Very advanced children

[GarlicSound]

I just happen to have landed on a bunch of threads by parents with 'gifted' children, and one or two about parents who think their kids are more gifted than they are.

It's reminded me of an 18-month-old I once met, who talked more eloquently than most 7-year-olds can. He had a very enquiring mind, asking intelligent questions (I was at work) and telling me about stuff he'd learned. He could read and was good at arithmetic. He was a little charmer, really, a delight to meet - if somewhat wearing; he never stopped asking questions.

He evidently had the mind of a toddler despite his advanced skills. He was quite physically developed, though still within range for his age. His mother told me her biggest worry was that people couldn't help treating him as if he were older, expecting him to be more responsible or experienced than he was able.

One of my nephews suffered from this as a young child, too - nothing like the prodigy I've just described, but he was verbally advanced due to spending nearly all his time with adults and was also big and strong for his age. Kids shouldn't have to keep telling adults "I'm only three, I can't do that!" but he did have to.

I sometimes wonder how Prodigy Child turned out. His mum said she was prepared for his development to slow down until others caught up, but lifetime prodigies do exist and I don't think they always have an easy time.

Have you known any DC like this? What happened to them? Alternatively, feel free to share about the deluded parents of normal children you have known!

My dd was a late talker (4) but could already read before she talked (we found out this once she started talking) she is very intelligent, plays many instruments but I’d swop everything for her to be able to interact socially and not have severe mental health issues, she’s autistic

One of my DC had very early language skills. Talking in full sentences and holding a conversation by 18 months, reading well before starting school,writing poetry at age 5. Her reception teacher told me she had never taight a child as advanced as her. She did well throughout primary school - GD at all in SATS - but I wouldn't say she was exceptional. She is in top sets for everything at secondary school but doesn't stand out. She favours English-based subjects rather than maths and science but has no interest in reading. The one skill she has which I would say is exceptional is her memory - she does a lot of drama and can memorise a page of script after reading it once. That should help her with exams.

She was also diagnosed with autism at the end of primary school and hyperlexia can be quite common among autistic children.

People always thought my now 15 year old was very advanced as a toddler. He wasn't, he was just small so the "18 month old" chattering away in full sentences, climbing everything etc was actually a very average 3 year old.

My eldest is very good at music (grade 8 on the piano, can pick up pretty much any instrument and teach himself to play it) but that's partly because he started learning the piano fairly early and partly because he loves it and works really hard. When he is away at university we really notice the quiet and it's weird having nobody playing the piano all the time.

I also think that academic intelligence doesn't necessarily lead to financial success later in life. I think self-confidence and the ability to communicate confidently with others is much more sought after in the workplace. I was very academic since childhood and have good qualifications but am also very reserved and can't perform well in interviews etc or have the confidence to be a leader in the workplace.

You are describing my elderly child. He was very advanced pre school, always exceptional at maths, did all the G&T stuff including summer schools for gifted children. He got all A*s at GCSE and in five A levels. Was always the one who got the highest marks in school, teachers said they had never taught anyone like him. Got an offer to do maths at Cambridge but ended up at Warwick where he got a first. He found that by the time he got to uni he was no longer the cleverest in class and had to work really hard.
Most of it was a photographic memory combined with a love of logic and numbers. He teaches maths and adores his job. He's still a clever clogs because he just soaks up information and never forgets it but he's not a genius.

What a knob.

The walking is on the early end of normal, I think. I go to several baby groups with my 11 mo and know one baby who was confidently walking at 7 months and another by 8 months. They seem otherwise unremarkable.

Yes, correct. But it's not the ordinary, state-backed schools getting all the flack lately, is it? Clobbering private schools with higher taxes was never going to work, especially seeing as some of the more elite ones have the capital to claim back on the VAT in the first place, ie Eton. Then all the state-backed schools need more funding to accept all the bright kids forced out of the private schools.

I always think having worked with proper geniuses (but not been one myself) that it's the inventive mind that shows real intelligence. Thinking outside the box and thinking of things that no one else has, whether it be in business or music or literature. Many people can be amazing at school subjects or work for whatever reason, but don't have any original ideas.

