Thread 30 Starmer - Magic Roundabouts

[DuncinToffee]

Pull up a chair for some friendly chit chat about politics and beyond

Taxes optional but greatly appreciated.

Previous thread
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5395939-thread-29-starmer-paint-your-bandwagon?page=1

I read this this morning; I thought it was standard Rawnsley. Good writing but hells teeth makes the PM look rudderless. I too do not understand that appointment of Wormwald if you want a radical change.

Please be careful what you post everyone. We don't want the thread pulled.

This.

Yes, that’s a well written article undercutting Starmer! Wormwald was surely intended to steady the ship - not a bad thing considering the previous incumbent.

Because you're doing to another poster what you did to me and it just smacks of playground bullying and I can't not say something.

I will leave you to it now.

I read loads of threads on mumsnet that I don't comment on, don't you? It would be more strange if I felt that I had to leave a comment on every thread I opened. 🤷‍♀️

There’s a bit in the Louis Theroux documentary which is a little bit revealing about the politicial techniques of social media bitchplopping.

Theroux asks a settler leader what she thinks about something. By now the undercurrent is dislike on both sides. The tone is escalating. And she reaches out and pushes him with her hand. And looks delighted with herself and then disappointed when Theroux doesn’t react in kind.

After a while, you have to realise that people are not talking to you in good faith. They seek your emotional engagement to feed off it.

Someone who wants a fight will escalate things quickly. It is true in real life and SM. Ask yourself if it’s worth it. George Bernard Shaw said never wrestle with a pig, you both get dirty and the pig likes it.

I lurk on LOADS of threads - but only ones where I’m interested and value the contributors thoughts.

Agree with that.

I'll tell you what actually happens sweetie. Tory and Reform get criticised for the obvious racism and stoking of violence. Plus Reform led councils are a goldmine for those with any ounce of sense and critical thinking because the first 100 days have been a failure. Hope that helps.

Looks like I hit a Rumpelstiltskin moment 😀It;s nice to be proved right.

I disappeared down a rabbit hole last night, and remembered that the machine of government is huge and complex and this is not an accident. It means that it's incredibly hard to find all the hundreds of strings you need to pull to get it to go where you want.

This inevitably means there are loads of activities quietly ticking away in the background that even ministers - even the PM - may not be aware of. Until they produce something that is worthy of attention.

I read this back in the 80s when rioting was a national pastime. At the time it sort of convinced me of a deep state etc etc.

But I do wonder how many people in the civil service are quietly working on a job of monitoring and reporting and waiting for some threshold to be reached when they pop up and say "You didn't know we were here, but we've been <whatever> and told that if <x> happened then we should present you with <y>".

It would have been what should have been in place for covid.

I'm not a flouncy person.

I agree that Keir Starmer has forensic skills. His legal background also means he’s adept at weighing things up and producing a clear view about issues and situations. But he needs to employ this with a clear communications strategy - and as The Rest is Politics podcast said only too well, a communications strategy has to have a clear message to communicate.

Labour have to deal with Reform. They can’t afford to ignore them. All going away for the summer break and leaving Farage in charge of the microphone was a massive, massive strategic mistake.

@BIWI, I’m so sorry, I missed the part about your brother. My condolences, that is no age.

Thank you @BestIsWest and @ilovesooty.

Totally agree

Just back from a run - absolutely gorgeous outside, with a slight breeze. It’s a topic I am happy to discuss, if the thread meanders that way. (Ahem, I won’t ask why a PP had a post removed…)

Another PP asked me not to quote exclusively from the DT. I do actually quote from other sources, including the BBC, FT, Bloomberg and Reuters etc.

I confess to preferring the less-biased, more economically-focused media. When all is said and done, it’s ultimately about money, after all - IMHO.

TBH there’s no such think as unbiased media!

Are you a runner, @MyNameIsX? I have tried very hard in the past (done C25K 3 times) but simply can’t get on with it. Obviously I managed running the distance (and once actually even managed to get my time under 30 minutes), but I really don’t enjoy it.

They all have some bias. The FT for example will be biased in favour of the financial services industry. Even in banking we recognised that. Reading a range of biases, including those you disagree with, is the way to challenge your own thinking. But some papers get really frustrating by misrepresenting easily checked facts (remembering all the war on Christmas arguments I had with my DM reading parents). Makes it hard to take them seriously sometimes.

No issue with providing proper links

The selective c&p with embedded links is the issue

What's with the "sweetie".You just can't help yourself can you. Grow up.

My career has largely been spent trying get people to agree things where at the outset they do not. I suppose that accounts for my attitude to politics.

It is absolutely standard tactics by someone who doesn’t want agree or discuss or consider any of the other side’s views to start with an incendiary attitude or say something provocative. To the point where I might set my watch by it.

You must never bite. By the end of the day you may be looking to agree a practical way to move on. This kind of pragmatism is something that’s declined in the UK which is sad to see; it means you get stuck on headlines and living on outrage.

The media obviously make money from this which I understand. Actual people doing the same, or promoting something calculated to inflame is different. You can judge that conduct.

The reason this thread works is that the sharing of personal information does actually make it harder to be hostile. If you only bring your politics, then yes, you are showing only a very small part of yourself.

According to Sky News, Freeview 233, Norway selects British made ships for its navy.

Excellent news!

I agree too. I'm choosing to be selective in terms of who I talk to. I've found it beneficial simply to ignore the posts of people whose contributions I don't find constructive.

We have long naval links with Norway so I’m glad to hear of it. And also, presumably some good news for economy in it.

Yes, that's positive news.