Terrified to go into my own garden..

[TotallyTangerineGeum]

I just want to preface this by saying that I’ve name changed and MNHQ will be able to verify that I’ve been on here a long while. Just pointing this out, as I’ll inevitably get troll hunted on this one as it makes very little sense! I assure you I have not left anything out whatsoever and I’m sorry it’s such a long post.

I’m a widowed parent of one 11yr old DD. I have a small-ish dog who thankfully doesn’t bark much (which is relevant to this situation).

2 years ago, my usually always very friendly & chatty next door neighbour, randomly blocked me from texting her - which I rarely ever did anyway tbh, only ever if there was a parcel here for her etc. The last time I’d spoken to her, everything had been great. I was utterly mystified but figured it’d be sorted eventually and I’d ask her when I saw her next. With it being winter I didn’t see her for a while and when I did, I was ignored. Really odd but ok…. Maybe I or DD had made some noise? Although she has always assured me vehemently that she can’t hear anything from our side but even so, I don’t allow DD to make noise for my own sake as well as that of others!

Last summer, there were a few occasions when I was in my back garden (6ft fence with vertical planks with small gaps in between) and neighbour’s Dad who was there, shouted over at me. Once when I was taking a photo of a random plant which had popped up so I could identify it, he shouts “Come round if you want to take photos, you fat fuck!” Now, I should’ve asked WTF he was talking about and corrected him but I was too stunned to speak! Another time I got called a “sad pathetic loser” when I was cutting sweet pea flowers off my trellis on our adjoining fence. Followed by him saying to his daughter “Don’t worry she’s obviously got no life” Again, I hugely regret not saying something back and asking what on earth I’m meant to have said or done wrong. But having escaped extremely violent DV, I just don’t have the strength to confront any male and probably never will. It’s fight or flight and I flee. Until today, that is.

Around the end of last year, the neighbour got a dog of their own and despite my calling my dog in every single time, theirs still barks loudly every single time he sees my dog through the fence. I’ve tried putting tarpaulin up on the adjoining fence to prevent their dog seeing mine but nope, it still keeps happening. Thankfully my dog doesn’t usually bark back and if he does, it’s one singular woof to show his displeasure, then he comes in!
About 2 months ago, I wrote neighbour herself a letter (as she just blanks me when I try speaking to her face to face) explaining that I’ve absolutely zero clue what I’ve done to upset her, apologised if it’s noise (though I really don’t think it is, as DD & I are quiet people and when DD is at school, I’m often asleep or at hospital) and explaining that I only have about 12-14 months left to live due to an autoimmune disorder which she actually knows I have, that I want to spend what time I have left with my child in peace and just want to be left alone and politely requested that they stop slamming their front door as it was making us both jump a mile and was affecting DD at school when it happens during the night. I was very polite and promised to do what I can on my part to try and mitigate the situation with her dog seeing mine through the fence (which I have done, I put tarpaulin up but clearly I need to add more!)

Fast forward to a few weeks ago and now her Dad is seemingly living there and is making mine & my daughter’s lives a living hell.
EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. I open one of my French doors and either let my dog out for a wee or I dare to step out into my own garden, not only does their dog bark like mad at mine (who now just ignores theirs as he’s used to it!) I get “Oh for fuck’s sake!” or her little boy goes running inside shouting “Mum, Granddad, she’s in her garden again!!!” followed by “Oh for fuck’s sake! Fucking typical!” It’s got to the point where I’m genuinely anxious to go into my own garden and I’m not exaggerating and I’m a keen gardener! I can’t even nip to my greenhouse to get some lettuce without a “Oh for fuck’s sake, fat fuck is out again!” 😳
Last week, I had to mow the lawn as it was the first day I’d had in weeks where I was well enough to do it and they were having a BBQ (I don’t think there were any guests but I decided to be as quick as possible anyway) and well, he was fuming and they went storming inside, slamming the door. I don’t know what was said as I had the mower on but heard door slam. That one was probably my fault for mowing whilst they were having a BBQ but if I’d waited until the next time I was well enough, the grass would’ve been too long to mow!

