To be fed up with 'expats'...

[EveWasFramed72]

I am an American, living here in England with my British husband and children (who have both nationalities, but have only lived in England). I've been here for 4 years, and when we were first here, I was miserable;I was at home full time with a new baby, then preganant running after a toddler, basically no close friends, etc. I pulled myself up by the bootstraps and got myself a life: went to uni, got a job, driving licence and created a life for myself outside of my husband. Now, I love our life here, I have loads of friends, a job I like, etc.

But...I am part of a group of American women living in the UK, some of whom have been here longer than me, married to British men. They won't drive, work, survive without several care packages of food from home(because they can't possibly eat what's on offer in England), basically, they sit around and moan about England, and how much better EVERYTHING is at home.

Now, I love my home country, and I do get homesick sometimes, but I just find myself fed up with these women who have given up on life because they are living abroad (and didn't they REALISE that marrying someone from another country means living in said country at some point???). When they aren't moaning, I do enjoy them...it IS nice to have home connections, but this attitude of deliberately NOT acclimating drives me nuts , and I feel like they make the rest of us who enjoy life in England look bad!!!

Rant over...I know, you're going to tell me to cut them off...and I have largely...just not completely.

I just want to know if this is 'typical' expat behaviour?????

I agree with you strandedatsea. Although I am not British, I do not consider myself an expat here. I am married to an English man and have children, I have no intention to move back to the Netherlands.

However, we have lived on a small Caribbean Island as expats for a few years and had the same experience as you. Locals don't want to make friends with you because you are very likely to move on and it isn't worth the effort. And expat friends, I found, were very much easy-come easy-go for the same reason.

I found the two experiences completely different.

oooh oooh oooh which small Caribbean island? Could it be this one? (SL)

Curacao?

Nope and nope!

It was CI

Aaah yes I have visited and it's quite a strange place. Quite similar to here although I think there were more expats there.

we were in Curacao for two years and there was not much mingling between locals and expats. Think the locals were a bit bemused, watching the expats come, flitter about and leave

It was not antagonistic but strangely two parallel worlds.

Very expatty in CI. Never been to SL, but a friend of mine has been there for a little while but couldn't settle there. She felt unsafe? And I suspect it is a lot prettier than CI.

Yes, same in CI ZZZ. Two parallel worlds, good way of describing it.

Lots of points resonate here.

I think you do yourself so much damage by essentially putting your life on hold and not integrating even slightly. Having said that, it was really, really hard to feel any warmth for the US (sorry yanks) when I arrived there from Ireland at the end of the Reagan era. It took me a while to get used to the mindset there and the complete lack of any shared cultural assumptions much more than the practical aspects of day to day living.

It really takes no time at all to figure out what food to buy and what cleaning products will do what you think they'll do. Polish, Irish and Mexican shops carry familiar European brands and indispensable items like nylon sieves that you don't find in national US chains -- including blackcurrant flavoured drinks and other goodies (Polish), Blackcurrants.

But the comment from Blackcurrants about even the Democrats being little better than slightly diluted Tories rang so true -- the basic assumptions about life and society are not shared at all between Europe and the US. You could go out dressed as a socialist at Hallowe'en and some people would be genuinely afraid of you. I imagine some of Eve's acquaintances are feeling the same sort of culture shock in reverse.

On a purely human, personal level, contact with family and friends became so much easier and so much more frequent when the internet took off, I can't imagine anyone feeling really cut off and craving home to the extent they seem to when there's skype, etc.

I'm not worried about the DCs seeing themselves as American they're still my DCs after all but I come from an Irish family that has globetrotted for generations (and have many relatives who have encountered difficulties getting Irish passports in such far flung places as Argentina, Uruguay, and SA -- the SA-born family had the added complication that their father, my uncle, was born to Irish parents [one of whom was born in Argentina though] before Irish independence, in what is now Pakistan, but was then part of the Indian Empire...) yet managed to retain a strong sense of being Irish. I can talk baseball with the best of them, but if that part of my life was gone tomorrow I wouldn't miss it. I'd still like to think the DCs would feel at home some time in Europe, and that involves being more than a little counter-cultural and expressing opinions that are seen as really way out in the US. And making them all try Marmite.

Good post, but I really loved this bit:

"You could go out dressed as a socialist at Hallowe'en and some people would be genuinely afraid of you".

How do you dress as a socialist? LOL

I've heard the same comments about American's views on the "left" as well. I have a uni friend who is kind of New Labour-y (very centrist), but in the US is considered to be super left-wing (apart from Berkeley, where she said she adopted some right wing views just to piss off the extreme hippies).

Interesting, and I agree that there is a difference between an expat and someone who moves permanently to another country.

I have done both, the permanent move to Germany where I was fully integrated.

The expat experience where I have little contact with Suisse locals - although we have more than most as our DC go to local schools.

