How to deal with the flag flying

[Slightyamusedandsilly]

https://www.facebook.com/share/v/176g9ybzKD/

This bloke has got it right! I'm going to order a bunch of other flags and put them on the local lamp posts that the neighbourhood racists are monopolising!

You don't have to hide it. You should just be aware that you are choosing a symbol that has been used by racists since at least the 1970s in a movement started by Nigel Farage who has behaved and spoken in a racist way throughout his life, so others might think you are racist. If you don't care that others think you are racist that's up to you of course but I wouldn't ask anyone who isn't white round for tea.

Why do you assume my teenager is a son? And I don't impose my authority on my children particularly. I say things like 'did you know that doing X communicates Y?' and let them make up their own mind. They are not racist and don't want to be seen as such so they don't fly the St George's cross.

If you do the research you'll see that the SGC was not recognised as the English flag much until the 1970s when the National Front co-opted it. So it does not just symbolise England. It symbolises white supremacist thugs.

yes I know I’m not part of it but how many people have gone past my house and assumed I’m racist. Assumption is the mother of all fu**ups.

I’ll be sure to tell my Turkish Muslim friend of 10 years she no longer welcome at my house

I thought we were secluded from this where I live, until I walked down my village high street on Monday and saw alternating St George’s crosses and Union flags on every lamppost. I was honestly almost in tears. The sheer aggression and deliberate intimidation of it, as well as the idea that someone in the tiny community where I live wants to align themselves and by extension the rest of us with such a vile expression of hatred posing as pride made me feel absolutely sickened.

you do the research you'll see that the SGC was not recognised as the English flag much until the 1970s

Well, apart from James the VI and I incorporating the St George's Cross into the Union flag as a symbol of England in 1606.... Because it had already had been used to represent the Kings of England for several hundred years at that point...

We need those numbers coming in. Yes we need it TO survive.

And our culture is wonderful. We are one of the most tolerant, welcoming nations in the world and we should be proud of it.

I wonder why you are so hyper sensitive? Why not just ignore it till it goes away? Surely it’s bad for your health to be so on a knife edge?

We really do need to tolerate opposing views. The UK flag flying is something you are going to have to get used to. Nobody is going to politely drop it because it might upset you. We need to be tolerant of views of others.

Thank you for your concern for my health. I’m ’hyper-sensitive’ because I love both my country and my local community and am beyond horrified at the embrace of fascist rhetoric by either of them. Walking down the street with my children surrounded by a display of racist aggression was deeply disturbing, and I think it would be incredibly concerning if I were able or inclined to brush that aside as a difference of opinion.

I’m not eloquent enough to clearly explain my thoughts on these matters without giving a confusing viewpoint or one that people won’t understand. But I absolutely agree with what you’ve said @Poppingby

Right so pre-1606 other kings would recognise it on the battle field but probably not ordinary people however patriotic they were. Post 1606 the Union Flag represented the nation and it still does doesn't it. The English part of it was hijacked by racist skinheads in the 70s. You might not like that but that is why people think it is a racist symbol and flying it is seen as a racist act.

Fascist rhetoric is a histrionic reading of a show of love for Britain. You are believing histrionic responses, such is social media.

A show of love for Britain instigated by Tommy Robinson? I’ll pass, thanks.

OK, you've jumped the shark. People wouldnt recognise it?! You must know you're talking nonsense.

You are choosing to be negative. You want a drama, you want to be in tears in the street, you prefer not to see the situation in a more neutral light. It’s so trendy to be a victim, trendy to feel threatened. Please be aware that you are choosing to be hyper reactive to flags.

Wow. I absolutely don’t want to be, or see myself as a victim, and I’d love to be able to summon up the wilful naivety to see the flag fad as something benign, or even neutral. Sadly, it’s anything but.

You don’t want to ‘ deal with the flags’ by accepting that there are people different from you who are fine about flags.
You want to believe everyone who isn’t in tears about flags is a fascist.

As a Jewish person who is integrated into the UK and whose family has contributed to the economy for generations, I personally feel much safer around British or English flags than Palestinian flags.

I have not personally seen "hordes of angry aggressive English people putting flags up", unless it is at a march for Palestine.

From what I see, only a small number of the most extreme far right wing have an issue with people who are of another background.

The majority - from centre through to right wing - will accept anyone of any colour or origin who is prepared to come to the UK legally, integrate into the UK and contribute, accept British law and stand under the UK flag.

I have far more of an issue with people who claim that the British or English flag are racist. Just because a few far right mis-used the England flag doesn't mean everyone should be tarred with the same brush.

Patriotism is uniting, nationalism is divisive. The majority of people flying flags are patriotic. The people calling everyone a racist or fascist for doing so, are being divisive.

(I understand for some in NI flags do have a very different connotation)

@Letstheriveranswer ‘Operation Raise the Colours’ is a far right group that set up this campaign. They are responsible for the flags going up around the UK. They are also at the heart of coordinating protests outside migrant hotels. It is not a small number of people.

I genuinely don’t understand why people are being so obtuse about this, and pretending that they’re suddenly putting up flags purely because they’re proud of the UK and have no ill-feelings towards immigrants. Why now, when it will obviously appear that they’re deliberately aligning themselves with the racists?

Because I can say hand on heart I am not a racist, and never have been. And whilst I don't have any flags up myself, I object to the fact that anyone who flies an England flag (unless for sports events) is labelled a racist and has been for the past 15 years - irrespective of the current campaign.

And I firmly believe that the large numbers of ordinary people who have joined in with this flag raising (ordinary people who are patriotic but not racists) have also had enough of this, and of being labelled fascists when they raise concerns about the direction of the country and dare to suggest that maybe the open borders that the far left, SWP etc are pushing for, might be a bad idea and a destabilising influence on the UK (which frankly already has enough social problems due to government mismanagement over many years).

Some very far right may have started the operation but I don't think most ordinary people joining in are far right, despite being called such by the left wing on Mumsnet and social media.

You don't think it's worrying that people are getting swept up into a right wing campaign they don't really agree with? In 1930s Germany people encouraged their children to join Nazi youth groups because the parades were fun and they liked the camping and the songs and the flags. That went well.

Hysteria. Social media over reaction. Don’t feed it. Do you want people in tears because you’ve convinced them of a narrative you are pushing? Why? What are you getting out of it exactly?

I'm not in tears I'm concerned because, to coin a phrase, I want my country back.

You believe you’ve lost it?

Not yet. I've been away this week and most places don't seem to be playing Yaxley-Lennon's game. I'm concerned by the people joining in because they don't know what it's really about. 'I'm not racist, I just like flags' etc.