to be fed up of people using Aspergers as an excuse

[SomeGuy]

Just reading DM (yes, IABU, I know), story about some bloke who got into a facebook tiff and sued for libel:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1298010/Facebook-libel-Law-student-dubbed-paedophile-wins-10-000-li bel-damages.html

'Jeremiah Barber posted an indecent image of children on Raymond Bryce's page on the social networking website along with the comment: 'Ray, you like kids and you are gay so I bet you love this picture, Ha ha'.

The image, which hundreds of users could see, showed Mr Bryce superimposed on to a collage of pornographic pictures.

It was 'tagged' with Mr Bryce's name, allowing his 800 friends on the site to see it.

His victim, who is now a law student, pursued the civil claim against his former school friend and was awarded £10,000 at the High Court yesterday for the stress and anxiety the incident caused him.'

'Mr Bryce, 24, who lives with his parents in Stone, Staffordshire, suffers from high functioning Asperger's Syndrome, but has secured a place on a full time degree course studying law at Stafford University.'

So in other words he's intelligent and successful and has lots of friends. So why should we care that he 'suffers' from Aspergers? It doesn't make the libel any worse, or make him more of a victim.

Here's another story, from Friday:

www.thisiskent.co.uk/tunbridgewells/Asperger-sufferer-admits-cash-card-theft-friend/article-2442184- detail/article.html

'Sevenoaks Magistrates' Court heard on Friday how 22-year-old Michael Funnell, of Addison Road, invited a group of friends around to his house for a party on March 6.

He took their coats to hang them up and when Steve Goodwin's back was turned, took his bank card, before withdrawing £120 from a cash point.

He had memorised his friend's PIN when with him a couple of days before.

Brian Ferris, defending, said: "I am told my client has Asperger's syndrome. He can offer no explanation as to why he steals in this way."'

You wouldn't get them saying 'I am told thay my client doesn't have a very good job, because he is not very bright.'

Another story from today:

www.thisistotalessex.co.uk/news/Spared-prison-camera-showers/article-2442265-detail/article.html

' A MINISTRY of Defence manager who set up covert cameras to watch naked men in the showers has been spared jail.

Hensman, who suffers from Asperger's Syndrome, was working as network manager in communications and systems at the MoD police HQ in Wethersfield when he was accused of voyeurism.

Judge Anthony Goldstaub QC told him: "You were originally prosecuted for sexual offences [voyeurism] but because of your psychiatric makeup these charges were dropped.

"In February 2006 you set up some sort of video recording equipment which recorded movements of people coming in and out of the showers, involving some images of naked males' private parts.

"You were doing it because of your psychiatric condition."

Asperger's is an autism disorder characterised by social interaction problems.

Judge Goldstaub said that people have to "accommodate" others with psychiatric disorders and be "tolerant", adding "it's not their fault".'

It seems to be a popular plea for people accused of child pornography offences:

www.newsshopper.co.uk/news/2031606.indecent_images_man_avoids_jail/

'A BARMAN who was caught with more than 900 indecent images of children has been spared jail.

Southwark Crown Court heard because Jonathan Bristow had Asperger's syndrome he could act on impulse and become obsessive about collecting things.'

fanjo. If I didnt know them,that would be my first thought - infact it was.

But its not the case. I understand that many of us with children with SN have had to fight for dx, fight for help, are bewildered etc.

This family are aware of what is on offer and what options are open to them. If they werent,I wouldnt have posted. I havent just met them in a supermarket and made assumptions.

Their DD is very unhappy and isolated by her condition. Fortunately her school are becoming more aware of the situation.

Sometimes people are a bit crap. Even if they have children with SN.

FWIW back to the OP - of course AS/ASD should be taken into consideration by the courts. Lots of things are from childhood abuse to PMT. Why would they/should they ignore a serious and recognised condition?

I agree mrsDeVere it's sad isn't it..kids with SN need so much input.

fanjo just re read and think my post sounds a bit snarky. Its not meant to be. I am trying to clarify the situation a bit. I have child with SN myself and am aware of how judgy people can be.

Only found out recently that when my DS was a toddler I was the talk of the area. Apart from ASD/LD/APD he also has terrible, severe eczema.

It was particularly bad when my DD was very ill (stress makes it worse). Apparently I was a terrible, cruel mother who did nothing to help him and I was never with him. I was a disgrace.

I was actually in hospital with his terminally ill sister and he was seeing a dermatologist regularly to no avail.

My only comfort is now that everyone knows what was going on there are quite a few big mouths feeling very guilty.