Another thing which I’ve been ignoring in the hope that it naturally settles (and to avoid confrontation with him), is the fact that their dog barks the ENTIRE TIME he is left in the house alone. Barks loudly and howls. So bad that me making a phone call is nigh on impossible. It’s often overnight also, so that is hell for DD especially. This happened today and I’ve taken to recording clips of it just in case it’s needed in future. When it finally stopped, presumably as he came home, the first thing I did, was quietly let DDog out as I’d kept him in during the barking due to the noise coming from their side. Well, this was a mistake as their dog saw mine and erupted - as per usual! Mine didn’t bark back at all but DD grabbed the treat tub and told him to come in for obvious reasons and neighbour’s Dad shouts “FUCKING TWATS!!!!!” over the fence. Now I have never, ever responded to ANY of it but having just endured hours upon hours of their Alsation barking and howling I snapped and said, calmly, “Your dog has been barking all day!!!” to which he shouts “Because of you! YOU’RE CAUSING IT!!!” “Every fucking day you’re in your garden” I reply “And?!” At which point he slams their door and my DD bursts into tears and call me pathetic but so did I. I’m at my wits end. This is my home. My DD’s home and this is almost certainly the last summer of my life. My only hobby is quietly (& I do mean quietly) pottering around in my garden deadheading flowers or pruning roses etc.

• I don’t ever have visitors besides my 82yr old mother (she’s my only remaining family besides DD) and what friends do bother with me, I just have catch up coffees with in Costa!
• I don’t play music in my home or my garden. If I listen to a podcast or LBC, it’s on earphones.
• My dog rarely barks and if he does, it’s only a tiny bit if he is barked at! He did once bark at an Owl ornament I bought but in his defence, it did blink at night time!!
• I do not speak on the phone in the garden as everyone around me would hear and despite this massive long post, I am quite a quiet person usually!
• DD is rarely in the garden (more’s the pity!) she prefers gaming! She used to play out front on her scooter with some kids from up the street but she’s been too frightened to, since neighbour’s Dad aggressively told her to “Piss off” once about a year ago when he’d arrived about 5 mins after neighbour had left the house and so, being 9, she told him. Who tells a 9yr old to piss off?

I have reported today’s incident to non-emergency police. However a. Officer won’t be free to talk to me until the end of next week which I’m sad about tbh. I could’ve used the advice as right now, I’m terrified to even let my dog out for a wee, let alone step into my garden.
Again, having escaped extreme DV, it’s very difficult for me to not default to flight mode. I’m still shaking and this happened 2 hours ago. Pathetic, I know. I already struggle with anxiety.

Sorry this was so long but I didn’t want to miss anything out and have to correct people or be accused of drip feeding!

There’s nothing I can do, is there?

Next time he shouts over the fence shout back 'Do you enjoy intimidating a lone woman & a child, you're a bully' if it continues shout 'What's your problem, can you not discuss things like an adult instead of bawling obscenities over the fence' Stand up for yourself otherwise he'll carry on doing it. Record all interactions & record the dog barking & howling as you'll need it to make a formal complaint. If his behaviour becomes more threatening contact the police.

@TotallyTangerineGeum Ignore above advice. Don’t engage with him at all.

I agree but email the MP as well as sending a letter and cc it to anyone else relevant like the council and Housing Association etc.

I've been quietly reading this thread and saw the update OP. Don't engage with them at all now. If you ever feel really scared you can call the police.

Sound recording is not proof of who is abusing you. The council officer has to witness who is doing it. As part of your official complaint. My experience is below . Obviously things may be different in other people's experience and area.

I have been through a similar experience. I worked for a long time with the local housing association and environmental health from the council.
Key factors were as below.

Keeping a written log for several months. This was then considered for action by the council. Very slowly!

Followed by the council putting specialist recording equipment in my house. I was not to touch or move this equipment. I had to turn it on with a single button when the neighbour kicked off.
It was next to my kitchen window but out of sight. I would open the window for the best recordings.

To prove who was causing the problem I used an emergency call line. An enforcement officer living locally then rushed to my house and witnessed the incidents officially. Day or night.

Eventually action was taken. The housing and the council officers arrived early a.m with the police for back up.

He was arrested and charged but released pretty quickly.
By the next day after release he was back at home even more angry and loud. Particularly outside my front door.
He was up and down the street bellowing the no one could stop him. The laws didn't apply to him because of his "mental health " he said this protected him.

