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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think this is a terrible reason to let a child be cold??!

106 replies

lisad123isgoingcrazy · 28/09/2010 20:57

DD2 went to preschool today and they pulled me aside at end and said they had noticed a rash on DD2 arm. I explained its birth mark (mollted one, quite large) but it normally only really shows when cold.
Her reply was "yes well DD2 chose not to wear her coat outside so she might have been cold"! Shock

she chose! shes 3!! make her wear it. She also "chose" not to wear her shoes either so came home with wet socks in her bag.

They had earlier changed her into a short sleeved tshirt as she'd got wet Confused

AIBU? Is this standard practice now??

OP posts:
Rockbird · 28/09/2010 22:53

We went to Center Parcs last year just before Christmas and it was like Santa's grotto, one of the most Christmassy places I've ever seen. Odd time to pick to go there...

Original poster
lisad123isgoingcrazy · 28/09/2010 22:57

yes but christmas is everywhere but at centerparcs we enjoy the pool and the sports.
Why would it be a problem if someone didnt want children colouring in Eid pictures. Surely we live in a place where we can choose to teach our children and bring them up as we see fit.
Have I upset you in previous thread SGB??

OP posts:
cory · 28/09/2010 23:09

"Surely we live in a place where we can choose to teach our children and bring them up as we see fit."

Myeess, but here you are talking about what the nursery are to teach your dc- which is clearly not what you see fit.

Original poster
lisad123isgoingcrazy · 28/09/2010 23:12

i was talking about the earlier comments made about me not allowing my child to celebrate christmas, sorry this thread got very confusing baout half way though Blush

OP posts:
wonka · 28/09/2010 23:12

I think the christmas thing is a differnt matter entirely, are you in a church linked nursery? You should be allowed to opt out in any case.
I would rather Nursery let my child outside (if he's cold he'll ask o go back in for his coat) than fought with him and made a big deal out of the situation.

MilaMae · 28/09/2010 23:13

The religion thing with JW really annoys me.

We're not religious and to be frank would rather my dc didn't have to sit through assemblies but hey ho they have to, errrr not so the JW kids. It really bugs me.

I haven't complained as feel my dc will probably learn something we can't give them and if we all pulled our kids out it would be chaos. So sorry I don't think JW should get preferential treatment, if you don't like it send your dc elsewhere.

Also we're consistently bombarded with JW door stepping and shoving masses of unwanted literature through our door.In my experience JW are more than happy to push their religion onto people(far more forcefully than asking a child to colour in an Xmas card) so perhaps you should be a little more tolerant of other people's religions.

And re the coat if she was cold she'd have said she was and asked for her coat. So on both counts yes you are being unreasonable.

taintedpaint · 28/09/2010 23:18

Sorry if this has already been covered lisa, but is your standpoint that you don't want your DCs taught about Christmas? Or that you don't want them partaking in Christmas-related activities? There's a distinction IMO.

PeterTong · 28/09/2010 23:26

i think lisa is very tolerant. she has her belief system and is happy for hr children to learn about other beliefs - she said so

she takes herchildren out of school the week before xmas break so as not to piss on the other kids party.

ffs give her a break

GrimmaTheNome · 28/09/2010 23:27

MilaMae, if you feel strongly about it you have as much right as a JW to have your kids exempted from assemblies etc. In reality very few apart from JW actually do want to impose their beliefs on their children to the extent of differentiating them from their classmates. But the JWs are not getting preferential treatment. (I'm an atheist btw who wouldn't dream of excluding my child even though some aspects of assemblies annoyed me intensely at primary - as you say, they learn something)

rantyknickers · 28/09/2010 23:27

My DS is 4.5 and spent sunday insisting on wearing shorts and no coat (did have longsleeved tshirt and hooded top) whilst I was wrapped up like a kipper.

He said he wasn't cold.

I think there is an argument to say that children will want to wear their coats when they are cold and forcing them is pointless. Also teachers aren't allowed to force children to do anything really, unless they are a danger to themselves.

The shoes is a bit odd though.

Original poster
lisad123isgoingcrazy · 28/09/2010 23:27

i dont mind her learning about any religion, she needs to understand what others believe especially to be respectful of their beliefs. I just dont want her celebrating/partaking others religious celebrations.

Im not going to agure with anyone on this, your entitled to your opinion. But all I would say is where would you like me to send my child?

OP posts:
DinahRod · 28/09/2010 23:28

JW locally are really sneaky: the one who visits us is an cheery grandfather who really struggles to walk; when he's made it all the way down the drive I feel obliged to stand and chat to him whilst he recovers his breath Grin

Avoiding Christmas is no big deal, lots of people feel like that anyway, JW or no. Teaching a Christmas Carol and avoiding ghosts was a bit of a bugger though!

Back to the OP: say to nursery, feel free to tell dd that if she doesn't wear her coat when it's cold she can't go out to play. That way you sound as if you are supporting the nursery re the discipline of your dd (discipline is the wrong word btw but hopefully you know what I mean) but really you are telling them what to do.