As the mother of a child with Asperger's and a really high IQ, I too get fed up with it being used as an excuse for everything.

My child knows right from wrong.

So Op, everyone in the country is allowed to cite anything they may choose as mitigation whether it is pressure at work, depression, previous good character, a career that would be interupted/damaged by a custodial sentence, sex addiction, PMT, provocation etc etc.
But the one exception to this should be behaviours related to aspergers.
Is that your argument?

runawaywife - lucky you. I am not sure what your point is though?

Also someguy and others, why on earth are you using the word 'excuse' in relation to the main case on your OP, in with the person with austism was the innocent party? What does he need an 'excuse' for, exactly?

In court people are entitled to point out that due to their condition behaviour that in other people might have an obvious explanation (eg sexual gratification) might have a different motivation. ie someone suffering from a paranoid mental illness might, say, believe the showers were actually gas chambers and so try to secretly film them for that reason. Or they might think that people are stealing from clothing left there. I can imagine quite a few reasons other than sexual gratification for filming in a shower area. And as it happens the report on that case says he was filming people going in and out of the shower area, not necessarily filming in the area itself. And even more importantly, this was a minor crime, committed four years ago, that a man was convicted of and sentenced for. It hardly seems indicative of anything terrible going on, or some kind of autistic conspiracy!

Runaway Wife, Mr Bryce, who has annoyed the OP so much, also has a strong sense of right and wrong. So much so, that he was prepared to go to great lengths to get justice. I admire that kind of doggedness and singlemindedness. But he is still lumped in with someone who collected child porn, as if he is no different, morally. Just another bad, weak and whinging autistic!

He was claiming that it somehow made the injury worse, he (or his mother) was making out that he was more of a victim, was more deserving because of his Asperger's.

This case is being reported with 'Autism' in the headline, as if it were akin to a man with no arms being set upon by a gang of thugs.

It's clearly not - everyone has their cross to bear, and this man has in fact done rather well out of life's lottery.

Yes some arsehole picked on him on facebook, but we really don't need the sob story about how it's so much worse because he's got (gasp) Aspergers.

ColdComfort

can I hand you a grace under fire award?
You are showing some clear eyed composure in your posts which I much appreciate today... perhaps it is my state of mind, perhaps I am tired but this endless drip, drip of negativity about ASD is testing me sorely today.

Do you think he wrote the headlines or something? I think we've established you had no idea that mitigation is universal, but surely you realise that people involved in court cases don't also write the newspaper reports of them?
I think his mother's testimony was heartfelt and it certainly resonated with me. She had every right to point out that he had suffered lifelong bullying and that this latest behaviour was not an isolated incident but part of it. That was her choice. She DID NOTHING WRONG AND NEITHER DID HE! He didn't want to be stolen from and libelled! Anyone would think from your posts that he was the bad guy here. So come on what has he done that he needs an 'excuse' for? I keep asking but get no answer?

Thank you Pagwatch. I didn't mean to post so much, but found the OP so shocking, so illogical, so bizarrely random...and many of the original (PC gone mad-type) replies so infuriating, I broke a promise to myself.

My point is while some things can be used to help give a reason for some behavior I am sick to death of people using conditions as an excuse for every thing.

One of my sons friends is autistic and has ADHD and what ever he does no matter what his mother will say it is because of these things,when some of the time it is just her child being a little shit, like all children can be.

And the evidence for 'people using conditions as an excuse for everything' is, what, these three totally different criminal cases over four years where the word 'aspergers' appeared in the newspaper report? Or the fact that you dislike your son's friend and his mother? I don't think this makes a terribly convincing case for autistic people having some wicked advantage over normal folk.
(especially when, in the first case, the autistic person was a victim of crime and so doesn't need an 'excuse')

That is just so un-understanding of ASD and ADHD.

If lawyers weren't allowed to make 'excuses'or explanations of any kind for people who are accused of crimes, then we would have a charmingly South Korean or Iranian-style justice system. I'm not sure that's what anyone wants.

oops - I x-posted, my comment was directed at RunawayWife, of course, not smallwhitecat

I would imagine South Korea has a pretty fair justice system.

Anyway, I don't think not accepting 'you did it because you had Aspergers' as an excuse for paedophilia is exactly totalitarian.

I find it extraordinary that anyone who knows someone on the spectrum (and has, I presume, done a reasonable amount of reading around the condition) could say "well my child doesn't do that" as though it is thereofre an established fact that "that" cannot happen, or be explained by ASD.

It really does beggar belief.

And it is people with ASD who are supposed to have a hard time with flexibility of thought