If you are middle class do you feel your lifestyle is eroding?

[ceramicwitch]

Now I know that as long as we can afford to heat your home, pay your mortgage / rent and afford to feed yourself and your family you can't complain too much. However I am interested if you feel you used to have a a middle class lifestyle, able to afford nicer bits or activities if you feel that is being eroded?

I think I am feeling it, we used to be quite free with putting nice things in the basket at waitrose (not where we go all the time but where we get treats and more premium things) and not we are holding back quite a bit more. We usually go to the Theatre a few times a year and the ballet, especially at Christmas but this year we are giving it a miss due to ever increasing costs. We've stopped going to cafes if not on holiday.

I have good friends who live in quite an expensive part of town, He is a Doctor and they seemed to be quite oblivious to cost of living the past few years but the other day I was talking to him and he was saying how he doesn't much enjoy eating out these days as the cost of it sticks in his throat, even cheap and cheerful is quite pricy now.

Anyone else feeling that quality of life even for the supposedly well insulated middle classes is in decline?

Yes; the collective welfare state is a way of getting around the fact of inflation. It works as long as you have economic growth plus a steady population increase or the population stays the same (and if other economic conditions stay broadly the same). For example, if houses still cost the same ratio of average house price to average salary as they did forty or fifty years ago, then the working population would have much less problem affording the pensions bill plus the taxation to keep all the rest of the country going.

But it’s not just about the pensions - it’s about a combination of lots of things: longer life expectancy, the triple lock, a massively overpriced housing bubble where most of the housing wealth is owned by those who are also taking the pensions; a demographic bulge of pensioners with a much bigger healthcare bill (including the same pensioners needing social care and also demanding expensive healthcare interventions for eg. cancer, joint replacements, etc. which were not available decades ago) — PLUS the other big economic whammies: Brexit, the financial crisis in 2008, the student loans system, and a long period of Tory mismanagement of national infrastructure and low investment in skills, productivity and machinery, which means we have run down our workforce and have a low-productivity economy with crumbing public services.

All of this has been forecast for decades - Adair Turner’s pensions review in the 2000s warned of the consequences of unsustainable pensions commitments - but anyone who still dares to maintain this “how dare you criticise the older generations” stuff in 2025 knows perfectly well where all the housing wealth and public funding has gone, and it isn’t to younger workers, families, and children, all of whom are seen as fodder to keep the house prices high, and pay out the state pensions they won’t themselves have a chance of having.

Gets a bit tedious.

You work hard and pay more!

Why bother?

@PeonyPatch I work in education & the impact on schools particularly in London is quite staggering. It's happened faster than predicted.

"There are expected to be 400,000 fewer pupils at schools in England by the end of the decade than today, and primary pupil numbers have already dropped by 150,000 since 2019, the EPI said"

London is the only major UK city getting older.

Upper middle is still middle. The OP didn’t specify lower middle.

Well, here I am… making that very distinction.

Ik and I’m saying it’s probably for the best given the workforce in twenty years.

I get the can’t afford stuff part. But I still think Labour demonises higher tax payers for votes which doesn’t help.

Yes, I’ve read that many schools risk being closed down. I guess it simply is a sign of the times and the impact our economy has had on child-rearing. The golden era of the baby boomer generation simply does not exist anymore. Long gone is the norm of large families. People simply cannot afford it. Coupled with the climate crisis, many are choosing not to bring children into the world too.

But I still think Labour demonises higher tax payers for votes which doesn’t help.

I hate the frozen tax bands that the Tories introduced, I assume labour will extend them 😭

I don't view us as middle class - I don't really understand the parameters to be honest, and don't really care; we both work, A LOT - joint household income of about £100k with no kids if it's relevant.

But yes; definitely. We have a large (for us) mortgage due to renovation costs, but other than that no optional debt (loans/car finance etc). I view the mortgage as future proofing/investment and we have in turn increases equity etc.

However;

Going to the fish and chip shop; £25 for two min, cinema £15 a ticket. A glass of wine in a nice bar, £11 easily. It's ridiculous. Going out to eat with a couple of drinks seems to be min £80-£100 without even trying. I went to our local hotel bar recently, and they had ALDI £4.49 Rose in their fridge. I love ALDI, but selling their wine, at hotel bar prices is taking the absolute piss.

