Fancy cars for disabled people

[LemaxObsessive]

Motability.

I am sick to absolute death of seeing people saying on various threads, that Motability vehicles are “given” to us disabled people “for free”.

PIP is awarded in 2 separate elements.

1. Daily Living (day to day care needs etc)
2. Mobility

Each element is paid at different rates depending on how affected by your disability you are (and yes, medical evidence is required). However, to be eligible for Motability, you need to be getting the highest rate of the Mobility element. This is currently £77.05 per week (which works out at £308.20 per 4 weeks or £333.88 per month).

When you join Motability you agree for the DWP to give Motability that £77.05 per week instead of it being paid to your bank. If you also receive the Daily Living element of PIP then you will still receive that directly.

You ALSO, in most cases, have to pay an advance payment (AP) for the vehicle. The better the vehicle, the higher the AP. You do not get the AP back.
The £77.05 per week pays for the lease of the car, insurance, roadside assistance, tyres & windshield cover. Disabled people in receipt of the highest rate of the PIP mobility element are already exempt from road tax.

With regards to the ‘fancy’ cars such as BMW, Audi & Mercedes, as you can imagine all of these have a whopping great AP in the multiple thousands of pounds; Which as I said, you don’t get back.
The taxpayer is not paying a penny towards these vehicles besides the fact that Motability don’t currently pay VAT which I believe is up for discussion.

I think a really important point to make here is that PIP is categorically not means tested (even millionaires can claim it, provided their health meets the criteria) and is not paid to replace a disabled person’s income! In other words, people do not live off PIP instead of working, it is paid to cover the added costs associated with being disabled. Costs non-disabled people likely have never even considered, such as cleaners when we can’t do it, basic gardening when we can’t do it, extra electricity for when medical equipment is used at home, ready meals when we’re bed-bound, delivery charges for every single thing we buy because click & collect isn't possible, taxis to work because the bus always already has a wheelchair user on it, along with lots of other small but mounting costs we have zero choice but to pay because the alternative isn’t an option for us. The lowest rate of PIP is just £29.20 per week so we’re not talking big money!

Millions of PIP claimants work full time but crucially, couldn’t do so without PIP and in many cases, without Motability!

As I said above, even wealthy people are eligible to claim PIP to cover the added costs associated with their disability and they can, if they receive the highest rate of the Mobility Component of PIP choose to use Motability. If they want to spend £7,999 plus £77.05 per week to lease an Audi Q4 for 3 years then they can but not many do because it’s a lot of money to have nothing to show for it after 3 years.

So no, nobody is being ‘given free BMWs, Audis or Mercedes’ regardless of what’s being said by anyone!

Where though, love?

Quote me where I said I resent disabled people having financial help?

Or don’t lie.

This is such a train crash of a thread.

Its what people over 65 claim

Because the Government does not think over 65 year old's should drive due to being ageist. However, you can use Attendance Allowance any way you like. Though many Labour voters would prefer that to be means tested as well. We can't have 'wealthy' pensioners getting something from the state can we..

Can your mind not grasp that independent people in their 80s exist?

I think the recent increase in benefit claimants has something to do with the large number of on-line ‘sick’ influencers who now guide people through the benefits claiming process - using the right key words etc to maximise the chance of a successful claim.

Sadly this does mean that genuine claimants may lose out in the long term if new restrictions are placed on the process due to the sheer volume of claimants.

Physically disabled since birth, never going to be ok, only worse with age. Had many medical interventions, some making my disability worse. I’ve received DLA/PIP since the age of 3. I’ve been on the motability scheme for almost 20 years. It’s been a godsend, I am immensely greatful for it. I’ve never had the money to afford a car, even when I was working. It’s the one thing I can’t do without. Two of my siblings pay more in tax in a month than I receive both of them are in the 40% bracket, they see it as they’ve paid for me and more. They don’t access the nhs etc before that argument starts. One is paying the advance payment on my car due next month because they want me to be comfortable and safe. So many disabled people have family that are tax payers, we aren’t some alien people that don’t have normal families, even those of us who are unable to work. Also I’ve said so many times that if I didn’t have this stupid disability I’d be just as successful as my siblings, this isn’t a choice, watching them with their lives knowing I’d have been the same is upsetting at times, I’d give up the cars and whatever else people think we don’t need etc to have a normal life.

i’ll answer this in part.

to get higher level mobility you need to be able to not walk 20 metres OR be sufficiently mentally ill that you never leave the house.

I only have experience of the first so that’s what I’ll address.

so, people who can walk more than 20 metres have options for getting to work.

they could walk. Some people (particularly those in cities, do). But if you are on high rate mobility you can’t walk more than 20 metres.

some people get the bus. Again, there’s fewer buses around than there used to be. The bus stop is probably more than 20 metres. If you have a wheelchair (and the nhs basically don’t provide them anymore, you have to buy your own) then the bus may or may not be accessible. Some cities guarantee wheelchair accessible buses (as does the Lake District!) but I live in a small town in east Anglia and the official line is “we try to provide wheelchair accessible buses where possible” which as far as I can see is never.

some people get the train. Most trains are not wheelchair accessible unless you prebook assistance which basically means getting someone at the station to unlock the ramp and put it between the train and platform. I travel by train quite a lot and in my experience the percentage of fuckups to ok journeys is about 50% and I once really damaged a wheelchair getting off (while in it!) a west coast mainline train because nobody met the train and the station was unmanned and the passengers were rude gits. I was lucky not to damage me.

so in these circumstances, trying to be there, safely, without damaging you or your wheelchair for job, much less being on time, is bloody difficult if you are a wheelchair user. Cars are a fuckton more reliable.

