To want DSD to have an abortion?

[TessoftheDamned]

Heavy going stuff but really doubting myself on this.

DSD is 14 and we thought was a straight-laced girl, very into her studies, hardly ever goes out, etc. Anyway, has fallen pregnant and just had the nerve to tell us (lives with us full-time, her mother is not in the picture). The guy is 'long gone' as she says, refuses to tell us his name or where she met him. To be honest I'm a bit worried there was some pressure and perhaps even date rape thing going on, but I haven't pushed it as she's very vulnerable at the moment (as one might expect).

She is adamant she is keeping her baby. Although I'm sure it will end up looking to us as parents and her as a sister, we don't want another baby and don't want to look after hers. She's not an adult but it is her body, I'm so torn. I feel like she's doing herself and everyone else a great disservice bringing this heartache, but of course a baby is normally a source of joy...

DH is flabbergasted and shocked, he's still trying to find out who the boy is (she told us 3 days ago). She clams up when we suggest anything other than keeping the baby and refuses to speak to us.

AIBU?

Who was pushing for the girl to travel for the abortion then arses? Her parents?

i have this voice in my head reminding me of something i've read in the past about young mothers. i can't ref it i'm afraid but it was sdomething along the lines of girls with difficult family circumstances, especially to do with poor attachement to their own mothers are much much more like to get pregnant and keep the baby, simply because it 1, and issue only they can control and 2, despite everything, the baby is theirs and this cannto be disputed.

No, CY, you can't force a person to have an abortion.

Poor OP. Bet she's a wreck just now.

sungirl - I amsure that is correct. Certainly over a third of all female care leavers, leave care preganant or with a child.

litchick - exactly. at some point they give up waiting for a fmaily to come to them and create their own. and actually if thats the only perceived negative outcome of growing up in care then thats not too bad. plenty of kids in care do a lot worse than become young parents :-(

arses

I'm not sure the subsequent torment of the girl at the centre of the X case sheds much light, unless the OP's DSD has been raped by a much older friend of the family, and is now at the centre of an incredibly ugly media storm.

expat said:

'Making choices comes with consequenced and responsibilities, and a decent person tries his best to minimise the negative consequences that his decisons may have on others.'

That sums it all up. This girl is still behaving like a child, in that she isn't thinking about the bigger picture and the long-term consequences of her actions on others, Because she is a child, she can't see further that what she wants now.

Many many grown women, I'm sure, have terminations they don't really want because they have made a mistake, and whilst they may love, in an ideal world, to have the baby, they sacrifice the pregnancy for the greater good of the rest of the family - maybe they already live in overcrowded housing and cannot afford to upgrade. Maybe they can't afford any more childcare be equally can't afford to stay at home. Maybe DH is under the threat of redundancy, or is ill, maybe they sense the relationship is on its last legs and they don't want to bring a child into a doomed relationship - any number of reasons will force decent women to make difficult but ultimately sensible choices about planning or limiting their family every day - because it isn't all about them.

But life goes on. Believe me they are not ALL going crazy with grief for ten years afterwards. I think the people who claim it has given them serious mental health issues were vulnerable to start with and are looking for a reason, or someone to blame. If it hadn't been that it would have been something else. If they'd had the child they would probably have had severe PND.

Termination is never an easy or palatable choice to make, but sometimes it is the only right thing to do under the circumstances, and a damn sight more palatable than the alternative.

One thing is for sure though - there is no time to lose. If she decides to terminate she needs to do it sooner rather than later.

Short article from Wiki here The background was that Ireland had already passed an amendment to the constitution (8th amendment) making it impossible to change the constitution wrt abortion by judicial action -- change required a referendum. The issue of abortion rights has been in the air throughout the late 80s, with pro life and pro choice groups each campaigning hard for their respective povs. The X case was the occasion when it all came to a head, with the attorney general lobbing the issue into the hot seat. Her parents wanted her to have an abortion, which necessitated travel to the UK, as she has expressed suicidal thoughts. They asked the Gardai before they left for Britain if DNA from the foetus could be used as evidence against the rapist (hence the case got booted up to the AG). Once the case was publicised the two sides of the debate lined up opposite each other in full battle gear.