So the upshot was he was evicted by the housing association. Taken to court. A court date took forever.
I'm sorry OP but it took nearly three years from start to eviction.

Destroy him without uttering a single word to him (so he can't accuse you of anything)

Use a high pitched dog deterrent that can be placed in your garden
https://www.electric-collars.eu/Tema/the-world-s-best-anti-barking-devic

Have a children's picnic (not party) in the garden, and when he starts, report him to the police again as well as their parents, expressing concern at his behaviour around children

Request a Sarah's Law disclosure on him, describing his fixation on your daughter and the comments he is shouting, that he is watching her through the fence etc.

Get a cease and desist letter from a solicitor and contact Victim Support

Keep reporting to the police as a hate crime https://www.scope.org.uk/advice-and-support/hate-crime and ask for a crime reference number every single time

It’s probably fair to say this man is probably known by the police. For all you know possibly for violence. He’s already shown he doesn’t care about victimising a single
mother with a child.

Could you put him on social media next time he kicks off and publicly shame him? It’s not illegal and maybe a very fast way to get action ?. Say you’re a single woman and this is what you have to put up with?… someone may offer to come and support you , some men might offer to come and have a word in his ear …

Make him your areas public enemy number one !

He probably has no idea about the power of the internet, he may go viral.. but who cares aslong as it gets resolved?

Dont hang around to phone the police non emergency number , as soon as he swears or shouts report him. This will automatically create a case and it’ll be logged permanently.

You can even report online.

Report every single encounter no matter how brief… every time he abuses you .

https://www.northyorkshire.police.uk/contact/af/contact-us-beta/contact-us/

My council no longer use their own equipment, they have you download the Noise app which automatically sends each recording you make, directly to the council.

I’ve emailed the MP and I have a video call with a police officer this evening between 9-11pm (I know! Only slot I could get).
What if there isn’t an enforcement officer living locally? If the nearest one is across this particular town, it could take an hour to get here! (Traffic is biblical in this town!)

I have an outdoor CCTV camera up now (since yesterday). Nothing has been said again since the incident on the day I posted. However we’ve been out at my mum’s each day to get away as being stuck inside, or in garden with earbuds in all day, would drive me up the wall! I can tolerate earbuds/headphones for a while but not all day! Plus every single time I open my French door to step outside, their dog sees it over the top of the fence and starts barking like mad - which is what triggered him the other day! (Normally he starts on me regardless of whether their dog barks, but when it does, it usually always triggers him).

I thought about TikTok but I really, realllllly hate being on camera due to how awful I look and if it does go viral, some of the comments will be vile and I can guarantee that. Us women get absolutely destroyed on TikTok! (Usually by males) Especially if overweight, not good looking and disabled; particularly since all of this anti-disabled rhetoric began in the media. We’re getting abuse hurled at us in the street! I know that is an entirely separate conversation, I just think that it will make it an even more unbearable process if it gained any traction on social media.

@Paul2023I do have a video call with an officer from North yorks police at some point between 9pm-11pm this evening. I’ll report back on what’s said!

Ok fair enough about social media, but it’s his words on camera you’d need to upload, not yourself. You needn’t appear at all.

Good new about the police call, remember your a vulnerable woman with a serious illness and a child.I can’t see how you won’t be a priority.

It was also in Labours manifesto to protect women’s and girls so Id say that with your abuse they should have a duty to protect you.

The neighbours dad is causing you alarm harassment and distress.

If possible can you go outside with your camera recording and see if anything is shouted at you , before the call ?

Good luck! We are all rooting for you

Sure publicly shaming someone with a video recording is illegal? And won't work on someone abusive . It will only make him more vengeful .

I hope the call went well. Seems late though?

What if there isn’t an enforcement officer living locally? If the nearest one is across this particular town, it could take an hour to get here! (Traffic is biblical in this town!)

Yes OP this was my first question to the council. I lived in an isolated area of a few hundred people and failed to understand how an officer could get to me. The nearest very small town was eight miles away.

I was reassured that they had a good few people to call on as some staff in other council roles earned extra by volunteering to be available as witnesses. This enabled coverage.

I suppose you could call them out when it's very likely for him to shout. Make out that hes doing it already.

