... to Protest the Pope?

[stubbornhubby]

A friend of mine told me at the weekend that this will make me an extremist...anyway we had a long thread about this in July and a few people said they'd be keen, like me, to wave a banner as he parades around the country.

There's a big march in London on Sat 18th, Hyde park Corner @ 1.30pm
details here
www.protest-the-pope.org.uk/

Also, if you live in SW London, a Small demo in Strawberry Hill on Fri 17th @9am. (NB official visti website says you will not be able to see the pope arrriving/departing SMUC - I think he must be using helicopter. Or apparating )

and Christopher Hitchins bit in the same debate

This thread is a waste of time, you are not going to change the popes way of thinking, he is elderly and set in his ways.

And as for the teacher comparing, i meant that others also get away with it til they get caught, they are just as bad, so why are people only protesting again the rc church, when there are others equally as bad

Sorry i meant against

Very interesting lal123.

And very difficult to disagree with.
I wonder how many Catholics agree with the points our national treasure makes (I'm not being sarcastic, I just happen to ADORE Mr Fry) and merely wish that the church would catch up?

I think it is fashionable nowerdays to attack Christianity

Child abuse and coverups appear in all walks of life but the Church is easy to attack and no one gets accused of racism

"And as for the teacher comparing, i meant that others also get away with it til they get caught, they are just as bad,"

Sorry, could you tell us about the systematic cover-up of abuse in teaching? It's not just the child abuse that's the problem, it's the refusal to deal with it that angers people. Ratzinger has been told, throughout his career, about abuse and whenever he had the choice between action and inaction, he chose inaction. In the case of Peter Hullerman, Ratzinger looked the other way while a dangerous paedophile who was known to abuse was returned to being a priest, where he offended again. To be clear: Ratzinger knew Hullerman was a predatory paedophile, and knowingly gave him access to children rather than report it to the police.

www.nytimes.com/2010/03/26/world/europe/26church.html

"Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, the future pope and archbishop in Munich at the time, was copied on a memo that informed him that a priest, whom he had approved sending to therapy in 1980 to overcome pedophilia, would be returned to pastoral work within days of beginning psychiatric treatment. The priest was later convicted of molesting boys in another parish."

"The case of the German priest, the Rev. Peter Hullermann, has acquired fresh relevance because it unfolded at a time when Cardinal Ratzinger, who was later put in charge of handling thousands of abuse cases on behalf of the Vatican, was in a position to refer the priest for prosecution, or at least to stop him from coming into contact with children. The German Archdiocese has acknowledged that ?bad mistakes? were made in the handling of Father Hullermann, though it attributed those mistakes to people reporting to Cardinal Ratzinger rather than to the cardinal himself."

Just to say i am not taking sides at all, as i am not a catholic, but will respect some of their views, obviously not the ones mentioned here.

I dont hear of protests towards jehovah witnesses, they are child killers by not allowing blood transfusions, thats just as bad.

I think it's because it's fashionable to vilify catholics at the moment,- it's also very easy.
Good example is the scientist Richard Dawkins,- a professional atheist if there was ever one.

I think you'll find that Richard Dawkins has been a renowned atheist for at least the last 25 years, and probably a lot longer. It's hardly a recent fashion statement.

And on the whole, the current public outrage is directed towards the institution of the Catholic CHURCH, not individual Catholics.

They should at least get him in as a guest judge on The X-Factor while he's here.

"Cheryl, what did you think of The Naughty Boyz?"
"Ah really liked yuz hair and yuz sung the song well, like, pets."
"Pope Benedict, what did you think?"
"In nomine spiritum sanctum, I haff never seen such a libidinous display of disgustink prancink flesh and vanton lechery. It's a Ja from me."

This has got to be said again...

On Later just now, the picture suddenly cut to an elderly man with a controversial past, recently flown in from Switzerland, whom some think is guilty of unforgivable crimes. What? I thought Ratzinger didn't arrive until tomorrow.

