to resent getting grief because I work in a private school?

[fuschiagroan]

OK, realise that people may say I am being totally unreasonable.

Just about to start my first teaching job. It's in a private school. At a dinner party the other night, my friend (well, I've known her a long time but we're not that close) was making lots of digging little comments about the fact it was a private school. Other people were asking genuine questions about the job/school, not being snarky at all, like 'So what are class sizes like?'. When I answered, e.g. 'It's fifteen to a class at most' this friend went 'God!', wrinkling her nose, as though I'd just said they had a school society for strangling baby bunnies or something. She also made comments about 'privilege' and 'unfair' etc.

OK, I know of course that it is a very privileged environment, and the kids are incredibly lucky. But why does that make me a bad person for working there? If a job had come up in a good state school I would have been just as happy teaching there, but this was the school that offered me a job.

I just think, ffs, I'm not an arms dealer. There's really no need for her to criticise my choice of workplace just because it doesn't fit in with her faux-socialism.

By the way, she got her kid into a great state school by moving into the (expensive property) catchment area - not exactly something possible for all!

ducky the problem is though the government spend money training teachers then there isn't the funding for the jobs. NQTs need to get their first year of working in within a time limit (not sure how many years it is) otherwise their training was for nothing. I think it is better that the get this year done asap while their training is fresh.

There is a recession would people rather others signed on rather than apply for all jobs they are capable of. This would be a greater waste imo.

Quenbioz,

When they make those career choices, they throw away those aspirations. It is strategic. If you feel more strongly about your child's education that you do about caring for others, you don't choose nursing. If your values are the other way around, then you accept that your children do not have the full choices available in education. There is no right or wrong answer.

Or do what many nurses have done and marry a doctor .

Seriously, it is easy to have a couple with one high earner and one low earner and still manage school fees. I am a teacher, and many of my pupils' parents are state school teachers (they don't get fee remission but definitely value education).

With the jobs available in this country and how much they pay, it's not possible for everyone to earn enough to send their children to private school, and therefore a large number of parents don't have this "choice". Personally I'm in favour of bringing back grammar schools or some modernised version of selective schools for those of all backgrounds, so that this type of education is no longer available only in the private sector.

"it's a choice about whether that is your priority or your other chosen career"

Fuschia - congratulations on the job.

I teach in an independent school - when applying for jobs I did think about it for a bit - I went to a state school myself and didn't know anything about private education.

However when looking around the school it seemed like a nice place to work - so here I am.

I'm not saying I wouldn't teach in the state sector again, but I don't think they'd have me - I've been out of the system too long now.

My children will be going to state schools though - a teacher's salary isn't enough for school fees, however many "sacrifices" I make - also I suppose I am very lucky that there aren't any state schools nearby that I would be worried about them attending.

There are pluses and minuses to state vs independent teaching I think - I get longer holidays but work longer hours in the week plus some evenings and weekends (contact time I mean, on top of planning). Classes are generally smaller. Parental expectations are high - this can be a good thing or a not so good thing!

Call me stupid, but if everyone sent their children to private schools, there would be no need for state schools!

This is not about everyone. It is about those who can afford it or qualify in other ways.

If your priorities are to educate your children privately, then you plan this from a relatively early age. Otherwise, you are relying on Lady Luck.

So you agree that there should be a two tier education system, then? One for the rich and one for the poor? I cannot understand this mentality.

I am off to bed.

Although the statistic is 7%, in my area it is around 12% so if all the independent schools around here were closed then the LEA simply could not afford to cope with the influx.

Secondly, average house price in our catchment is about 500k so it would be incredibly arrogant of me to assume that if I took mine out of private and sent them to our local catchment school, they would somehow 'improve' it. We would be no more/less interested or involved than any other parent there.

The only way around this would be a lottery system. Firstly, this is somewhat unworkable in more rural areas and secondly, are those who advocate it happy for all those kids who currently walk to school to suddenly need driven or to be bussed? Btw, even though we chose private, we still walk to school.

I also hate the fact that so many people's idea of independent school is Eton. They assume we're paying 30kpa and that our kids are walking around in tails unlike the fairly plain navy blue which is their uniform.

"I did an engineering degree and based on my Facebook contacts 25 years on"

You bought your house before the housing boom didn't you?

Lots of people who care about education become teachers, they rarely earn enough to privately educate more than one child.

I have worked in independent schools so don't particularly have an axe to grind - although my child is state educated. I would keep her in state education to keep her away from the views expressed by MmeBlueberry.

PYT, there are many tiers solely within the state system. Solve those and then worry about the impact of the independent sector.

You can (not you personally, but some mumsentters) not spout about 7% of the nations' children being insignificant with one hand, and say that they are significant with the other.

The state sector has enough problems to deal with on its own.

My husband has an engineering degree, like me he has no great urge to privately educate our child.

Starlight, they have to be strategic before beginning to worry about money, ie during their own GCSE/A-levels and subsequent degree choices.

Plenty of people from relatively lowly starts manage pretty well at these choices.

Libra, if it is important, we bought our first house in April 1989, pretty close to the top of the market and subsequent crash and 15% interest rates. Not the best financial move we have ever made.

Not sure what you are getting at.

Just to add, I don't for one minute think it's within everyone's grasp. Many good people who work hard will never be able to afford it however much they prioritise. However, we started saving way before children came along figuring that if it didn't happen we'd blow it on something fab.

I also put off having children for nearly 10yrs until well into my 30s purely for financial reasons (fees inc) We'd have loved to have a baby at 25 but waited until 35 to be more secure financially.

Another thing you can add is that, yes, having 15 in a class will be different from the state sector, but you will not enjoy the job security that comes with that territory; private schools can close at the drop of a hat, leaving children with no school, and teachers with no job, especially in these financial times.

Good luck with the job by the way. Children are still children and still have their various needs no matter who is picking up the bill for their education; state, charity, parents, grandparents, a lottery win or a scholarship etc...

Starlight,
The majority of students on my university course were on full grants, meaning that their socio-economic status was pretty low. The priviledge they brought was parents and teachers who wanted them to reach their potential - which they did and 25 years on and reaping the benefits and giving their children a better start in life than they had themselves.

Must make another important point!

-For the past 3 years I have been teaching in an inner city school with a very deprived catchment.

The difference between schools like the one I teach in and schools like my catchment school just over the border in the next county is vast. Far, far wider than the gap between my catchment school and the prep I send my kids to. I'm not a worse teacher than those at my local school but my job is so different. (Ive taught in v affluent areas too) Our Reception is all about teaching kids to speak, sometimes weaning off the dummy, helping them learn how to put their coat on and sit still to listen to a story. Most kids enter our local Reception already able to read.

So IMVHO, the greatest gap is not between indie schools and state schools like the one at the end of my road. But rather between outstanding state schools and those that are not receiving the support they need to enrich the lives of the kids they teach as much as they would like.

I agree totally myredcardigan,

They didn't need pots and pans.

My son is heading to university this year and won't have pots and pans.

If he did need them, he could get a job in a bar or restaurant to give him the necessary cash. Life isn't all about handouts and what you can get for nothing. That's the lesson my children have grown up with.

MmeBlueberry you know that 1989 was no where near as bad in housing price terms as it is nowadays (even tho I agree the 15% interest rate was a killer). I am guessing your mortgage is now actually quite small in relation to your income and the size of your house.

"Or do what many nurses have done and marry a doctor"

I am married to a doctor and we will not be able to afford private fees for 2 children.

Who said it was?

"Life isn't all about handouts and what you can get for nothing."