Yes ordinary state backed schools do indeed get flack. OFSTED under the Tories was highly results focused and things like progress 8 grading meant that many schools force youngsters who should be working at entry level or foundation stage into GCSES because a grade 1 GCSE counts towards school figures whereas a functional skills pass does not.

I guess private schools could have doubled class sizes to make them more in line with state schools class sizes, and absorbed the VAT rise.

In any case you initially talked of it being "smarmy and envious to destroy a decent education" for "gifted children" who "need to be nurtured" as if they are a breed apart. The clear implications being that only a private school is nurturing and only a private school can provide a decent education, and that the government has placed VAT on private schools because of envy. I imagine it's because they fundamentally disagree with purchasing advantage. The vast majority of kids in private school are no more special and gifted than any other kid.

My eldest was reading at two and by primary school was excelling in mathematics. He was put on the gifted and talented list but apart from one trip to the local university for a quiz nothing else materialised. He lost interest in studying at secondary school as he wasn't challenged. Fortunately he has done very well in an engineering career.

@GarlicSound yeah I love how she can tackle things like furniture. She put together a massive outdoor veg planter when she was 3.5 and it’s still standing a couple of years later 😄.

My cousin married someone who doesn’t speak English. He has at least 2 language degrees though so it probably isn’t an issue 😄. I haven’t met her but she’s apparently very odd.

This honestly gives me hope. It describes me and I’m hoping my eldest kid too.

i was very average at primary. I have often said I oppose the grammar system as I know I’d have failed the 11+ but I flourished after 13/14 and had a top set of A levels, russell group degree etc.

my eldest is youngest in her y4 at primary and very middle of the pack overall, nearer the bottom for maths tbh - sometimes I worry about her but then I remember education is a very long game and learning isn’t linear

@Theonlywayicanloveyou i was very average in primary school, and early secondary school. Around what is now gcse my grades shot up, a levels were great, university, PhD was easy.
I’m not an excellent scientist, but i have a job that pays just over 100k with a great work life balance. As far as i’m concerned, that is much better than scientific excellence :)

’Bog standard’ (wtf?) schools have always been demonised.

lol. Me. I was incredibly advanced as a young child with reading and writing. I’d read so so much and really advanced long books even by 5 or 6 years old. And understood them/enjoyed them, which is probably key! I used to write books all the time too. I achieved fairly well academically until I hit my teens and it became apparent I’m riddled with chronic illnesses and that’s somewhat of a distraction, the pain and being in and out of hospital etc. So that was that! I got all As and A*s at GCSE, did okay at A-Level (B-B-C) and didn’t go to uni. I still read all the time and I’m no idiot, but I’m not some genius bopping around the place! I’m incredibly happy with my life though, genius or not!

DS1 was like this. I soon realised that he excelled academically but all other aspects of life are equally, if not more important and I should focus on those, as he was less gifted in the areas of social skills and sport and fitness. So I let him learn at his own pace but my focus was on ensuring he learned social skills and could play with other children (he preferred collairng adults for deep chats. Lots of people thought he was autistic but he isn't - just brainy to the point of being odd-one-out.) I focused on making sure he found sports and physical activities that he enjoyed, as he was very much inside his own head.

He and his uni mates used to laugh that I was the only parent who called and anxiously asked: have you been to any parties? Tell me what you did this week socially. I never asked about how he was getting on with his academic work. And it was true - it was hugely important to me that he developed all life skills. I feel sorry for gifted children whose parents take such pride in their brilliance that they focus on it to the detriment of everything else.

