I don't want to pay more fucking tax!

[marthainthemarket]

I am the sole earner in a family of four, earning just under 40k a year and getting probably fuck all or below inflation pay increase next year, if I am lucky enough to keep my job ( public sector and employer needing to make massive budget savings). I barely cope now.

I am so fucking angry that Labour fucked up the disability benefit cuts. Other countries don't have run away disability benefits crises because they have a proper assessment process that means they keep a lid on people getting disability benefits who don't really need them. But instead of dealing with that, they came up with a crap proposed cut that wouldn't have dealt with the actual issues and they couldn't defend.

And having fucked that up they are now raising everyone's tax. I hate them!

The problem is I am sure everyone posting wants a better NHS a good education system, reliable public transport and a good mental health and social services system that will look after them. These are and can only be funded out of taxation. Businesses rely on all of this to ensure a healthy and educated workforce. Even if you have the money to pay for private health and education the medical staff and teachers the private system uses will generally have come from the state system. There isn’t loads of spare money sloshing around which efficiencies can save as Reform have found in the Councils they have taken over. Indeed in the ones I have read about they seem to be actually increasing spending on their own pet projects. Tax rises are not good but paying less tax and having to find money for private healthcare and education because the state system is such a failure is much more expensive and on 40k a year I would say completely out of reach. Reforms answer will be to cut public spending again and give everyone a few quid extra in their pocket just like the Tories did which is why we are where we are. Brexit has made it all worse. I don’t know what the answer is and I think Labour were stupid not to level with people in the first place. I do think they are trying to get us out of this situation and I am willing to give them longer to do it. Hopefully the pain will mainly be felt by those with broadest shoulders who seem to have done very well under the previous government. We shall soon find out.

I agree. And am also still angry.

The pandemic where they just printed money and gave it to people to sit on their couch, and to "businesses" that could fill in a form?

Not sure why the quote didn't post -

This seems prescient though:* *
Chuka Umunna, a leading figure in the Labour In campaign, said the Labour vote would be critical in ensuring a vote to stay in the EU. “Those of us on the left and centre-left carry a huge responsibility. If we don’t ensure we win, we will be handing the likes of Farage, Le Pen and Trump – who stand against so much of what we believe in – a huge victory. We cannot afford to let this to happen.”

We need fundamental reform - this tax rise isn’t going to deliver that, we’re at the mercy of the bond markets due to our debt and debt interest.

the idea this will fix any foundations is laughable, it’s more money down the drain. It won’t solve the growth, debt, income or productivity issues we have.

I do think that the country is in more financial shit than they are letting on.
But then again they couldn’t really indicate that because it would cause a panic.

And yet there are those who are taking out far more than they are putting in so I think it is a little unfair to tell them to grow up.

I can’t stand Labour, their hypocrisy, nor their lies. I am a higher rate tax payer and what pisses me off the most is that I’ll get hit by multiple increased taxes because of them.

HOWEVER, if it were a case that such taxation hikes would lead to better services, namely the NHS, then I could square it. And yet we all KNOW not a jot of difference will be made; funds sunk into stupid inefficient procurement processes and middle management.

The rich will leave the UK.

Have you actually looked into claiming Universal Credit on those earnings with those level of dependents.

Care to elaborate on your statement?

Which part of us bailing out the banks, that led to austerity that led to the disenfranchised and racists voting for Brexit, bringing about a Johnson government ('to get Brexit done') that disastrously led us through a pandemic - which spaffed up billions on dodgy contracts for cronies... bit to you find 'a load of bollox'?

Whether I will be happy to pay more tax, depends on what the taxes are. And if large corporations are also having increased taxes.

He probably thought he looked like Bruce Wayne in Gotham.

Other countries don't have run away disability benefits crises because they have a proper assessment process that means they keep a lid on people getting disability benefits who don't really need them

Stand by to be told we have assessments too, OP, that they're VERY difficult and that only a tiny minority are gaming the system (which for all I know some may even believe)

Also prepare to be told that our public services are the very model of efficiency - the irony being that if all this was true we may not need tax rises at all

It's very mean of you to point the finger at pensioners, the disabled, and those below working age.

People on very low earnings pay little income tax, or none at all. I'm pretty sure many of them would prefer to be earning more and paying more.

It shouldn’t have to be like this.

who stand against so much of what we believe in –

Like trying to overthrow democratic votes and making the plebs vote again (and again if necessary) until they get it "right", LOL.

if it were a case that such taxation hikes would lead to better services, namely the NHS, then I could square it. And yet we all KNOW not a jot of difference will be made; funds sunk into stupid inefficient procurement processes and middle management

Exactly, @MauriceTheMussel - though I wouldn't want to assume the money would even reach procurement or managers when focus groups deciding where it should all go to could easily eat the lot

I absolutely agree.

It's surely reaching a tipping point now when working people on £40k plus are struggling, paying for everything and everyone. Whereas some people seem to manage to achieve a very good lifestyle on benefits and bring in nearly as much monthly. Work should always pay, and at present it doesn't.

I also fail to understand why the motability scheme is so generous. This definitely needs reform too. We can't carry on like this, just handing out generous funding regardless. If they want to increase income tax there also needs to be some consequences for non tax-payers too. Why should it always be the responsible working people who bear the brunt of these economic choices?

I can understand why young working people are getting angry and fed up.

This. Time for the non contributing percentage of the population to start contributing.

I think there are very, very few people who would be happy at the thought of paying "more fucking tax".

I certainly don't relish it given I'm about to start paying on quite a large mortgage. I can assure you on that point!

We do have an increasingly elderly and unwell population that needs paying for, we have outdated and failing infrastructure, our economy has taken a huge hit due to many factors, and we are in a fair bit of debt. Tinkering around the edges with IHT / corporation tax / SDLT will do fuck all.

Income tax, NICs, and VAT make up two thirds of this countries tax revenue. If you want to raise money quickly, these are the ones you need to increase.

For comparison, corporation tax raises 11%, and IHT and CGT combined raise around 4% of the countries tax revenue.

If your 40k a year is from income from work I doubt you will be paying more tax after the budget. If you are sitting on your backside making 40k a year on income from stocks and shares you will hopefully pay more tax if the government finally aligns capital gains tax rates with income tax rates. In this scenario while you personally would be paying more tax than before you would finally pay the same as those of us who go out and work for their living. Assuming the former you'll be fine and I really don't know what you're ranting about.

One of the largest (if not the largest, I'd need to check) non-contributing groups in the UK is pensioners. And that group is increasing in size relevant to the general population every year thanks to our ageing population.

I'm not sure how that would work to be honest.

We feel similar - we are actually happy to pay taxes at the current higher rate as we believe we have a civic duty to support the vulnerable in society and to fund schools and the NHS… but when we see money being thrown away on projects that get abandoned, on PPE that was unfit for use, to paint road crossings in colours that represent this year’s political cause (at £15k a pop), or any bloody mismanagement of public funds it sticks in our craw.

Don’t mind paying tax IF the services are vaguely decent…at the moment they’re shockingly bad. Unless your kid gets into a good grammar then options are often poor (though you could also argue bad behaviour/parenting impacts this too), nhs is good in a few areas but utterly awful in many others (those on the front line are most often wonderful but management & waste is appalling), and it goes on. And yep - Brexit was a f-ing huge mistake - how people are giving Farage the time of day is bewildering!!! ….we need people in charge with knowledge & relevant experience - not Rachel and her fictional CV. How is she still in a job?! How many times can she lie and get away with it. Just all so bloody depressing😖.

How and why? It seems madness.