This is true. These influencers ought to be shut down, they also encourage people to use their worse days i.e say they’re bed bound all the time when in fact its 2/7 days a week, which is actually fraud.

You still need pretty solid medical evidence though. Do you think people just tell the dwp they cant walk and the dwp say ok no probs heres some money

16% of 3.8 million is 608,000.
860,000 minus 608,000 means approximately 252,000 motability cars used by non-working disabled people
Many of those will be retired - like me.
I worked as a teacher for over 30 years, till I got Covid in 2020, resulting in me becoming a quadruple amputee at the age of 57. Unsurprisingly, perhaps, teaching without hands or feet wasn't really a feasible option.
My motability car helps me volunteer - I run a monthly Messy Church, visit a nursing home, give talks about disability awareness, was a Pets as Therapy volunteer.
It allows me to get to my prosthetics centre 60 miles away.
It gives me quality of life by allowing days out.

PIP is the only state "benefit" I get. apart from the car, it pays for a weekly PA who sorts my medications and helps with manual tasks I can no longer do. It helps fund a weekly cleaner. It pays towards other costs of disability - like the off-road chair (£12,000 new) which allows me to walk my dog, extra water as showering takes longer, electricity to charge my wheelchairs and run my stair lift, so many disability aids to enable me to be as independent as possible, etc.

I'd gladly trade my PIP, motability car and all, to have hands and feet again. I paid tax and NI happily for my working life to provide for people who need help. I was a tax payer. Now I need help from other tax payers.

When comments are made about, "do so many people need additional mobility funding?", those people include me. I think I do need additional mobility funding. So do many others.

Disabled4life

Best wishes to you !

Please report him if you have concerns.

If I were PM I would direct parental payments to schools so that all children received meals and equal access to educational materials - books, laptops etc Patents would be incentivised to send children to school as they'd be fed breakfast, lunch and two snacks.

Aside from that, I think disability entitlement will be reassessed at some point. Reading posts on here, so many children have issues. At what point does commonality of a condition no longer make it a disability but part of life?

ccquad · Today 22:12

Why are you having to justify your PIP and why you need a Car...

This is a silly argument. I have no issue with PIP or Motability, but it’s not yours because you paid in. Someone who had never been able to work due to their disabilities is (rightly) just as entitled to it even though they’ve never paid in. It would be ridiculous to base it on what you’ve paid in, or to think those who were able to pay in before becoming disabled, or those who are still able to pay in, are more worthy of receiving it than those who can’t.

As we raise the retirement age …what else was going to happen but growth with these statistics? How anyone could envy a life on benefits defeats me…or not be aware of how hard it is to be disabled…it’s a stupid focus when so much tax avoidance and profiteering is happening …absolute peanuts and attacking the vulnerable

The pp is suggesting that someone aged 80 cannot be on pip.

this is because the only way to be on pip if you are over state pension age is to have been on it before you reached state pension age.

pip was introduced in 2013. So say someone claimed it age 64 and 364 days, the oldest they could be now is 76 and 364 days.

so your nan who is 80 cannot be on pip.

Genuine question here as I'm really, really curious about how this is possible. I don't know this person personally, they're a social media personality but I'm just baffled at to how this is possible. Not slating anything at all as I myself receive enhanced care and mobility.

16 year old girl, diagnosed with ADHD, passed her test and received a mobility car at 16. Obviously a mobility car as she was still only 16 so not legal otherwise.

No mobility issues, was previously traveling via train to a different city daily to attend college to study dance and competes in dance comps so very physically able. This surely cannot be right?

The criteria for high rate mobility is more complicated than ‘unable to leave the house alone’.

It’s more like ‘unable to undertake a journey safely and reliably on the majority of days’. People can need support, aids, adaptations. They can need someone on standby to rescue them if they panic. They can need prompting and encouragement. It’s not quite ‘housebound’. This leads to people thinking they know people claiming fraudulently when they don’t actually know the facts, or see the level of support required behind the scenes. ‘Majority of days’ means 4+ days a week. And people can manage familiar journeys or journeys they have rehearsed, but be unable to plan and follow a new journey, unable to cope if there’s a diversion, etc.

So someone who has to take to their bed for two days a week isn’t disabled?

I think there are some people who will exaggerate their situation for financial gain (because the system allows this) and they find a way to generate the necessary evidence.

They may be needing a significant amount of support to make those journeys. Or may be unable to manage the journey reliably etc. They will have had to provide supporting evidence to the DWP.

The pip criteria is quite rigid and refers to ‘the majority of days’, which means 4+ days a week. In reality, a person who is totally bed bound two days a week is likely to be significantly impaired on the other days too

Yes they’d be just as entitled on the basis of NI credits, I was taking about MY situation and how I view it.