The rapist eventually only got 4 years.

It's obviously difficult to comment. I didn't even know this girl that well and only for a very short period of time in my life.. I knew her story through a mutual friend but she knew that I knew, so she would talk about it/make reference to it. It was a strange situation, as really the only reason I really knew was because our mutual friend was in dire straits with reference to mental health etc and so we would have three-way conversations/mini-interventions through which I learned a lot about her, yet we weren't, strictly speaking, friends? If that makes sense.. it just made me change a lot of my opinions/made me realise the complexity of something like abortion. It's rarely the easy choice, even where it seems intuitively the obvious one.

altinkum - yeh us too. perhaps dsd feels like and outsider in this family (just speculating), in addition to the absent mother. lots of text book stuff going on there. sigh.

Spidookly, you never met a more normal, together person: it's easy to assume that the dire circumstances she found herself in make her experiences irrelevant with reference to other situations, but there are posters above who have said they had abortions against their will and suffered fall-out. She just expressed a sense of loss in relation to the pregnancy that surprised me as she was the very example, in my teenage mind, of the "best" reason to have an abortion. My point is that, despite the fact of the rape/media hype etc, she still had feelings in relation to the pregnancy.

GHH, I think it's really insulting to suggest that anyone who grieves an abortion has underlying mental health issues. It's a different experience for different women and in different contexts.

Adoption? Yes, the child has the right to decide whether she has the abortion or not, but surely the parents have an equal right to say they are NOT bringing the baby up or supporting her decision to keep the baby.

scaredandalone - god how awful for you. i am so sorry for your experience. i think you are right too. claiming that women who have mental health issues post abortion were vulnerable to start with is horseshit indeed.

Thanks sungirltan

Scared, your story is horrendous. You were assaulted. Twice. Once when you were raped and again when you were forced into having an abortion.

However, Headless emphasises that not all of us (women who chose to terminate their pregnancies) are traumatised. She didn't suggest that you weren't.

Surely the OP won't have Parental Responsibility as the stepmum though, altkinkum. The dad might but he doesn't seem to be the one in favour of kicking the girl out.

I agree not all are traumatised mainly those who feel they had no choice will be traumatised which is my main point. Most will feel relief as they chose to terminate.

But the suggestion has been made many times to alert the DSD to the suffering this will cause her brothers and step mum which if she is anything like me will mean there is no choice for her. I love my sister so much I could not ask her to pay the price for me and DSD probably wont let her brothers and mum pay the price for her either in which case DSD may just feel exactly like me if she terminates . Which is why she should be offered unbiased facts to help her do what is best for her not guilt tripped with stories of how much this will hurt others.

Being kicked out not a problem hurting someone you love means there is no choice.

Thanks altinkum I know logically why my mum did what she did she felt at 15 I could not be responsible enough to look after a child let alone one through rape she did what she thought was best (she was wrong) Which is why I think DSD should make this decision as only she knows what is best for her and her feelings.

Placing the burden of the future of the family unit on this girl's shoulders is not fair, or adult, imo.

Can I suggest there may be one more option IF the OP (and her DH) would be willing to make some sacrifices (but not to the extent she fears)

Lay it on the line to her. Explain how hard it will be and how she is signing up to have a baby for life.

Ask her directly what she will do if she's in your situation in 15 years time.

But then tell her she isn't alone and you and her dad will support her as much as you are able. That means being around for practical and emotional support for the first six weeks and then some form of childcare support up until she is 16 (you can even draw up a contract). Make it very clear you will never be the baby's primary carer.

Because when she is 16 you will be expecting big changes - her moving out, getting a job or otherwise supporting herself, and you will do no more than the average doting grandma.

Then remind her she has a choice.

And you tell your DH that, and that if that doesn't happen, you wil be considering whether you can live like that.

Is that an option, do you think?