To be fed up of mums groups or is it just Londoners ?

[AleaEim]

Today I went to a mum and baby Pilates group, I’ve been a few times over the past few months so I’m not a regular to this one. I usually chat to other mums there but most weeks it’s a lot of different faces. Today was one of those days where there was more unfamiliar faces than familiar. Before we went in, I said hey, how’ve you been to a woman who I spoke to last time. She replied half heartedly and turned away from me to talk to someone else and didn’t ask me how was I was. I figured I might have accidentally interrupted a conversion or she didn’t recognise me so brushed it off. in fairness she chatted to me briefly and asked me how I was later on in the class so no hurt feelings there. Then on the way out, I said goodbye to a couple mums standing by the door, I hadn’t been talking to them but thought I’d seem rude not to say goodbye since they were at the door, they all looked up and not one uttered a smile or a goodbye. As I was opening the door, I noticed another mum was about to follow behind me, she had a pram, I had a sling so it was easy for me to hold the door for her, as I did this, she didn’t utter a word to me, I looked around to see if she had even smiled but no, nothing, she looked a bit awkward, avoided eye contact.

I’m new to the area and really hoped that going to lots of groups I would at least meet one or two mums who I could chat with, sometimes I do, it’s not all bad but most of the time they seem disinterested in going to the effort with others. I really had envisioned a sociable and colourful maternity leave as I’m quite social and that’s what my friends have experienced(albeit in Ireland where I’m from so not here).

I’m not sure what I’m expecting from this thread, just a vent really. Anyone else have this kind of experience?

We moved from south London to the countryside in Gloucestershire- the small towns in rural England are sooo much friendlier. I had this in bits of London too. I think my south london nct group were lovely and I went to some groups with them but I never made any other friends after that, did loads of baby groups, music classes, playgroups. I did a whole maternity leave with 1 child and 6 mths with my next baby. We moved for the final 6 mths of 2nd maternity leave and I made so many friends. I did get on the apps too (peanut and maybe another) so that the people I engaged with were in the market for friends, but also made friends at pre school, nursery, the street, the supermarket - everyone is just so friendly and chatty, maybe because they know youll see them again. Also in London lots of mums worked ft or had only 1 day off, so just didn't have time for meet ups, generally here my friends do a max of 3 days work so have way more diary space. I still say hi to people from playgroups and baby groups now and my kids are nearly 10.
I'd say try the apps or groups designed for friendship, as I think a lot of people are juggling existing work, existing friends, a busy lifestyle etc in London, so they may just not have space- if you target people wanting some social action, they might be more amenable. Or move to a rural village where they're all over you from the get-go!

It might be the type of group. I find that at the full paid activity type groups people are there to focus on their child or a group that they organise to come with or, to have some time for themselves. Maybe try the church and community mum/dad groups that are £2 or a donation as those are usually more chatty and about mingling/children and babies mingling.

I also think when meeting other mums it’s useful to remember that sometimes being a new mum is exhausting/disappointing/generally rubbish during various phases and that it’s possible the person to want an interaction with has been up all night or rushing between poonamies and tantrums and it’s ok not to feel sociable some days.

Try not to let it bother you. I’ve don’t two years of a parent and child dance class and can count on my had how many meaningful interactions I’ve had with the parents there but, after the initial awkward setting in period, I didn’t let it bother me because I was mainly doing it for the benefit of my DD and my own health.

I found the children's/ sure start centres were the best where they had a leader that directed more purposefully.

Going to an activity that is more interesting/ involved is better because at least the activity is more engaging if there isn't any social opportunities.

The worst ones I found were things like the free-for-all toddler group. People tended to turn up in packs or with their own mummy still attached.

It's not a London thing, it's just random luck.

Were all.women British? There are certain cultures that don't have small talk culture or there is less emphasisnon saying please/thank you thank in the UK (I'm from a country like that, good luck with getting a reply to 'good morning' from a cashier in store here :d).

Not in my experience, I moved to a a midlands village when my baby was a few months old, and the baby group in my village and the adjacent one were considerably less friendly than my London experiences. I think it was less conscious hostility than it was just everyone had pretty much known one another since school, so the idea of introducing yourself to strangers, or thinking strangers might be nice to know, didn’t really occur to people. Plus I was pretty atypical for the area.

Just try a new group, OP.

I live up north and had more positive experiences of baby classes.
Maybe try some different classes
I hope you have a better time x

You seem to be keen to jump to negative comclusions about people's actions and motives, OP. Particularly mums who may not be quite at their social best through tiredness, shyness, lack of familiarity etc. Perhaps you came across as someone who might write about and analyse every interaction online with strangers? I'd try to be a little more positive and less judgemental and perhaps people may then receive you more warmly.

@Ddakji did you really just characterise the whole of the UK apart from London as “the sticks”? 🤣. This is the problem. Stuck up much?

Fellow Irelander here and had the same experience in London and some posher parts of Greater London. Held a door open for a woman and she looked like I was going to eat her. I would say hiya if I make eye contact with people walking past and nope no one replied any time I did it. Not the friendliest bunch. The older generation were much more friendly and would say hello.