DH was/is extremely gifted, got all a*’s at GCSE and then A-Level (he did 6 as he did two early!), but it’s almost all memory I think. He can remember absolutely everything, even things he learnt 20 years ago. I rarely have to google anything - I just ask him! But when we first met (he was 18) he was extremely socially awkward and that’s only really got better in the last couple of years. From what I know he’d been picked up as being gifted when he was about 4, but his mum never really pushed him. He did it all himself. He’s very successful now

DS2 was the opposite of the child in OPs first post. Due to a number of complex health issues, he still only weighed about 8lbs when he was a year old, and he was an early talker. At 4 years he looked about 18 months old - tiny with no hair. But he had a really wide vocabulary. It made me giggle when people's heads swivelled in public at this tiny baby coming out with really complex sentences. I often got asked: How old is he?

Well the Stephen Hawkings of the world were toddlers once and wonder how they presented then. I think some do continue to be super advanced and others fade. It also depends on temperament. How many parents bemoan that their child is not working hard enough to ‘reach their full potential’? And these aren’t particularly bright children but some are. I’m sure there are a number of highly intelligent people who are just not bothered with an ambition or the necessary discipline it takes to turn natural ability into a tangible skill.
I do know a number of bright people - my own DD is one.But she combines intelligence with curiosity and ambition and hard work - her straight A stars were not from being super intelligent, but from being smart enough to know how to study and earn them. And I think drive and ambition matter more than prodigal intellect any day.

Kids shouldn't have to keep telling adults "I'm only three, I can't do that!" but he did have to.

Had that with older two especially in year just before school- both summer born as well and who really struggled with reading and mental arthimetic in early school years - DS had entire reception year where he made little progress then started acting up.

Year before school I stepped in and told other adults how old they were in variety of non controversial ways and when questioned pointed out I'd given birth to them so really did know their ages best.

In school years I deflected all the unwanted "helpful" advice commenting in them struggling and put in support at home as school was all for waiting as they fell further behind. Had to fight idea from others they didn't have right brains for reading or maths or that they would always be behind. They caught by by Y4 and then did okay - both at uni now. They also stopped being taller and are now pretty averge DD1 slightly taller than average and DS on low side of average youngest being tallest.

So had them considered advanced and behind then sort of bright as in top set but then in A-levels quickly finding not Oxbridge like some relatives initally thought but still at good uni.

I think you just have to focus on the kids in question and deflect the unwanted comments and make sure they don't adversly affect the kids.

I have an IQ of 140, could read at 3 and was expected to excel academically. Unfortunately, I am also quite lazy, easily bored and although I did well at GCSE and A level.
I hated school and did not go to University, much to the disappointment of my very academic parents. I did well in my career , have a Masters degree, but could have done better, if I had more personal discipline.

Taught myself to read to read at two, sailed through school a year ahead, did my first set of GCSEs at 14, won an Oxford scholarship, did a PhD and am now a senior professor.

Mine have had IQs tested recently for Wechsler. One is 152, the other 150. Both have IQs that are listed as in the 99.98th centiles.

One of mine was so gifted at maths the teacher in Yr one tried to arrange to send him for extension work at the local secondary. The other was found in the reading teepee at preschool, reading a chapter book in her head. That was how we found out she could read. She started school clutching a chapter book, and was never on any reading scheme because she was so far beyond it that was pointless. Her first ever ed psych assessment found her reading age was 19, and she was six. She was moved to an independent school at 7, and she was at the ceiling of the INCA testing so nobody knew her reading age (it stopped at 16 yrs).

Both are intensely gifted academically. They're also autistic and have EHCPs, and struggle hugely in other ways. Complex, overlapping needs and dyspraxic, ADHD etc.

They are much younger than their ages emotionally, and desperately vulnerable. They could be conned very easily and my daughter would do anything if she believed the person loved her. It's scary. They are lovely, kind, warm, and interesting people and I am so proud of them, but also terrified for them. They are lacking in life skills to a considerable extent.

It's a bit of a nightmare tbh. Lovely in some ways obviously, but nobody needs to be that clever to do literally any career, or go to any university. You do need social skills they don't have to succeed in most areas, as well.

If I could chop 20 IQ points and swap them for better social understanding, and less vulnerability to abuse and exploitation, I would.

Not convinced that high IQ and ND go hand in hand. Certainly to reach the higher echelons of academia you need to be v smart and have good people management skills these days.