Fancy cars for disabled people

[LemaxObsessive]

Motability.

I am sick to absolute death of seeing people saying on various threads, that Motability vehicles are “given” to us disabled people “for free”.

PIP is awarded in 2 separate elements.

1. Daily Living (day to day care needs etc)
2. Mobility

Each element is paid at different rates depending on how affected by your disability you are (and yes, medical evidence is required). However, to be eligible for Motability, you need to be getting the highest rate of the Mobility element. This is currently £77.05 per week (which works out at £308.20 per 4 weeks or £333.88 per month).

When you join Motability you agree for the DWP to give Motability that £77.05 per week instead of it being paid to your bank. If you also receive the Daily Living element of PIP then you will still receive that directly.

You ALSO, in most cases, have to pay an advance payment (AP) for the vehicle. The better the vehicle, the higher the AP. You do not get the AP back.
The £77.05 per week pays for the lease of the car, insurance, roadside assistance, tyres & windshield cover. Disabled people in receipt of the highest rate of the PIP mobility element are already exempt from road tax.

With regards to the ‘fancy’ cars such as BMW, Audi & Mercedes, as you can imagine all of these have a whopping great AP in the multiple thousands of pounds; Which as I said, you don’t get back.
The taxpayer is not paying a penny towards these vehicles besides the fact that Motability don’t currently pay VAT which I believe is up for discussion.

I think a really important point to make here is that PIP is categorically not means tested (even millionaires can claim it, provided their health meets the criteria) and is not paid to replace a disabled person’s income! In other words, people do not live off PIP instead of working, it is paid to cover the added costs associated with being disabled. Costs non-disabled people likely have never even considered, such as cleaners when we can’t do it, basic gardening when we can’t do it, extra electricity for when medical equipment is used at home, ready meals when we’re bed-bound, delivery charges for every single thing we buy because click & collect isn't possible, taxis to work because the bus always already has a wheelchair user on it, along with lots of other small but mounting costs we have zero choice but to pay because the alternative isn’t an option for us. The lowest rate of PIP is just £29.20 per week so we’re not talking big money!

Millions of PIP claimants work full time but crucially, couldn’t do so without PIP and in many cases, without Motability!

As I said above, even wealthy people are eligible to claim PIP to cover the added costs associated with their disability and they can, if they receive the highest rate of the Mobility Component of PIP choose to use Motability. If they want to spend £7,999 plus £77.05 per week to lease an Audi Q4 for 3 years then they can but not many do because it’s a lot of money to have nothing to show for it after 3 years.

So no, nobody is being ‘given free BMWs, Audis or Mercedes’ regardless of what’s being said by anyone!

We’ve just paid 13k AP for my daughter’s WAV - she is 10, in a wheelchair with various conditions. Without it, we couldn’t get her to school - the school run is 100 miles a day. She is in receipt of high rate care and mobility.

Motability Grants are based on income and if you qualify you get no say in the vehicle provided.

i work full time, long hours, have done so for 35 years, paying a lot of tax and have never claimed any other benefit. My daughter will never work and will need 24 hour care for the rest of her life.

do I feel I need to justify getting £77 per week to pay for her WAV, no.

So you’re asset rich but cash poor and yet claim you wouldn’t accept the £75 per week mobility award of PIP should you qualify. Nor would you exchange it for a car that would fit yours and your family’s needs, that incurred the sole cost of fuel? I’m going to need some convincing that you would rather not accept that should you become disabled in some way.

@DontGoJasonWaterfalls
Well said but I’m so sorry to hear that. Anyone claiming people would swap with you is clearly unhinged.

@AM130674 No you don’t need to justify this. There are some really awful people on here.

I presume you are not living with a a disability
It's all very sitting their pontificating about weather disabled peoole should claim disability benefits when its not you affected .

You sound so privileged. Congratulations.

Absolute nonsense! DH’s father was a Northern working class bricklayer and his mother left school at 15 with no qualifications. They had to be courting for 7 years, to save up for marriage and a house.

DH has experience of growing up, and his parents never had two half pennies to rub together. He barely saw his father, because he was working all week, then did overtime at weekends to make ends meet. DH never had birthday/Christmas presents, a birthday party, a holiday, barely any clothes or a takeaway; and never went to a fair, theme park, theatre, a restaurant, you name it!