I hear you, OP. I had experiences like that too.
I always tried to remind myself that women at those groups who were unfriendly might have been exhausted/experiencing PPD and that was why they didn't want to interact.
However... There is also a demographic of professional, middle class women in London who I found to be very exclusionary and cliquey at baby and child groups. If your face doesn't fit then good luck infiltrating the group. I think there are people who take a very "strategic" approach to friendship and if you don't look like someone who is a) cut from the same cloth as them or be b) isn't going to be obviously useful in some way to them or their child, then they don't waste energy on you.
I once got totally frozen out by a group of cliquey mums on a "walk and talk" event for new mums that I had signed up for a local park in that is in "up and coming area " near where I live that is known for it's "lovely community atmosphere" (my bum...) It was organised by a local group that was all about promoting friendship and mental health too.... It's quite funny to think about now but it really stung at the time and I had to go home and have a good cry.
My mentality has aLways been that London is a big place with lots of different people, and if one baby group isn't a good fit then move on and find something else. There is lots to choose from. I've met a handful of terrific mum friends and they are all I need for now, everyone doesn't have to be my mate
Good luck, I really do feel your frustration.

I think this is because it’s so busy. I just travelled home on the tube with my face pressed into some bloke’s armpit because it was such a crush. Imagine how much worse it would have been if he’d tried to make conversation 😂

Anthropologists talk about positive politeness cultures and negative politeness cultures. Positive politeness means it’s polite to strike up conversation and is more common where people have lots of space. Negative politeness means it’s polite to respect other people’s peace and not bother them unless you have to, and is more common where people have insufficient space. Think of mid westerners v New Yorkers, for example. Londoners are mainly the latter. It’s not that we’re not friendly or that we are stuck up (or no more than anyone else). It’s a different cultural norm 🤷‍♀️ (FWIW I don’t think it applies in the context of baby Pilates, but in general.)

Oh sigh another 'Londoners are all unfriendly while everyone else is lovely ' thread.

If only it were true that rural areas, cute little towns and villages etc were all such friendly communities. I drew a map of the areas where reform are popular and where far rights riots have occurred, just to remind me how friendly the communities are.

Londoners aren't all stuck up minted snobs. In the same way that not all rural/northern people are racist ignorant yobs. Both stereotypes are offensive.

Thanks for proving the point that I made when I did that 🤣.

It’s not nice, is it? But that’s exactly what the “stuck up” crowd are doing.

London is a great place to live with kids.

I dont usually comment but I just want to say please dont let this put you off. I think London can be like this but not everywhere. Some people come across rude because they are nervous themselves, some are just rude, some already have friends so no intention of being polite. But you sound outgoing so I would say keep trying the classes and I am sure you'll find your tribe!

I live in London..
I saw my antenatal group a lot during mat leave.
It’s harder to make friends with people in classes, but if you go regularly you will likely find natural connections.

I definitely found playgroups more chatty than activities like pilates/yoga/sensory. It’s easier to talk as there’s no activity to focus on.
I also found there was a bit of a price to friendliness ratio - the cheaper it is, the friendlier it will be! Try church or village hall type playgroups in your area. These will be the kids/parents you might see later at nursery, primary school etc.

Stuck up people are always going to be stuck up - not saying thank you or goodbye is just bizarre c word behaviour.

I'd just try a different group. I brought up my DC in London (I have lived here all my life bar university) and some groups were nice, some not so nice. Plus, honestly, all my real friends are not people I met at baby groups. So maybe try some kind of meet up that's not focused on babies where you might meet people you actually have something in common with? Sport, choir, reading group, etc, maybe?

FYI for those commenting - I don't think this is real. There's a real push at the moment of London bashing, I'm noticing it on MN and other forums, as well as daily mail etc. noone who lives in London, (even if they'd just moved here) would ever ever say 'the next town over' about different areas of London. It's just not the way different areas are described at all, I've never in my entire life living here speaking to Londoners, tourists, new Londoners, ever heard different areas of the city referred to as 'towns'.

Also in the OP she said she's new to the area so wanted to meet local people, but then said she doesn't actually live there but 'the next town over'. So why would you be trying to meet people in an area you don't live in? The clue to this being fake is the fact that the anti - London sentiment is in the thread title too.

You don’t have to say anything outing, OP, but is this the independent pilates studio in Parsons Green run by an Australian woman? I used to live near there and go to (non-baby) classes - it doesn’t surprise me that some of the clientele aren’t the warmest.

I’ve definitely experienced some baby groups like this OP. Second time round, I feel invisible as I think a lot of new mums just want to hang out with other new mums.

It can be tough finding “your people” 😂 (to quote Amanda on Motherland!) if you want something a bit deeper than the fact you both had kids the same time. Try different groups and in different areas too or you’ll just see the same crowd.

Have you tried Peanut?

It’s really hard to find free stuff in my borough, even children’s centres charge you but I agree, the free ones are better for socialising, I don’t know why.

Yes I did.

Same as where I’m from, you’d never
avoid eye contact and you’d always strike conversation if standing/ sitting
beside someone.

@AleaEim every borough will have a LA run children's centre which run baby groups which are free. Most boroughs have multiple (mine has 5), all with full weekly timetables. I'm sure if you were really from London you would know this! I'm also sure in other areas of the UK this isn't the case, but I know for a fact it is the case in every LA in London.

OP, some parts of London are really transient and it can be hard to connect with people in these areas. It wasn’t until I moved to zone 6 that I found it easier. I would look to move or find somewhere that has more of a community feel.