Should school staff have to earn a pupil's respect before expecting politeness?

[Sweetchillysource]

Hi everyone

I am absolutely raging about a situation that happened at work last week. I am a secondary school teacher. I have recently taken over a year 7 tutor group. One of the boys in my form is behaving very poorly; not only towards me but around school in general. I am an experienced teacher so I’m not phased by this however I invited his mum in for a meeting last week to discuss my concerns, and to try and nip it in the bud.

During the meeting his mom made the comment that he was behaving poorly as the staff had not yet “earned his respect”. I can’t accept this. I explained that I appreciate that he’s new to the school and therefore he’s still in the process of establishing relationships with staff, however this does not mean that he could behave poorly and speak to staff rudely. His mum wasn’t happy with me saying this and stormed out. Later that day she logged a formal complaint.

My headteacher has now spoken with me and suggested that my comment about staff not having to earn this hisrespect was not appropriate. I refuse to accept that and maintain that this is a ridiculous expectation,

Surely the expectation is that we’re all polite and respectful towards each other when we first meet each other as opposed to having to wait until we’ve earned each other’s respect?? My headteacher wants me to call her and apologise but I am refusing to do that.

What are other peoples thoughts on this?

Respect is one thing and different from good behaviour. Basic good manners and politeness should be a given. And that's from both kids and parents.

When she walks into a shop is she rude to the staff by default until they have earned her respect?

What about a theme park, do the ride attendants have to bow down to her before she will follow their instructions?

You could apologise for there clearly being some misunderstanding, you were putting forward the proposal that everyone starts from a position of mutual respect and she must have misunderstood because obviously she wouldn't be proposing anything different.

Hmm. Watching this one closely to see if it follows a particular pattern.

I'm a secondary teacher too.

Your Head is completely wrong and should have your back. If he insists on this apology please go to your union rep. If your school doesn't have one then please contact your area rep (the official title of that person is the Local Negotiating Secretary).

I'm not surprised you're annoyed - I'd be livid too!

It’s not different. It underpins manners and behaviour.

Firstly, I do not know why you invited the parent in, as a FT, and spoke to her on your own. Surely the first thing are points on the behaviour system, which automatically get sent to the parent. Then an email. The parent should only be brought in if a Pastoral Lead needs a 1-2-1 when points are accrued.
Who was monitoring this meeting, and why does the HT think were you acting against school protocol?
Talk to the HT, see if she can communicate directly with the parent and explain the behaviour expectations and points progression. Then speak to your union about the whole business. The HT should support you.

Absolutely, that's the usual process. It seems a bit off in this school.

What’s the pattern @GetBernie ? The HT is a male
and doesn’t see an issue in the male pupil’s expectation?

Jesus wept.

When I was at school in the 90s, I remember badly behaved kids saying ‘respect has to be earned’, as though they were articulating a really profound moral principle.

Treating people like shit until they jump through hoops to earn your respect always struck me as stupid because if everyone thought that way, we would be stuck in a society-wide race to the bottom.

In any case, this attitude is clearly not entirely new. Perhaps the vile, obnoxious mother you encountered was one of my former classmates!

Totally agree with OP, the pupil is a pupil, the teacher by the very role should have the respect from day 1. I think the HT’s comment is appalling.

Respectful behaviour given the status of 'teacher' should be displayed from the first minute. But genuine respect is earned. The parent was wrong to confuse the two.

Later that day she logged a formal complaint.

Honestly in all my years of teaching I have never known so many complaints as are coming in now. And SLT seem afraid of the complaints too. AI written drivel most of the time.

Admiration is earned of course

But respect - as in the respect you show to someone you encounter on the tube, that you show to someone crossing the road in front of your car - that's basic human decency and is shown to everyone

Bloody hell, you stand strong xx

You are right insofar as he should absolutely demonstrate a respectable politeness and I have no time for arsehole behaviour in school or out and his mother sounds as bad as he does!

However, I do find that that people working with children/teenagers feel entitled to receive respect but feel ‘above’ giving the respect back. I don’t think anyone automatically deserves respect, including teaching staff or the child, they each have to earn it.

YANBU. I couldn’t work for a head that thought this.

It's a funny one as the teachers at my high school years ago were mostly very strict old school dinosaur types. The teachers that showed a little respect to the pupils were funnily enough the ones that were the most respected back and rarely raised their voices. I think the psychology of this approach works as long as the teacher is not a pushover.

And this is why some schools are a mess. Parents awful attitude which rubs off on their precious children.

stand your ground, the parent and your head teacher are idiots.

contact your union if your head teacher keeps insisting you apologise.

Oh we constantly get complaints, often using foul language and containing threats. Parents are no longer allowed to email teachers directly.

She’s raising a little narcissist there I see. Vile. Your head is clearly running scared from certain parents.

Yanbu looks like the head wants to take the easy way out to resolve the complaint.

It’s a two way thing. Obviously. I work in schools. I always respect students, they don’t need to earn my respect and vice versa. I’m not sure how you “find” that staff demand respect first? Quite the generalisation there.

No nothing to do with the topic of the thread itself. I can't say or I'll get deleted, but just something I've noticed recently about certain threads and they way they always pan out. It's a bit too early to call this one though, so I am watching and waiting. I could be wrong.

YANBU

Yes to the AI complaints lol.