I am, I know it, I need a kicking: childminders are icky and second-best

[arses]

Okay, so ds is 9 months and I had him down to go to an Outstanding nursery near to where I work. However, despite my best efforts (and up to 6 hours of lessons a week) I have not learned to drive and although I hope to pass before I return in December, I am beginning to realise how impossible it would be for me to commute 50 minutes with a potentially grumpy baby in the back of the car when I still need 100% attention and focus (and in the Winter months, maybe even more so...).

So, I need to rethink childcare. And for many reasons, I know that a childminder would be the best option for us. I work term time, it's cheaper, ds is under 2 and all the research says a home environment is best etc etc

BUT

I just have a terrible secret snobbery about it. I know why. My sister went to a CM and I used to be taken care of there occasionally and remember it as a dour, dark soulless place where the CM's kids bullied us and it stank of fags and no-one ever spoke unless to tell you off.

I was trying to be grown-up and reflective about this experience since having ds, not helped by a trip to a playgroup locally earlier in the year which was populated by CM's and there were about a million kids tearing into eachother Lord of the Flies style while these CM's sat in a circle at the top of the hall drinking tea and bitching about the parents of their charges.

So, please, tell me IABU to think CM's are icky and unpleasant and that I am a terrible snob and that I should fuck off and get over my pfbishness and realise my child isn't the only child in the world etc. I am BU, yes? Please?

Ooh, unscientific indicator - she had a very kind face and was kind of slow and calm, if you know what I mean. She only looked after me, so did everything at my 4yo pace. That's no help at all, really, is it!

x-posted!

CM have Ofsted inspections and reports too so that helps but it is visiting that really helps. Everyone is looking for something different but my priorities were:

• loving and warm family environment
• interest in the childs development
• interest in family background and respect for requests within reason
• provision of quality meals and understand of a sensible diet
• setting a routine (having meals at fairly regular times and providing an opportunity to have a nap)
• awareness of safety
• organised and reliable

I barely had to ask questions to identify these things with the CM we chose - she was proactive in sharing all the information with me up front. Another, equally good, CM might need a bit more probing by asking situational questions and so on - pretty much the same process as for a nursery but without the glossy pictures. In some ways it is easier to see what type of setting it is because you haven't got all the misleading marketing information.

A lot of it was gut feeling - I pretty much knew within the first 5 minutes of any visit - the rest was just confirmatory.

I know exactly how you feel. The childminder I went to as a young child was a hopless alcoholic who spent most of her time with us asleep on the sofa.

We went until one time she got too drunk to collect us from school and I had to walk me and my nursery age sister home from school alone (in central birmingham) and wait on the doorstep until my Mum got home at about 9pm.

Remember it clear as day and it certainly initially coloured my judgment.

But childminding is nothing like it was back then (nor are nurseries for that matter.) To my Mum, a childminder was anyone she could get to watch us while she worked 14 hour days to pay off the massive debt my dad left us in.

To me a childminder is a professional whose job it is to provide quality care in a home environment. Qualified, inspected and invested in what they do. Even the ones I didn't much like weren't that bad.

See a few CMs (see some nurseries too) and it'll be pretty ovbious.

As it goes DS ended up at a nursery...I did click really well with a CM but she had no spaces.

don't be afraid to visit CMs more than once to get a feel for what they're like

see how they interact with your ds

see what the home environment is like, find out what toys and books they have, what trips they will do, what sort of food they cook

ask LOTS of questions!

I visited 2 CMs before we chose ours. First one had a sterile over-heated house with no mindees. The minute we walked into the second one we knew it was right - house was spotless but full of child-related chaos - playroom full of paints and paper and mess! And it smelt of home-cooked casserole. The mindees kept coming up to the CM and giving her hugs round the legs and chattering to us. It was just right. And we used her services for 7 yrs and 3 children.

Agree that cm's are well regulated these days but Fwiw I went to a cm over 30 years ago and she was great - let us do loads of messy stuff that i'd never have got away with at home !

Arses - you are on the Mental Travellator of Doom - I know it because I ended up on it about schools the other day. I read an Ofsted report of a terrible infants school near us and it was horribly reminiscent of a shitty primary school that I went to for 2 years. I found myself even remembering the revolting state of the lavatories. I got very sad and anxious about the fact that dd will have to go to some school or another and imagined her sitting in class having snot flicked at her head while bored out of her mind at the non-teaching. I had to drag myself off the Travellator of Doom by reminding myself that they have Ofsted inspections to identify schools like this, not all have been given a 4, we can find a nice school (fingers crossed) and that was the past, and effectively another country.

On the other hand I had an absolutely lovely childminder when I was little and have no qualms about sending dd to another lovely childminder.

As everyone else said, just go and visit them. Yes I have seen some at playgrounds that make me wonder, but I am sure mine isn't like them.

have used a CM (not good) and two nurseries (one excellent; one shocking). i would use a CM without hesitation if i could find a good one. BUT i have reservations about a baby with a CM. the majority of CMs where we live are wrap-around-ers for school / nursery / pre-school. Therefore baby will be in and out of buggy / car-seat, 2 - 3 - 4 times a day (depending on nursery / pre-school / school session times). this is what has put me off using a CM for my dd. she would have ended up falling asleep in the car / buggy just before lunch and then not having a proper nap and then being over-tired and not eating tea etc. BUT it all depends on the child (and actually largely the parents' preferences!) and of course what the CM's day is like. my DS and DD had very well established routines as babies which worked for me and them. we were lucky in that the nursery we settled on adhered to our routines exactly (i know not all do), so we had none of those 'too tired to eat tea then waking up at 4am starving' issues!

