If you are anti private school are you also anti tutoring?

[WWGD]

Putting aside the obvious - that a tutor is about £2k a year and private school about £25k a year…

My kids are state educated. Many of our friends are surprised by this as they go private, but our objection is political as much as financial. We just don’t believe it is right to buy that level of privilege and opportunity. We’d also rather spend that money on holidays etc.

dd has asked for a tutor in subjects she is struggling with. I have arranged this. But this too is buying privilege and opportunity. Though not the networking and prestige.

I am comfortable with my decisions. I am just wondering whether people who are anti private school for political reasons also think tutoring is beyond the pale?

I was going to put this in aibu but actually am interested in people’s views rather than being flamed.

Let's face it... for involved parents, we will do what we can to get what we consider to do the best for our children. And the more money you have, the easier it is. So chosing to buy a house in the right catchment, sacrifices if the state option isn't good, supplementing with extra curricular and tutors, just sitting down and doing their homework with them. We do it because we love them and want the best for them.

Its not just a IL thing. Its everywhere where you arentvrandomly allocated a school by a government

I find this talk about privilege fascinating. Has it come from the US? Where does it stop? Who decides what is and isn’t privilege? Surely it’s relative?

Am I privileged because I: can afford a car/have hot water/travel abroad several times a year/eat three meals a day/am white/can put my heating on without worrying about it/have shoes that keep my feet warm/went to university/can read and write/have a stable loving family/have a roof over my head/live in a country not at war/can easily access medical care?

Can someone on this thread who’s using the word privilege please help me understand this word because it’s bandied around so much yet doesn’t appear to have a fixed definition.

Thanks 🙏

I’ve only recently discovered this too as we head towards the sixth form years.

All school sixth forms have academic requirements to get into the sixth form - an overall GCSE grade average plus specific grades in specific subjects for specific A level subjects. So to do psychology you might need a 6 in biology. To do a sconce you’ll need a 7 or 8 in that science subject. That kind of thing.

It makes an absolute farce of universities prioritising state school pupils. All of them will have come from selective sixth forms, whether fee paying or not.

What makes you think private schools are neither part of their local community nor engaged in their local community? Not my experience.

And why on earth would you actively want your child to experience difficulties in their school? What, like perennially disruptive kids or a complete lack of funding meaning poor equipment, a revolving door of staff etc? You actually want that for your child?

For Labour supporters it means no-one having what other people don't have. You take the lowest common denominator on anything and anyone who has anything above that is "privileged".

All school sixth forms have academic requirements to get into the sixth form - an overall GCSE grade average plus specific grades in specific subjects for specific A level subjects

Of course they do, why do you think a 6th form would want a student to get at least a 4 in a subject before they study it at a-level?

Weirdly some posters do seem to want this for their DC, yes. School is seen as some sort of resilience factory, Hunger Games style.

I don’t understand your final sentence. All state school pupils who go to university are from selective sixth forms - really?

@Ddakji where I live the private schools have private buses and campuses. Often with gates around them. The children have nothing to do with the real city around them during the school day. So very much in their own world. Honestly they’re gorgeous campuses with amazing facilities and these children are super lucky.

But in a simple sense - yes, I do want my children to experience both good and bad things. My daughter is in the local high school now and learning a lot of resilience. I think that’s important (I went to private high school myself and think it set me up for a massive crash later in life). But like any number of parenting decisions, it might not work for other families. And like every parent ever, you have no idea what your child will be like when they’re older and what mistakes might be clear in retrospect.

Interesting!

So according to your theory children who have three meals or who come from a home with a washing machine a day are privileged?

That poster seems to be describing "selective" as having any minimumentrance requirements even if that requirement is 4s in English and Maths

Have you ever thought that many independent schools ARENT like that though? Ours has no fences

For Labour supporters it means no-one having what other people don't have.

That explains it, you are angry about VAT!

Like I said I am not actually against private education and haven't ruled it out. However I don't think it's the same as tutoring or swimming lessons & I don't think adding VAT is a crime. I do feel for those who have no choice but to disrupt their dc because they can no longer afford the fees though, particularly for SEN dc.

According to some on MN yes they would call those DC privileged. It's a common insult on MN.

I'm cross about my DC being blamed for the shit show that's state education system just because she goes to a different type of school precisely because the state system near us is a shit show, yes!

Exactly. Embarrassing for them really. Too busy looking at the speck in other peoples eyes to notice the plank of wood in their own. Twas ever thus with champagne socialists.

I'm cross about my DC being blamed for the shit show that's state education system just because she goes to a different type of school precisely because the state system near us is a shit show, yes!

But there has been so many threads about VAT, does this one have to get derailed by it?

And what about the majority of DC in independent schools who also use state schools?
Most parents mix and match independent with state ie state primary + 6th form. So how would you categorise those DC?

Where did I mention VAT? You're the one who brought it up

I was talking about the utter hypocrisy prior to you popping and shouting "VAT".

This is interesting - why do you think that it's Private Schools that are controlling the budget purse strings rather than men not voting for parties that prioritise kids and education? IMO it's more about the will of the public and what they want to spend on and I don't understand how Private Schools would be able to influence this? People who go to them pay so much they clearly DO value education, more than others would could afford to and chose not to, for example.

Tutoring has gamed the grammar system completely, cutting swathes of poorer income families off from that level of education, which should be open to all as it is meant to be free.

I think that virtually anyone could afford some sort of tutoring for their child if they value education and go without other things. In my experience, even families on the comparative breadline tend to spend quite a lot of money on electronics, Christmas presents, alcohol, smoking/vaping or drugs, and holidays. These people do not tend to value education. This is my opinion/experience and of course won’t apply to everyone, but where I live and what I have seen this is certainly the case for people who claim benefits/live in social housing.

i personally wouldn’t choose private education for my children, as I believe if they want to be successful they should put the work in to succeed, and it should come from natural talent rather than being purchased. This is very much my own lived experience - I work in a high level, well paid role often surrounded by privately educated people, and while I have had to work harder at some things to get there (eg interpersonal skills, networking etc), many people who have had a private education find it far more difficult to pass professional exams or succeed in a technically demanding role once that paid for support is taken away.

Where did I mention VAT? You're the one who brought it up

But you are disproportionately bitter about it which is coming across in your posts.

I never brought up VAT, that was you

I was talking about the utter hypocrisy prior to you popping and shouting "VAT".

It isn't hypocrisy to pay for swimming lessons & tutoring but disagree with private schools.

I never thought of it like that. I'm anti private school but we did pay for some tutoring around GCSEs. To me that was not that different from paying for them to go to Guides, drama club or swimming lessons. Most parents pay for some extras for their child, why not help when they're struggling with, for example, maths?

Through work I know plenty of poor families or families where parents speak English as a second language who pay others to tutor their child.

Its not a massive privilege to have a set of paid for lessons. In the case of one of our children, they still didn't pass their Maths GCSE even on the second attempt.