I plan the food shop, mostly just because I hate waste, but we've gone from maybe £70.00 to £110.00 in the last 4 years, approx. average per week. Nothing fancy, just decent food and household essentials.

We still have a life, absolutely, but we save less. That makes me anxious, but equally we only have one life. To be honest it pisses me right off that although I know we are far better off than so many people, we both work easily 50 hours a week, surely we should have a bit more financial freedom than we do in reality?

I'm not moaning, because we can afford to live, and if the boiler or the car dies it won't sink the ship. But the fun is definitely less, or at least more considered.

This guy Laffer says it all. Worth a listen. Somethings may be questionable (eg. I definitely don’t like Reform). However…

Yes, of course. I’m glad we aren’t starting out with young kids now. Our choices regarding education would certainly be different. We would likely live somewhere different also as we don’t currently live in a good catchment. To be honest I’m not sure we would make decision to have a family at all if we were starting out now. I think it’s likely we would move from the UK to work too.

Not really for us. It’s more about the suitability of the accommodation. We might as well stay where we are, and possibly put in a stairlift. We can’t install a downstairs loo, no room. Our ideal scenario is to rent for our last years. It also means when one of us dies, whichever of us is left would have support if needed.

My lifestyle hasn’t adjusted but I have had to spend more mindfully and we definitely waste less.

None professional parents, I didn't go to uni, I work full-time in a none professional role.
I didn't get help with a house deposit, no financial help with our wedding or childcare etc.
Basically my definition of working class is 'working hard for everything and knowing there is no safety net if you lose the job that is paying for it all'.

Well then your lifestyle has adjusted then… 🤔

@peonypatchI think I know where you’re coming from but for us we’re at the stage where we do exactly the same and eat exactly the same but I’ll do things like book holidays much earlier, and buy stuff as i need it. So I have adjusted my spending within that with a net same effect. Plus we have had a some good pay rises.

But I am expecting inflation to get worse, so am actively seeking a promotion. Which is something I really should have done years ago.

Obviously not all can, but many do. Or do you think only the aristocracy and landed gentry ski?

Obviously not!

Inflation destroys everyone's standard of living, so yes. Hardly on the breadline but I'm less comfortable than I was, on a higher salary. Restaurants seem too expensive, I'm not going to the ballet this year, no half term trips, will probably put bonus in savings not do house renovation as it's too risky if my job goes.

I think everyone is negatively affected. We are very fortunate I am a partner in an architectural practice and my husband is a surgeon our incomes are good. However in the past year we have faced VAT on our children's school fees and rises in fees higher than previous years - 5 children and around 80k per year increased costs. My business is of course affected by the increase national insurance costs. Construction is struggling and will struggle further regardless of the Government blaming planning process while ignoring the cost of material that continues to rise and kill construction, along with some other factors around renewables, social value etc.

To balance this and business costs we have removed lots of non essential things from fresh flowers in the office to less frequent cleaners, no more Friday morning yoga classes, no taxis, no staff parties this year, no bonuses at Christmas, no pay rises or promotions, less employees along with the removal of work experience and we have stopped apprenticeships altogether. So lots of people we deal with are being affected with less income.

Our personal costs have risen however we are cushioned by years of earning more than we required to live the life we wanted.

.

Construction is struggling that’s the first time I’ve heard those words in living memory. Are they struggling to find work? Seems unbelievable.

Yeah. I agree with PP - it’s odd. It’s almost like you’re trying to prove you’ve been doing X that wealthier people do as if it matters? I ski, aside from a hiatus due to child being too young, I’m heading back to the same resort. I want to try other resorts but not because of cost, but because it’ll be a different view and snow covered nature is gorgeous - cross-country skiing FTW. Especially if there are frozen lakes nearby (Sweden and Norway).

Basically, if you’re saying you’re downgrading because of cost, perhaps, just maybe, find a different sport to do?

🤭🤭

So anyone who isn't feeling their lifestyle is eroding isn't middle class or just isn't allowed to respond?