OP I can sympathise, I'm a bit prejudiced against CMs and I know I shouldn't be. It's ust what I've witnessed when out with dcs at activities, and a few that have come to my attention through work when I've done HV. OFSTED inspected and all that but I've been at the conditions.

I don't like the fact they're looking after their children too, stupid I know ust an irrational thing i have and I have friends of friend who are CM and I'm about some of their ideas about child development and care tbh. Also prejudiced because I love the nursery we use so much.

That said there are obviously really good ones out there judging by the other comments on this thread and now one of my close friends has decided to do the childminding course I'd have no hesitation in leaving 11m old ds with her, she's brilliant with babies, absolutely amazing far better than me! Look on the surestart website maybe? They might have a list of local people you could contact.

When you've had a negative experience it does cloud your judgement rather.

HV stands for home visits, I'm not a health visitor!

I have a fab cm who creates a lovely family atmosphere, they eat exciting and healthier food than at home and who my son asks to go to even when hes on school holidays.She is part of our family!

When I was growing up I also went to a fab one who did the same for me and my brother

so YABU the right childminder is like gold dust and must be treated with respect ! go and visit one or 2 you'll know if they're the right person to care for your child

Have you lurked on the childminders/nannies board?

How about going over there and taking a look - you could always say where you are and what area you need a CM in - then it's someone you have some knowledge of, some background etc

Have you considered a Nanny? If you can afford it, it's a great option and makes life much easier, if not a CM would be my next choice followed by a Nursery.

Good luck and good luck with the driving too!

My dd's childminder is an ex nanny-Norland trained.She and her dh have a farm and her mindees have the most wonderful,nurturing environment possible [Ofsted excellent] better than any nursery.Just look around and be very selective.

You just need to visit a few CMs and go with your gut feeling, visit them all and don't feel pressurised into signing anything.
Just say that you are looking at X amount of childminders and tell them that you will be in touch in one/two weeks to let them know.

But do let them know even if it's no as there is nothing worse than waiting on a possible mindee starting.
Good luck with your search

Ask your HV for a recommendation. They aren't allowed to, I think (?) but mine steered me away from one in my street with a nod and a wink.

I am a CM and I think I'm quite nice .

I don't do any school runs, but I do have older children in the holidays (the little ones love them and vice versa).

Unfortunately I have also met some shocking CMs. It is scary to leave a child in a strangers home. Keep going to toddler groups and watch the good CMs, not the rubbish ones.

(Alternatively crack the driving, so you can get to nursery).

Well I have used CMs and nursery and lean towards nursery.

But that's because we have a brilliant nursery we use - it's a Sure Start Children's centre preschool with nursery provision and it is truly outstanding, beyond the Ofsted rating.

I have had mixed experiences with CMs, we had one who was fantastic and I was really happy with her but we moved house and as she didn't drive she couldn't do the school pickup. I've also had a couple of really poor experiences where I've been let down and messed about.

To me, that's the downside of using a CM - as a working parent you're quite vulnerable to their lone working status. I'm not in the sort of job where I can take time off if the CM is ill, or takes annual leave when I can't.

If I were you I would explore both options thoroughly - look beyond the Ofsted reports (a CM I went to see got glowing Ofsted but was awful, she just happened to be really good at creating documents for her assessment). Don't immediately discount nurseries, they're not all warehouses full of plastic shite staffed by disinterested 16 year olds.

If you are looking for a childminder, then look no further than one who is registered with the NCMA. They are checked by a coordinator every 6 weeks, have to attend meetings and thus get to know the other childminders.

I promise you, if your child wasn't being looked after, they will grass up someone who isn't doing the job properly.

Many people leave because it's not for them.

Most of the CM's I have met are NCMA and they are lovely.

I can't believe that anyonc)e would leave their baby in a nursery. A childminder is better surely as;

a) you get a mum who is used to dealing with babies and is often becoming a CM because they want to be at home with their children. This is a very important point.

b) I would not leave my child to an 18 year old nursery nurse who has a hangover and whatever shite they encompass during their teen lives whilst looking after my baby.

MrsC I'm afraid your CM mates have been pulling your leg

The NCMA doesn't register CMs or check up on them; it's a professional association that CMs have to pay to join

A local authority will have coordinators in their Early Years team - ours come out annually, to chat with the childminder, and run Best Practice meetings to discuss, well, Best Practice, perhaps 6 a year

We arrange our own training as and when we identify a need for it, or a gap in our knowledge presents itself

We are regulated by Ofsted and have to adhere to legislation

Sorry to be picky

Kindle, All of the CM's I know and there are many are checked every 6 weeks by a local coordinator and yes, they pay for the privilege. Because of this, I am very very much towards NCMA childminders rather than Ofsted visited ones who are only once a year.

Ah I think you are thinking of networks

our network disbanded many years ago, there is supposed to be a new local thingy but it's been years in the promising and never materialised

sigh

Some are good, some not so great. You can't judge them all on those ones you saw at the playgroup. Just find some with good credentials,look into the www.ncma.org.uk/ and meet them, check the references, ask around, good luck.