You're experiencing severe and constant harassment so I'd imagine he's pretty easy to catch in the act.
He does it so often that you're unable to use your garden.

Go out to your garden with the officer as witness. He seems to be regularly doing it and frequently.
You'd be in no trouble because they know that sometimes it takes many visits for them to get the evidence. It's their job including out of hours.

I was able to quickly get mine witnessed. but that was because my neighbour carried on 8am to 11pm every single day. There were short breaks when he went out and wandered the area being intimidating.

It does sound like yours is very active in distressing you. If you usually can't use your garden then I'd guess that even with an hour to wait for an officer he'll still be out there waiting to be an arsehole.

Lastly I'm here to empathise at how soul destroying this situation is. It truly robs you of a safe life.
With time being so valuable to you I truly do know you're in a nightmare. The authorities are incredibly slow.

The only problem there is the neighbour would probably see the officers car and not make a peep.

Record on your phone any disturbances, you could video just the fence or grass or sky, as long as you can hear them.

Last time I commented I was so upset and angry for you @TotallyTangerineGeum , I think I probably told you to say something and stand your ground.

Forget that. You won't come out on top if its just you and your daughter, without even neighbours to back you up.

For full disclosure, I've never had a fight or public argument in my life, never voiced any annoyances etc, lived in a really nice area etc.

But about two years ago I think I really let myself down in a blind rage I've never had before or since.

Our new neighbours had two little dogs that would bark day and night, my disabled parents were living with us and our three kids, no-one got any sleep. They both went to work most days and left the dogs shut outside, and they constantly barked whether the owners where in or not, I don't know how they could ignore it but we could see them watching tv through their conservatory windows while the dogs just barked up our fence.

The dogs were small, a bit taller than Jack Russell's with coarser coats. We couldn't go outside at all without them barking. We love dogs so didn't blame them, even though our four year old was terrified at the time (Still is now he's 9 actually), because two Spaniels knocked him over on a walk about a year before, so we're constantly trying to reassure him when we see any dogs.
We told the neighbour they barked a lot, in a nice neigbourly way and he told us to shout their names and they'd be quiet.
Obviously this didn't work, but we ignored the dogs still and carried on going into the garden with the occasional "Be quiet Rosie/ Daisy!" he told us to shout. That never worked at all and we'd have to shout to speak to each other.
One day I heard him shouting at another really lovely neighbour that lived alone, he was vile. He said he knew she was the one that put a letter through his door complaining about the dogs noise, she needed to learn to live with it and he was just a complete aggressive arsehole.

The next day was when I lost the plot. I had a friend and her kids round playing with mine in my garden, the dogs had been barking for ages as usual but they started bunting the fence with their heads, and actually broke the wood at the bottom and got their head and shoulders through, into our garden right by the place our kids were playing, still snapping and biting. After I'd spent so long telling the kids, my youngest son especially, not to be scared, to ignore the dogs, they wouldn't hurt them ect I was furious. My friend pushed our lawnmower against the fence to block it in seconds luckily, and my mum came outside to take my youngest in because of the shouting she heard. I'll never forget the absolute terror of my kid crying.

As I said, I completely let myself down and I've never felt a rage like it. As soon as my son had gone inside with my mum I walked round my road to their front door and banged on it for about five minutes, so hard my knuckles were all swollen, no answer so I thought they were out. Rage decreasing lol. Then I saw them through the window hiding, after they'd been so vile and intimidating to our other neighbour, and the dogs had made my son so frightened after all we'd been doing to try and get him over his fear. I picked up a brick and was about to throw it through their window 😣as I said, never done anything like this before or after. Thank God I didn't, my poor dad had walked round to see if I was ok and shouted stop and shocked me out of it. I'm still embarrassed I had it in me to react so aggressively.

God that was so long sorry!
Tell your daughter something funny about it so she's not scared.
"God, Bob needs to get out more doesn't He 😂🙈" Then go and watch a favourite film together, or make a cake or crafting. Let her know he has no power over you both or your house, or emotions.
What does she like doing?