Original poster
lisad123isgoingcrazy · 28/09/2010 23:28

thank you petertong

OP posts:
taintedpaint · 28/09/2010 23:34

Okay, that's pretty much a happy medium for me tbh, and what I would expect from anyone of a religious background.

(I'm interested because one of my close friends grew up JW and when she chose to leave, she was disowned by her parents, think they were probably more extreme than you, she was not exposed to other religions at all)

Some aspects of your religion are a bit Hmm for me (though I could probably say that about most religions tbh), but I think tolerance breeds tolerance IYGWIM.

rantyknickers · 28/09/2010 23:38

Well yes, but noone's toes were going to go black and fall off today were they?

gingernutlover · 29/09/2010 07:10

YANBU about the shoes - that was very silly of them. I could just about understand the coat if it wasnt that cold.

RE: learning about religions, I teach in a christian school where all the the families go to church. As part of the EYFS we have to teach the children about other religions, and at divali that includes making clay divas and indian sweets, at Eid we make Eid cards - it's about multi sensory teaching.

But, if a child was a JW and their parents had asked specifically for them not to do this then we would have to respect their wishes. However, we sometimes do a week long topic on things like this and it would be difficult to totally exclude the child unless they were taken out of school

loveinsuburbia · 29/09/2010 07:23

At my son's nursery they aren't allowed outside if they're not appropriately dressed including hat/sunscreen in summer and coat/wellies etc in colder weather.

gorionine · 29/09/2010 07:37

""how would you "make" a 3yo wear a coat if he/she didn't want to? i wouldn't attempt to force mine - he DOES know when it's cold enough to put it on. if you're in Canada fair enough but it wasn't cold where I am in the UK (admittedly the southern bit).""

You tell them to wear it or to not go outside, simple!Smile

cory · 29/09/2010 07:43

No, of course not, ranty, but I just wonder how it is possible to enforce your will on a 3yo in one country and not in another. Besides, that isn't true either, our childminder here in the UK never had any trouble making our extremely strongwilled dd wear her outdoor clothes or hold onto the buggy or go wherever she had to. But I can't imagine her being abusive in any way: she must have done it by strength of personality. Though if she did stuff dd into her coat, the thought of that wouldn't upset me at all; it's exactly what I would have done, and she was in loco parentis.

sloanypony · 29/09/2010 08:06

That's fine Gorionine, and that's what I would do at home, but you can probably see that that would have given the nursery a ratios problem as someone would have had to stay inside and supervise her? Its the tail wagging the dog.

Cory, fine analogy about Sweeden but I just dont think its relevant to the UK yesterday - I dont think the nursery workers have any magic bullet about getting kids to wear their coats other than they will probably want to!

It just wasn't THAT cold yesterday and whilst it sounds like the OP's child did eventually get a bit chilly she clearly just didn't want to.

I dont think they were terribly bad to not force her, though I do wonder if they tried hard enough, but with the shoes, I feel they should have asked her to sit down and watch until she was willing to put them on, for health and safety reasons (standing on a nail, being stepped on by kids wearing big shoes with traction in her stockinged feet, dropping a bike wheel on her toe and breaking it, etc)

Morloth · 29/09/2010 08:25

Coat wouldn't bother me but shoes would. It isn't really that cold yet so it isn't as if the consequences are anything other than mild temporary discomfort which presumably she will learn about and put her coat on if she feels it.

Unless it is freezing cold I don't insist and I don't carry a coat if I have previously said its cold put your coat on.

Religion thing is completely seperate, we are not particularly religious so it doesn't bother me either way.

cory · 29/09/2010 08:33

"Cory, fine analogy about Sweeden but I just dont think its relevant to the UK yesterday - I dont think the nursery workers have any magic bullet about getting kids to wear their coats other than they will probably want to!"

Do you really suppose all Swedish 3yos understand the effects of hypothermia and want to wear their coats because they are sensible? They wear their coats because the grownups make them. And they wear them long before the weather gets cold enough for there to be any danger of hypothermia. Interestingly enough, you often see whole nursery schools out and about on public transport- they seem to be able to make them do whatever they have to.

I just don't get all this pussy footing around the fact that sometimes adults have to make children do things they do not want to do. You don't have to be harsh or brutal, a bit of brisk jollying along with a firm attitude goes a long way.

SkiHorseWonAWean · 29/09/2010 08:45

The school cannot win. Had they made her (children) wear her coat/shoes there would no doubt some ninny complaining about someone else telling their child what to do or manhandling them. Hmm

sloanypony · 29/09/2010 09:23

Well, obviously if they hadn't even tried brisk jollying along and firm attitude, then they should have! Its really hard to know far they went before saying "well, we can't make her..." as we weren't there.

fedupofnamechanging · 29/09/2010 10:05

I think that it is up to the adult in charge to judge whether it is cold enough for a coat and if the 3 yr old refuses to put one on, then she shouldn't be allowed out to play. At 3 a child isn't old enough to make their own decisions. The adult has to do what's best for the child.

I think you should just pop into the school and ask them to make sure she has her coat and shoes on if she is playing outside in the cold. I don't think she would refuse if her teacher asked her.