I expect that the experience differs greatly when a family lives in one of the parents home countries, in comparison to both being foreigners in the host country.

While my French is atrocious, I do understand and can make myself understood. DH, who works for an American Multinational and speaks English all day, has only very basic French. Something that we used to ridicule ex-colleagues for - we said that we intended to be fluent French speakers by the time we leave, and we are far from that aim.

Yes, did you see the Tea Party woman recently, with her comment about socialists and Marxists. Ok, extreme example but it made me laugh at the absurdity.

nice Halloween name, as usual I am not feeling inspired about a name change. Will have to ask dd, she's reading disgusting looking "Goosebump" horror stories these days (wtf? her choice). Bet she has some good ideas. Over lunch she was telling me about a professor in one book who ate the guts of an Egyptian mummy.

Thanks so much dear

Thanks, and how lovely of your DD to share that.

I had forgotten you were in CZ. A friend of mine just returned to Germany from CZ, her family still live there.

Before we moved to Switzerland we had Cross Cultural Training. I have posted this on MN before, but it may be new to some of you.

The trainer showed us a graph of the Adjustment Curve, the theory being that when you move to a new country you go through several periods of adjustment.

Phase 1 - Honeymoon
Euphoria, Energy, Differences seem minor, Host culture is new and exciting

Phase 2 - Initial Culture Shock
Increasing sense of confusion, Disroientation, Loss of energy

Phase 3 - Superficial Adjustment
Learning how to survive, Can function within a limited, familiar space

Phase 4 - Depression and Isolation
Losing touch with home culture, Awareness of deep cultural differences, Loss of self-esteem, Loss of support of family and friends, Feeling threatened, Withdrawal, depression, tension, fatigue, homesickness, Stereotyping and hostility toward host nationals

Phase 5 - Compensation and Reintegration
Developing coping behaviour, Less defensive, more accepting, Developing new infrastructure, More open minded, relaxed

Phase 6 - Autonomy and Integration
Learning to value cultural differences, New found self confidence

The curve rises and dips according to your feelings of the moment, eventually settling on a plateau at Phase 6.

Phase 4 is the phase which has the highest rate of expats returning to their own country, of "giving up".

The trainer stressed that it is important to recognise these phases, and that it is normal to feel this way.

That Adjustment Curve is spot on IME.

Mmebody - yes I have seen something similar. I think I was on phase 4 when we decided to go home but now on phase 5 (although we have a very valid reason to be leaving).

Dh - who has to work here - will probably be forever stuck somewhere between phase 2 and 3 so it's a good thing we're going!

I am (very unfortunately) acquainted with a New Yorker who is an extreme Republican (I had no idea such things existed, but apparently they do). Anyways, she was going on about "BHO" (as an insult ) and how he's a socialist and a marxist, his crazy marxist ideas about universal healthcare and that George Bush is the greatest president that ever lived, and the US is the best country in the world, EVER.

I nearly slapped her upside the head quite a few times

Arses, Just read your post and wondered if you knew that Morrisons have a largish 'Irish' section if you have one near you, I have a friend whos Irish and he gets Tayto crisps rock shandy,pink lemonade, Barrys tea and white/black pudding from Morrisons.
When i went to Florida in June an American lady standing next to me in the Harry Potter 'English' shop was highly amused when I picked up a box of Twinnings tea bags and declared 'I do miss my English tea'. My brother who moved from U.K. to Chicargo says he misses Hienz beans and sausages....strange what you miss.

MmeBody -- Thank you for posting that list.

I dress as a socialist every morning. Here I am, off do do a little gardening

Salsmum would have thought there was somewhere in Chicago your brother could get Heinz Beans. We used to make regular pilgrimages to Global Foods in St Louis for English chocolate, Ribena and Sarsons vinegar when I lived in the US. Sausages more difficult to get hold of.

Your experiences are pretty typical, Eve.

I never really understood the care package thing as it basically means ultra processed food that can survive the journey. I never understand why expats pay $$$ for things abroad that they would never be seen dead with at home.

However, the important thing for long-term expats with children is to maintain the home culture for the sake of the children. For us, that means occasionally singing the Fifty Nifty song and having a Thanksgiving and 4th of July meal.

The key to being a successful expat is to keep the best of your own culture and ditch the worst, then adopt the best of your new culture and ignore the worst.

mme...here here! I'm an expat who came here for a year or 2 most, and am now married with a son 6 yrs later! I have more than my fair share of rants, but I've chosen to live here and have to make the best of it. I felt, and still do, that my life is acres better than it would be in the Uk, so have a lot to be thankful for really! As for 'care' packages...hell yeah! Visitors now don't need to be told to pack tampax or creme eggs (and as for some bacon.....droool!!)

Heinz beans are available at some World Markets and Harris Teeters on the east coast US. Cost is about $2.00 per can though.