My parents were slightly better off than his, but they still had to watch every penny.

So, he and I both have plenty of experience of the problems of ordinary non disabled life. It was way easier than being the parents of disabled DC! Both of us would swap lives for an ordinary working non disabled life in a heartbeat!

However, I get sick to death of people going on about how ordinary working people are paying for the disabled and they are jealous of the new cars! The bottom 50% of the population do not pay enough tax to pay for what they get out of the state, never mind paying for other people! They get for free the NHS, education for their children, the emergency services, defence, social care, a raft of laws for their protection, welfare benefits as applicable and eventually the state pension. Hardly nothing!

The top 50% of tax payers support them and the disabled, by paying higher taxes.

So what if a millionaire is disabled and chooses a large upfront payment to get a BMW? The amount of tax they pay, is way beyond the £77 per week PIP mobility, they get back! Would the country be better off, if they went to work abroad? No, it wouldn’t!

My dh is one of thise low paid workers
We also hsve a severely disabled child
Who has a mobility car, that my dh gets to " Swan around "
Ww are not exactly living a life of luxury despite what you might think
And I very much dount anyone jealous that we have a car would want to trade lives with me..

I dont even know why your on this thread as you clearly know nothing about the benefit system
If you did you would know that the two child benefit limit ,has absolutely nothing to do with child benefit and never has been
And yet your confidentially telling everyone one you think they should do.

Tbf I wonder why anyone is giving that poster, the time of day. They seem to be making things up, as they go on.

Also this picture painted of disabled people living lives of only hardship, suffering and pain isn't one I recognise from the disabled people I know in real life. I'm sure it's true for some, as it'll also be true for some not in receipt of disability benefits. And yes I know that disability will make it more likely to face difficulties, fear and pain. There isn't a neat line down the middle with disabled people on one side, all suffering terribly, and non disabled on the other side all doing just fine. Most disabled people I know have a lovely life, great, I wouldn't want anything else for them, does it come with extra challenges? Yes, of course. I have a blind friend, blind since birth, who doesn't even consider himself disabled, he has a great life.

I have a blind friend, blind since birth, who doesn't even consider himself disabled, he has a great life.

Lovely, really good for your friend. I used to think like that when I was younger, and did not consider myself as being disabled. Mind you the word used at the time was not very palatable, to myself, anyway, as I got older I began to understand that I was struggling more than my peers, and trying to be just like them was doing myself no favours. Also the way Society is set up, was making life more difficult for me. Disabled people are not a monolith though. I will accept any help I can, such as having a BB, and could not care less what other people think. They would take the help in my shoes, regardless of what they are saying now, when they are not living with any disabilities themselves.

I'm guessing your not actually disabled yourself
But think you can tell others how to view their disability based on your anecdotal experiences of knowing some disabled people ?
I mean good for your blind friend
However disabilities can range from mild to profound
And you have no business telling others how they should feel about their disabilities.

I didn't tell anyone how they should feel. I said I don't recognise this picture for poor suffering disabled people (good) Another friend of mine is a wheelchair user and constantly travelling (again, good for them) travel was always a passion for them and I'm very glad they can still do it, all be it now in a different way with extra difficulties. They still travel more than anyone else I know can (they got a big pay out after an accident, that's how they can afford this, nothing to do with benefits).
I think people should be allowed to question why some disabled people get extra money for transport, who drive to work every day in a normal car, earning the same as their non disabled colleagues, who also all have to drive to work every day in a car they have to fund themselves.
Or should they all just shut up and pay up?

I recognise the suffering and pain bit. My husband has been disabled for 35 years and is in pain when he takes his morphine, in agony when it's wearing off. Over time it gets less effective but you can't keep increasing the dose beyond a certain point.

Because it goes off need not diagnosis.

They probably don't tell you everything? Most of my friends aren't aware that I'm waiting for a genetics test or have to have a pain killing injection to live a relatively normal life. They're also not aware that I live with a brain injury which amongst other things, causes vertigo and memory problems

The latest TUC research into the disability pay gap shows it was 15.5%. That means the earnings gap between disabled and non-disabled workers across the UK is around £2.24 an hour. Over £4k pa. Wider for women than men.

That is on top of Scope’s latest disability price tag research shows disabled households need an extra £1,095 each month on average to have the same standard of living as non-disabled households.