Update:

It’s a bit anti-climactic I’m afraid!
I spoke to the Officer late last night and told him everything and to summarise, he doesn’t initially think that it’s a Police issue! Yep, you read that right. However, he is going to speak to the supervisor of their neighbourhood team and see if there’s anything they can do. I did ask if:
• They could treat this as harassment? But he said not really as they no longer issue Harassment Information Warnings/Notices (at least not in North Yorkshire) as they weren’t found to be effective. Looking back on the conversation, I should have asked if this meant that they no longer deal with harassment full stop as I’m pretty sure that’s not the case. However I only really have one instance of harassing & threatening behaviour to report (so far, anyway) and I believe it would need to be at least two to constitute harassment.
• They could treat this as a hate crime? To which he said potentially yes but he wants to see if this is something the Neighbourhood team can deal with it, as he’s a “Response cop” and so is not the best equipped to handle it. He went on to say that the neighbourhood team have “their fingers in all the necessary pies, such as the Council, Housing Associations etc.
He said that he thinks rather than just addressing the behaviour I reported on Friday, he thinks it’s best to discover and address the “crux of the wider issue”. I then told him that months & months ago, my housing officer (who by the way, nobody is allowed the direct contact details of and is therefore more difficult to get hold of, than King Charles) had suggested a ‘Mediation’ of some sort, between my neighbour and myself, to try and resolve the matter. However I had said that whilst I’m 100% happy to do so with my neighbour herself, I would guarantee that she would bring her Dad and I wouldn’t feel comfortable with this. I told the Officer that as a survivor of Domestic Violence, I know that once abuse has occurred, mediation is no longer viable nor suggested in any scenario and the Officer agreed. This is a widely held opinion across the board including by the legal profession.

Anyway, the Officer has gone off to speak to the Neighbourhood Team’s Supervisor and will get back to me.

Meanwhile, I’ve had a reply from the Council worker from Environmental Health - which was my first step, weeks ago, when I finally snapped and could no longer ignore the barking & howling constantly for days on end - and he’s said that he’s received my recordings of their dog barking via the Noise App and that he’s also received a “long email from (my neighbour), explaining that their dog does not bark” He obviously did not disclose what the rest of their email said but that did leave me slack jawed! He asked my permission to disclose the recordings which I of course, have agreed to. I then updated him with what occurred on Friday and gave details of the police report etc.

I have also sent that wonderful email to my local MP which was kindly written by PP above and I’m awaiting a reply. Thank you again for that!

Also, shall I start a new thread? Or no?

Wow that's pretty shocking to be honest. I hope you get some better support soon.

@TotallyTangerineGeum have you told your dr about this?

Two things:

• The officer who visited you sounds treally limp and not inclined to proactively deal with this. I'd suggest you put it on record that you were looking for proactive support and advice and not all the reasons why your issues aren't valid. Please do not just accept what he said/didn't do as he has not helped to advance your case as necessary
• Please don't start another thread as it's easier to follow and comment on an active thread.

And lastly yes @NoLifeguardOnDuty that was a huge post - c600 words about your situation which IMHO hasn't helped the OP at all really....
Keep going anyway OP you are at least getting some support but I wish the authorities would be a bit more supportive and proactive for you.

Keep this thread as ppl get alerted when you update it

The officer you spoke to is correct that harassment warnings are no longer given. Police do still deal with harassment but as you rightly pointed out there must be a course of conduct involving two or more incidents.

He is absolutely correct that the Neighbourhood Policing Team are best placed to deal with this. They work closely with councils and housing teams to resolve antisocial behaviour and can help with things such as cameras etc. (though I note you have your own now).

Can you use the noise app to send the council recordings of the guy kicking off as well? 🤔

@TotallyTangerineGeum your update does not sound as anti climactic as it might feel. You are now taking on your neighbour across multiple fronts and they will yield results. Keep going, you’ve got this. And I’m pleased my letter to your MP helped, I find that MP’s are an underutilised resource in these sorts of situations and they can really help - nothing like an MP’s letterhead to get your case at the top of the pile.

NoLifeguardOnDuty
The only problem there is the neighbour would probably see the officers car and not make a peep.

Umm.......well surprisingly the environmental health officer parked some way away and arrived discreetly on foot. In my case they went to the back of my house. I let them in with no fuss.
One would almost imagine they are trained in doing so.
They also left their brass band at home.