be help available. Do you have a SureStart centre or a centre to assist families struggling? The HV and SS will know.

A few years ago I knew someone suddenly struggling and SS provided a person whom came round and helped her get on top of her life again. This included sorting her home out. Cleaning, putting clutter into crates. And this person gave her rota to keep on top of it and returned o visit until on track again. Though this was in Bristol and not sure if available everywhere.

CuddlyNotFat · 11/12/2010 13:47

Is she the same person as the lady who posted about not bathing her son for a month and her not washing for a week because she was waiting for a parcel?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/1102874-To-not-bath-my-son-in-a-month

ISNT · 11/12/2010 14:01

That's what I was wondering cuddly.

OP if I were you, I would sit her down and talk to her openly and seriously before contacting outside agencies.

Original poster

taintedsnow · 11/12/2010 14:18

Thank you again for the responses.

I believe SureStart do operate in her area, though I will look into it.

Definitely not the same person as the bathing situation. :)

Would it be terribly passive-aggressive to buy my friend a Christmas present of fragranced items to have one last shot at this without being confrontational about it?

OP posts:

loopylou6 · 11/12/2010 14:19

I think you'd be snide going to SS behind her back. if I where you I'd just say to her ' bloody help mate, you need to change you washing powder that smells rank'

brabbinsandfyffe · 11/12/2010 14:25

Personally I would not do the frangranced Christmas present thing, if it was me I'd feel much better if someone said 'look, i'm really sorry about saying this, but....' rather than be indirect about it. That's just my take though.

ISNT · 11/12/2010 14:26

I don't think you should hint at her, it hasn't worked in the past.

can't you just sit down and talk to her properly?

Flip

1 2 3 4