to be fed up of people using Aspergers as an excuse

[SomeGuy]

Just reading DM (yes, IABU, I know), story about some bloke who got into a facebook tiff and sued for libel:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1298010/Facebook-libel-Law-student-dubbed-paedophile-wins-10-000-li bel-damages.html

'Jeremiah Barber posted an indecent image of children on Raymond Bryce's page on the social networking website along with the comment: 'Ray, you like kids and you are gay so I bet you love this picture, Ha ha'.

The image, which hundreds of users could see, showed Mr Bryce superimposed on to a collage of pornographic pictures.

It was 'tagged' with Mr Bryce's name, allowing his 800 friends on the site to see it.

His victim, who is now a law student, pursued the civil claim against his former school friend and was awarded £10,000 at the High Court yesterday for the stress and anxiety the incident caused him.'

'Mr Bryce, 24, who lives with his parents in Stone, Staffordshire, suffers from high functioning Asperger's Syndrome, but has secured a place on a full time degree course studying law at Stafford University.'

So in other words he's intelligent and successful and has lots of friends. So why should we care that he 'suffers' from Aspergers? It doesn't make the libel any worse, or make him more of a victim.

Here's another story, from Friday:

www.thisiskent.co.uk/tunbridgewells/Asperger-sufferer-admits-cash-card-theft-friend/article-2442184- detail/article.html

'Sevenoaks Magistrates' Court heard on Friday how 22-year-old Michael Funnell, of Addison Road, invited a group of friends around to his house for a party on March 6.

He took their coats to hang them up and when Steve Goodwin's back was turned, took his bank card, before withdrawing £120 from a cash point.

He had memorised his friend's PIN when with him a couple of days before.

Brian Ferris, defending, said: "I am told my client has Asperger's syndrome. He can offer no explanation as to why he steals in this way."'

You wouldn't get them saying 'I am told thay my client doesn't have a very good job, because he is not very bright.'

Another story from today:

www.thisistotalessex.co.uk/news/Spared-prison-camera-showers/article-2442265-detail/article.html

' A MINISTRY of Defence manager who set up covert cameras to watch naked men in the showers has been spared jail.

Hensman, who suffers from Asperger's Syndrome, was working as network manager in communications and systems at the MoD police HQ in Wethersfield when he was accused of voyeurism.

Judge Anthony Goldstaub QC told him: "You were originally prosecuted for sexual offences [voyeurism] but because of your psychiatric makeup these charges were dropped.

"In February 2006 you set up some sort of video recording equipment which recorded movements of people coming in and out of the showers, involving some images of naked males' private parts.

"You were doing it because of your psychiatric condition."

Asperger's is an autism disorder characterised by social interaction problems.

Judge Goldstaub said that people have to "accommodate" others with psychiatric disorders and be "tolerant", adding "it's not their fault".'

It seems to be a popular plea for people accused of child pornography offences:

www.newsshopper.co.uk/news/2031606.indecent_images_man_avoids_jail/

'A BARMAN who was caught with more than 900 indecent images of children has been spared jail.

Southwark Crown Court heard because Jonathan Bristow had Asperger's syndrome he could act on impulse and become obsessive about collecting things.'

Me too - sleep well!

Thanks, will do..unless DD decides to get up and play for 3 hours in night like the other night You too!

I know, I know. Gets easier with time.

We're cross posting! Here's to a peaceful night!

fanjo and saintly

I have worked with people who have very severe asd, who have been very violent, in medium secure units and now life a fab life, in their own homes, with minimal support etc.....so yes, there is a way to teach appropriate behaviour.

don't start saying I don't understand asd, just because i KNOW everone CAN be taught right from wrong........maybe, just maybe, you are not doing it the right way!!!

and saintly (who seems to know it all).....sounds like you need to get your child some help from someone who can teach your child things without using just language........there are ways!! maybe you should look into getting some decent slt who specialises in asd, as each area has them.
try teachh, pecs, social stories and lots of other ways. it's not hard and just because you think you have it hard does not mean you can patronise and speak down to others.

same goes for you fanjo!!

mammadoooooooo - I second what maryz said - what you are saying is, is that you can ''cure'' As /ASD that is so patently stupid you can go live with someguy and make each other very happy

well, I actually CAN teach my daughter as she has some awareness, thanks, she is not severely affected. But I don't for a minute believe all can.

It is incredibly insulting to people to say they are "doing things the wrong wa"y.