Most disabled people I know have a lovely life, great, I wouldn't want anything else for them, does it come with extra challenges? Yes, of course. I have a blind friend, blind since birth, who doesn't even consider himself disabled, he has a great life.

But would you swap your able bodied life for his disabled great life?
I had a great life before my diagnosis and to an extent I still do but it’s severely tarnished by my disability. I’m told regularly how great I am, inspiring, so positive, a great example but do you know what those people don’t see? Me crying in the toilets at work because I feel so vulnerable when I lose the ability to walk and I have to ask for help, the embarrassment I feel when I begin to tremor and stammer when it’s time to take my medication, not being able to get out of a piece of clothing so I have to ask my DH to help me, genuine fear that I will be questioned when I park up and put my blue badge on the dashboard because at that moment I am presenting like I don’t have anything wrong with me. I’m sure your friend does have a great life but you have no idea how much effort goes into it being the case. I’d go so far as to say that if you really knew them you would realise the adaptions and compromises they have to make on a daily basis to make it so. Nobody wants to be continually complaining about their disability as it’s not good for us plus all friends would soon disappear but that doesn’t mean everything is just peachy.

Well if your able bodied friends are really lucky then they could have an accident driving, end up in a wheelchair with a big payout entitling them to subsidised travel.

The issue I have is the binary.

Your description of your life sounds just like mine. But I don't qualify for any benefits because my condition fluctuates and is poorly understood. I work full time in a high pressure job and have little quality of life outside it.

It isn't the case that everyone who doesn't claim benefits is bouncing around feeling full of health and living their best life. Lots of the taxpayers paying for these benefits are also struggling through every day

We need a dialogue that recognises this isn't a binary and that disabled people are often working to fund other disabled people

Lots of peoole are living with conditions that impact their lives and they are not entitled to disability benefits most of us understand that which is why disability benefits are for the people impaired the most by their disabilities, I have said this before but both my sons are closed as having disabilities, my 19 year old had acute necrotising pancreatitus three years ago and it destroyed his pancreas, he's, now insulin dependent diabetic, he doesn't however qualify for disability benefits, becsuse he can independently care for himself and travel independently
My 15 year old is severely autistic with severe learning disabilities, he gets HRC,and HRM ,as his cognitive ability is that of a 2/3 year old and needs round the clock supervision
They both have disabilities but there is a vast difference in how it impacts them.

Is 'I have a blind friend' the disability equivalent of 'I have a black friend' now!

What you are not seeing, is how much extra those 2 friends have to do just to be able to do normal, everyday things. Even just things like getting the train into town. Your wheelchair user friend would have to ring ahead at all stations to make sure someone was there to facilitate the ramp to get on and off the train. Possibly take a convoluted journey because still, not every station has lifts. I know less about VI, but enough to know taking an unfamiliar journey is not straightforward.

Then you have all the difficulties once out. Even simple things like people walking in front of your wheelchair or cane. You can't just dart around people in a wheelchair like you can on foot. Everything is more difficult. Everything takes longer. Your friends don't complain about it because that's their normal!

If life was as simple as just deciding to go to town, hopping on a train, doing what you need to do, and jumping on a train back, there would be no disability payments.

I have a blind daughter, blind since the age of 11, and she is now about to turn 18. My DD is blind because her birth mother misused heroin, methadone, crack cocaine, cannabis and vodka while she is pregnant. My DD doesn’t think she has a happy life and she does live a life of hardship, compared to her sighted peers. Literally everything is harder for her. Your comment is offensive and ableist and I am so sick of the ‘my blind friend’ narrative. Obviously, because you know one blind person, you are the expert on all blind people and how they do and should live their lives. And all blind people should clearly follow your friend’s example and live a jolly life and not be allowed to rage at the world for the unfairness, as my teen is wont to do. And, no, we don’t have a Motability car.

The point is, lots of people are writing on this thread as though anyone not claiming these benefits must be full of health and vigour. Thats simply not true. And once we accept that many tax payers also have quite limited lives and tough battles then we understand why it's unacceptable for tax payers to help fund luxury brand cars. A car to get from a to b, yes, but to ask for more than that to be funded is selfish . If people can afford an Audi or Mercedes with benefits then they don't need the benefits.