to think this woman is either badly organised or bone idle?

[Rosieeo]

My eldest went back to school yesterday, to reception class. She attended the nursery last year. A woman whose eldest child is in the year above my DC was complaining to us at the gates.

Last year this woman, who has three DC, was consistently late for school. At the earliest running up as the bell went (fair enough) but more often than not 10-15 minutes late. In the end the school gave her a bollocking (they're very hot on timekeeping), wrote to her, had meetings, but it never made a lot of difference.

Yesterday (first day) they were just over 5 minutes late and she said that the teacher had already pulled her up on her timekeeping. She felt that the teacher was out of order and that no one appreciated how difficult it was to get to school for 8.50am with three DC. Her younger ones are about 3 and 1.

I don't have a lot of sympathy, I'm afraid. I know it can be difficult and frustrating getting out of the house in the morning, I honestly do! Plus, I only have two kids. But at the risk of sounding like Miss Smug, I have NO problems getting to school for 8.50am (we're normally up at 6.30/7am) and when I have to be at work we're out the door at 7.45am. That's hard work, but still! This woman lives a ten minute walk from school and doesn't work. I'm not trying to start a SAHM/WOHM debate, just saying that she doesn't then have to get somewhere else.

I didn't say anything, because I don't really know her that well, but AIBU to think that she's either badly organised or bone idle and totally unfair to her son who gets into bother almost every day because of such bad timekeeping?

YABU - I'm not surprised that most here think that you are not though as we are a self selected group of parents with time on their hands :)
Maybe she is bone idle or maybe her life is just harder than yours? How do you know (for example) that she is not the sole carer of 2 elderly parents who she also has to get up each morning?

I think that there is a set time that the head sees all the kids who have signed the late book that week, so that she doesn't get too disturbed by it. ANd it makes it all the more serious in the minds of the kids. Not sure if there isn't also an impact on the amount of Golden Time that they get on a Friday.

Don't know the process in detail as ds has never been late - something about which he is very proud (although his school report last year had one supposed late attendance, but he has never signed the late book and we - and the school - think it was a mistake, with his crapp teacher last year just being careless which line she marked when doing the register).

OP - Agree that it will impact the children's school day, but while it may be down to 'bone idleness' I think others have suggested lots of reasons as to why it might be happening. Her defensiveness doesn't help though but if there's a next time for her moaning you could see if there's anything anyone could do to help, you might get to the bottom of why it happens and even be able to offer constructive or practical advice/assistance.

hobbgoblin You have my sympathies! My parents were the same and I appear to have inherited it. I don't like it about myself, mainly because it is inconsiderate and I would hate to be thought of as such and strive not to be in other ways and it does send out a message that I think my time is more important than someone else's which is not nice. Gradually as I've got older (now 34) and now have an 8month old DS my timekeeping has improved because I need to ensure his needs are met in a timely fashion so scheduling and planning are hopefully becoming second nature.

Unbelievably, most of our being late as a child was due to my mum's OCD cleaning frenzy which would start roughly about the time we were due to be anywhere. Going on holiday was a nightmare!

"mama I have to wake both my DC (4 and 5) pretty much every day for school.

I open their curtains and they get 5 mins of me sitting with them talking to them to try and wake them up then the gloves are off - duvets back, sit them up and if they are still uncooperative they are lifted out of bed and put on the floor.

After a couple of mornings of that they are plenty tired enough by day 2 to be in bed by 6pm. You really need to take some control."

Oh ok i'll try that then, after picking her up and putting her in the car in her PJ's hasn't worked, after telling her no breakfast, we're off. I'm sure it'll be that straight forward as to just pick her up and put her on the floor.

She'd actually just go back to sleep there.
She just isn't tired at night, no matter what we've done in the day, my 8 and 10 year old will fall asleep in the car on the way back from things and she'll chatter all the way home.
The fact is some people aren't morning people and no matter what your mother or your school wants until it matters to you, they aren't moving.

Bone idle OR badly organised. I'm swaying towards badly organised.

As I've mentioned (countless times) I don't really know her, although I can't see what that has to do with 'the right to judge' (what's that all about by the way?)

