Should school staff have to earn a pupil's respect before expecting politeness?

[Sweetchillysource]

Hi everyone

I am absolutely raging about a situation that happened at work last week. I am a secondary school teacher. I have recently taken over a year 7 tutor group. One of the boys in my form is behaving very poorly; not only towards me but around school in general. I am an experienced teacher so I’m not phased by this however I invited his mum in for a meeting last week to discuss my concerns, and to try and nip it in the bud.

During the meeting his mom made the comment that he was behaving poorly as the staff had not yet “earned his respect”. I can’t accept this. I explained that I appreciate that he’s new to the school and therefore he’s still in the process of establishing relationships with staff, however this does not mean that he could behave poorly and speak to staff rudely. His mum wasn’t happy with me saying this and stormed out. Later that day she logged a formal complaint.

My headteacher has now spoken with me and suggested that my comment about staff not having to earn this hisrespect was not appropriate. I refuse to accept that and maintain that this is a ridiculous expectation,

Surely the expectation is that we’re all polite and respectful towards each other when we first meet each other as opposed to having to wait until we’ve earned each other’s respect?? My headteacher wants me to call her and apologise but I am refusing to do that.

What are other peoples thoughts on this?

Every single time a parent has said this in my presence I fast forward to when the kid is in front of a magistrate or a judge. I wouldn’t apologise. I think you’re correct. Manners matter.

You are 100 percent correct. One of mine once tried to say the teacher didn’t respect him. My response “what do you mean she doesn’t respect you, of course she doesn’t, you’re 12 and you’re the pupil. You do what you are told to do when you’re told and then I promise your life will be much easier and better”

Exactly. In any job, and any interaction, we should be respectful to everyone because they're human beings! That doesn't mean we won't feel more respect for a doctor who has done lots to help, or a boss who is very efficient and fair, but being basically polite to everyone should be a given.

The issue is, some students have zero respect or reasoning skills. The students that do have these are treated the same as those who have none.
My 15 year old has reasoning and is able to explain and hold a debate in a non hostile way. However he's treated the same as those who don't. And gets frustrated when he's not listened to. He goes to a very strict school but gets annoyed when he's pulled up for something he either hasn't done, or gets seclusion for a minor thing which means he misses out on lessons. And that annoys him because he wants to be in lessons

Hmm. I’d be on TES searching jobs by now. So many red flags from your HT’s reaction here.

@Sweetchillysource , bollocks to an apology which you don’t owe.
Everyone, whoever they are ought to move from the position of being respectful and expecting to be respected. Your head is an idiot and I would not back down if I were you. I’d rather lose my job than be expected to grovel to anyone when I’d done nothing wrong.

Absolutely not.
No wonder teachers are leaving the job.
That sort of attitude by a parent would have had you turfed out of my childrens schools, and rightly so.
Involve your union.
Treating each other with courtesy and respect is ground zero.

Is it a rough school?
Only the dregs would come out with such rubbish.
Very disappointing that you have been instructed to apologise.
I wouldn't do it either.

I terms of the pupil and his Mum, it seems a case - as happens so often - of the apple not falling far from the tree.

The HT is clearly being ridiculous and is going to end up without any experienced teachers willing to work in their school.

It's this sort of crap that is a big part of the reason people leave teaching. The nonsense that is against all common sense, which some very, very poor senior management pander to.

It is a shame when you are in a job to be made to feel you'd be better out of it.
Good luck with your job search, which I presume you are starting.

‘My headteacher has now spoken with me and suggested that my comment about staff not having to earn this hisrespect was not appropriate. I refuse to accept that and maintain that this is a ridiculous expectation,’

So what is the Head saying? Bad behaviour is fine for the first few weeks and you can let them get away with it?
Maybe the next time he talks badly just send him to her office and let her be spoken to like that then. She clearly doesn’t mind!

And no do not ring the mum!

I’d say the earning of respect is irrelevant and she’s a twat for using it as an excuse anyway, because it suggests that if you got to know a teacher and found that for whatever reason you didn’t respect them, you are allowed to behave badly. Which is obviously bollocks.

I actually do think respect needs to be earned. But doing what you’re bloody told and not behaving badly is not remotely dependent on that. It’s just another whiny excuse from a brat, next it will be “but the teacher doesn’t like me. It’s not faaaaaaair!”

I’m not a teacher but I ended up in a similar situation last year… asked to apologise for something to placate a client who was in the wrong and had behaved appallingly.

I refused and nothing happened as a result. I’ve always been such a good girl at work. It felt great to just say ‘I won’t be doing that’. I highly recommend the same approach to you OP.

YANBU OP. I agree with respect having to be earned. That is different to treating people with respect and not behaving badly as a normal baseline.

@Sweetchillysource you need to find a new school, one where the Headteacher supports their staff in dealing with this sort of thing.

Me too. I’ll apologise when I’ve done something wrong, otherwise no.

You might be surprised by the excuses parents make at nice middle-class schools for their arrogant offspring.

I mean respect is a 2 way street....but I think politeness should be a default setting. The kid sounds like a little shit and OP is not being unreasonable

I don't doubt it.
I just know that the private schools my children attended, that had substantial wait lists, had a zero tolerance to any disrespectful behaviour towards any of the teachers, and rightly so.
They were not afraid of suspending students and on a few occasions that I heard of, told parents that their son could finish out the school year but would need to make alternative arrangements for the following September.
That tends to temper those parents that might be inclined to think they can be rude like that.

Not coming back to rejoin the conversation you started then OP?

Thought not. Lots of responses though, so job done, eh?

YANBU. I don't know how teachers cope with parents and children today. People are raising some horrendously entitled brats.

I'm wondering - just what would a teacher have to do to 'earn' a pupil's 'respect'? They must have something in mind. Perhaps you could ask the class. Or their parents.

In my experience it involves allowing the pupil to do what they want all the time and never to ask to pupil to take their coat off, sit down or pick up a pen.

Oh right, silly me.

And there in lies the problem in some of today's yoof. The parents enable their bad behaviour.

Stick to your guns @Sweetchillysource you have nothing to apologise for.