Then I realised it was Phil Collins.

Oh bloody hell. Link didn't work.

What cogitoergosum says.

I am a catholic and I do not see an issue with your protest. Everybody has the right to protest. Otherwise we would be in Nazi Germany but lets not get into that!

"I dont hear of protests towards jehovah witnesses, they are child killers by not allowing blood transfusions, thats just as bad."

Yep, against that too.

As I said previously, I don't give a shit what someone believes in. It could be the cult of Ann Widdecombe's big toe for all I care. But the minute someone's religious beliefs start harming another human being, that's when I feel the need to protest.

I don't see myself as a victim, but as a survivor. But I have known children who were in care with me who have never known adulthood, have a family or lived to see justice.
I haven't been able to sleep. I am dumbfounded, sad and angry that this person is coming here and being feted by thousands of people who, because of the vast media coverage, know what has been going on for years and the part played by the hierarchy of the Church in covering up the abuse of children, but still want to wave their little flags and kiss his arse.

I know I won't ever see justice for myself as do many thousands of others before I leave this earth.
I reserve my tears tonight for my little friend who was in the home with me. She had polio and wore calipers. We were at the beach with the nuns. There was an outbreak of jellyfish and we were told to get out of the water. One of her calipers came loose. She was told to go back and get it and she drowned.

Oh marjorie I am so sorry for everything you've been through. I can't really say anything more than that.

Marjorie what you and your peers went through is horrific.

"But the minute someone's religious beliefs start harming another human being, that's when I feel the need to protest."

The thing is Mrs Mad the actual protests will potentially harm another human being. The extent of the road closures are because of the protests and potential risks to the pope.

On the most basic sense a lot of people are going to have a very long and not very comfortable journey to work.

In sense of real harm the elderly around Bellahouston are not going to have access to their day centres. They are not going to have their usual carers visits and meals on wheels. Many of them rely on these visits to eat and take their medication. Which I am sure you will agree that that puts them at risk. The GPs surgery will be closed and they will not have easy access to out of hours centres as the buses are diverted and cars are not allowed. The ambulance service will be under pressure due to resulting congestion to reach any casualty. This will include women in labour who will not be able to be driven to hospital. A baby is definitely innocent.

I am not for one minute saying the pope is right with regard to child abuse and holocaust denial. I just want people to realise that the protests themselves cause problems too.

Bloody hell.

I have been on another thread and heard marjoriew's story, I mentioned that in my post.

I am astounded that when confronted with a post containing such horrifying details of personal abuse, and then a small joke. That a poster would feel the correct course of action is to completely ignore the heartrending details of abuse of the type that has triggered the anger at the pope's visit, and instead pick on her about something else.

That anyone would think this behaviour is appropriate is beyond me.

"Hold on a minute" indeed. Now you hold on and think about what you're doing here. A person who has been abused by the RC church tells their story, they are met with a near deafening silence. They make a tiny joke about the pope, and are castigated. Doesn't that seem to be in line with the sort of attitudes that allowed this abuse to continue unabated for decades?

Have you even read her posts?

Now people are comparing road closures to child rape?

I give up, I really do.

Marjoriew I don't know what there is to say really. I often think about you and wonder if you ever took Dittany up on her offer of a cup of coffee

This thread has been a real eye opener for me, and I am going to bow out I think. I'm not sure there's much point in talking to people who feel this way.

I am NOT comparing road closures to child rape. I said in my post that I do NOT condone that. I said the road closures were putting people's life at risk. I am not castigating people for arguing against the pope. It is marching and causing more problems that I am uncomfortable with. Two wrongs do not make a right. My bit about the road closures was to the OP and those advocating marching. The only part of my post that was directed at marjorie was the comment that what she had gone through was horrific.

I meant to say that if I was Marjorie I would be calling the pope an awful lot worse.

OK xstitch it's just so upsetting, what has happened here