However, to my knowledge, she has no terminally ill family and her children do not have SN. She hasn't complained of any debilitating conditions that would make it difficult for them to leave the house. Her DH works as a postman, although that would surely make them early.

So why shouldn't I think that her bad organisation is having a negative effect on her child?

I actually didn't feel so judgy when I wrote the OP as I do now!

I feel sorry for her children for if it continues it is likely they who will feel uncomfortable and suffer for it.

My parents were consistently late and I was pulled up on it when I was as young as 5 or 6 by my teacher. They blamed me and I blamed myself (we lived quite a way off and my Mum took me by car). I remember sitting in assembly and saying a prayer that God would make the teacher lenient on me when the inevitable reprimands would come after assembly!

It made an unhappy time far, far worse and wouldn't want my children to suffer a similar fate so I tend to get to school early :).

The point of my contribution is only that the woman herself may be doing her best but when you the personality's of little people to consider it's hard bloody work, not as simple as get up earlier she's a lazy cow.

FFS plenty of people are late for no bloody good reason. Two of my friends just don't see that it's importnat, can't understand that by thinking they have to be ready half an hour before they do they could be on time.

If you're hunting for books pack the book bag the night before and put it somewhere safe, if your child won't get up take off the bed clothes and play loud music, if your child won't get dressed send them to school in PJs, no matter what your circumstances there's no real excuse for lateness everyday....none.

Her DH works as a postman, although that would surely make them early.

That could be your answer then, if she gets woken up by him at 4am then goes back into a deeper sleep than she would have at that time.
They need separate bedrooms.

YABU, for posting about it.

Poor woman, not only does she find it difficult to get her dcs ready for school on time, and she gets a hard time from the teachers, now she's getting judged by a bunch on random people on the internet. Just leave her alone. Stop thinking about her unless you are going to do something to help.

mama I get my DC up at 6 o'bloody clock in the morning so that we can get to school for 9am.

It is a constant battle from the moment I pull back the curtains, they have to chivied and bribed and constantly asked to do absolutely everything.

You cannot argue both ways - your DD obviously needs the sleep which is why she refuses to get up. You allow her to lie in and so she goes to bed late which means she refuses to get up: vicious circle see?

If you make her get up and refuse to allow her to nap in the day after a couple of days she is going to be tired. You just need to shift her body clock forward by an hour or two.

Well, she'll probably never know about the random people on the internet.

I'm not bothering her, believe me! And I'm pretty certain I'm allowed to think what I want, regardless of whether I'm going to help her.

From what I've described, so you think she needs help? Any more than the rest of us mere mortals, I mean?

Sorry, that should be do you think she needs help?

Can we all agree that being late is a problem. For the child and the other children in his class?

In which case the mother needs to get her act together somehow. But if there is a major problem that is causing her to be late regularly that she can't cope with, could the school not be more flexible? I can't see any school continuing to hassle a parent who had some overwhelming issue in her personal life such as elderly parents to care for. Perhaps they could suggest some strategies.

How do you know she isn't on mumsnet?

Our school has a similar system, prettybird.

Consistent tardiness and there's probably going to be social services involved in case that person does need support.

I still have to police both DDs. Stand there, get them dressed, do their hair, brush their teeth, etc.

With DS in tow.

It sucks.

Didn't you know OP MN is a place of helpful virtuous folk who never judge I often wonder how it gets so much traffic with people only talking about their very personal situations.

I'm not bothered in the sense that it affects me, I'm interested in what other people think. I thought that was what AIBU was for?

Fio, you have the same children EVERYDAY though, so surely you accommodate your own circumstances when planning to be anywhere?

I think that's your mistake Rosieeo - AIBU is to ask am I being unreasonable. It's all about asking people what they think about you and your opinion.

It's not ISBU (Is she being unreasonable).

It is always the same parents that are consistently late. I have been doing the school run for 5 yrs and it is always the same faces I see who are 10-15 mins late as they are just habitually disorganised people.

Posie I'm slowly beginning to realise that!

Borderslass I've no idea if she's on Mumsnet or not. Again, surely nothing would ever get posted if we assumed everyone is on Mumsnet. I'll take the risk!

OK, not running away but have to pick DC up.