I love that you think that disagreeing with you is "patronising and speaking down to you". Bit touchy are we love? (not THAT was patronising).

My DD can't do PECS because of motor challenges and will not look at social stories, incidentally, so there goes your "one size fits all theory".

What a foul post.

mammadooooooooo go and post somewhere else.

"try teachh, pecs, social stories and lots of other ways. it's not hard "

LOL

I can't wait for saintly's reaction to your suggestion that she try PECS and social stories, I think she will be rather amused!

We use PECS, floortime, ABA, Halo, makaton, a tapping system I have devised and biomed. School uses total communication and teacch (it's teacch btw not teachh). After 7 years ds1 learned to imitate which has allowed him to begin to understand verbs. But he doesn't & never will understand sentence level. Of course we work with ASD specialist SALTs we have done since he was 2. they remark how well he is doing. Yes we use symbol social stories at a very basic level (to match his language).

I can only think you actually don't know what 'severe ASD' is - having severe ASD shouldn't put you in a medium secure unit. Severe challenging behaviour us a different matter and is found across the spectrum. People who have 'severe ASD' by which I mean those who have severe learning disabilities (unmeasurable IQ's, language level iof an 18 month old etc) rather than those who are more intellectually able but severely affected by their ASD - do not end up living alone. You clearly have worked with the second group. I am talking about the first.

If you want to see someone being patronising look in the mirror. I am trying to explain to you the difference between a child who is capable of developing sentence level understanding and one who isn't. Did you really think we would go 11 years without using PECS? That is patronising.

And where did I say I had it hard? I just said my son doesn't have the intellectual capacity to learn in the way you seem to think he does. With appropriate supervision and help and - the big one - people who understand his needs- he has a great life. It'll never be an independent life but it can certainly be a fulfilling one

So much more eloquently put than my rambling post!!

So as you say everyone can be taught right from wrong and you now know that we use PECs, abd simple social stories (as does school and respite) how would you teach ds1 that it's wrong to take items from other people's trolleys? This is a genuine question as it is something we are working on this summer. He has no concept of ownership or money or paying for something. He has a semi reliable use of yes/no but I wouldn't say it was 100%

Over to you then.

Incidentally your belief in local specialist SALTs may be misguided. The first specialist SALT we saw said ds1 couldn't be autistic as he's too affectionate. The second said it wasn't worth giving him any therapy as he 'isn't capable of anything is he?' and the third said she couldn't teach him anything as 'he's's not interested in anything'. Luckily by then we'd found a private SALT who was a proper specialist with lots of experience, stopped making excusesfir reasons not to try and got on with working with us and him.

That reminds me, I was told by a consultant neurologist that DD "couldn't have ASD because she has facial expressions"

Blimey - neurologists are usually good and pretty switched on (we finally saw one this year). Did you pull a facial expression of your own

although I think the spectrum is a false construct I do think it would be helpful if there was a better understanding of the reality and complexity of it. It's one reason why I now search out specialists in learning disabilities - they're more use to ds1.

I do feel for those who are intellectually able but have other issues related to their autism that leaves them with a lot of behaviour they have little control over. People usually eventually understand why that's the case for ds1 but can struggle when they see the same thing in someone with higher functionig autism.

Scary isn't it! And DD's diagnosis is partly in his hands..we still don't have one!

DD seems able but has severe physical issues. She has real trouble speaking (she could quite well then regressed) and getting any words out. Her motor planning is awful, she can't wave except by holding her hand and making it wave (usually backwards) We couldn't use PECS because she couldn't pick up the cards.

Yet she seems able underneath, it's amazing she is so happy and content really (for now!)

As she can only really cry to express objection to anything we are constantly told she is "spoilt" etc, I had hoped people would become more understanding as she got older but perhaps not!

Current DX, "hypotonia with regressions, developmentalk delay and ASD traits"..catchy!

(without the K..I keep having to chase after DD then come back and add things!)

Oh she sounds quite like ds1. We started PECs by sticking pictures to huge chunks of card, then gradually making them smaller.

He couldn't learn sign for years because of lack of ability to imitate. Now he tries but can't produce accurate signs so he makes up his own! He can't wave properly either.

Yes, she tries to imitate but can't produce the signs. She is determined to use words though, they are just not clear...am not sure if they will get clearer or not, and if not where we will go. Might suggest to the SALT about the PECS on bigger card..she is great, although we don't see her very much!!

I think MammaDoooo has been comprehensively K.Od!!