Who is going to be the next Pope

[Viviennemary]

The Conclave starts today. I'm quite interested to see who will be the successor to Francis.

Seems Cardinal Parolin is the favourite. He's Italian. I hope its not him. Very conventional knows the ropes. Bit of a boring choice.

Cardinal Tagle from the Philippines. Now that would be a lot more interesting. There is a huge Catholic population there. He's second favourite.

Then Cardinal Turkson from Ghana I think. Now that will be really interesting. I think a good thing.

Then Cardinal Zuppi another Italian. Again boring. We need somebody to make a mark but maybe not too big a one.

Anyone got an opinion on this.

I meant I’m not sure he meant it as a snide quip that “ god will definitely judge you negatively.” That’s how your post came across to me in the context of the way the thread had evolved.

My point is I think he has gone some way to soften the stance from what it would on e have been.

What policies / views would ‘alienate’ the catholics in Africa?

Oh ok I didn't mean that. I meant God will be your, and my, judge.

It wasn't much of a softening though, as the church still won't accept gay marriage, bless gay unions and views homosexuality as sinful.
He just wouldn't say so.

I agree with him that God is the ultimate judge of us all and as I said earlier we're all bad Christians in our own way gay or otherwise.

But I am not the Pope. And unlikely to be 😁

If a Pope changed doctrine to accept gay marriage, support transgender ideology, women priests or condone divorce.
They'd be a schism in the church.

So I don't think anyone would do it regardless of how 'liberal' the media portrays them.

But there’s a difference between not advocating gay marriage in church and stating that gay people are intrinsically evil

Often wondered why the church doesn't flog off all the art and give the money to the poor. So I googled the wealth of the Vatican. $5 billion. If you add in the rest of the church - $10 to $15 billion. A lot of moola no doubt. But Jeff Bezos wouldn't get out of bed for $15bn. And Elon Musk has lost more down the back of a sofa. And he only has his cock to keep. Whereas the church is feeding 1.7m poor children in Italy alone. I'm sure they could make a lot of savings but its a bit like privatisation : a trick you can only do once. Unless Professor Google and the bankers are wrong...

He's been mentioned a few times on Sky news this morning. Looks like he is moving forwards.

Amazing name!

I’m praying for a welcoming liberal pope the conservatives in the USA are ruining the world. Jesus welcomed everyone.

For any change to have lasting impact in a religion that spans the world and very wide ranging viewpoints, you need to take everyone along with you. That isn’t possible in the relatively short time any individual is pope (compared to 2,000 years to get to the current point). The only way lasting change will happen is if there is a succession of popes who each move slightly in the same direction with each building on the small amounts of progress of their predecessor. Any significant changes will cause push back and the next pope will swing massively the other way

The church doesn't think gay people are intrinsically evil it thinks homosexuality acts are sinful.

And Francis didn't change that.

He just muddied the water by saying/implying something true: God will judge us all whatever our sins, but not saying what the church teaching doctrine is and remained under him.

Look you can view this statement as wonderfully liberal if you like but in reality church teaching on homosexuality didn't change under Francis.

Whenever I take out my old rosary that I got for my confirmation I remember sitting in a circle at my grandmothers house as we all went round saying it out loud. I'd always be dreading them getting to me for one of the 'Mysteries' bits, because I'd always forget which one I was on, or the end bit where the prayer used to change. These communal things are so much about ritual, community and belonging to the point where I think whether God exists or not is not even the most important thing. I think is sad that its been thrown away (by me too!) I think that's why it is important that the Pope doesn't just chuck everything out just because people want it to be modernised.

The Conservatives in the USA are largely Protestant (probably Puritan throwbacks) They wont care what the Pope says.

If you don't like the US conservatives wait till you meet the Africans!

Western progressive values (as they have become] are a minority view in the world.

That's a problem for a church dominated and based in the West which presumes it should lead the rest of the world down the Western 'progressive' road.

I think we'll get a Western liberal signalling pope this time but I think they'll know what is needed to unite the church and won't change much.

So another Francis who says things that sound like they placate the Western liberals while keeping the same doctrine.

He could do something about relaxing rules on the use of condoms-it would make such a huge impact on the spread of HIV/AIDS….

I remember physically sitting in church and losing my faith in God. I think it was during the height of the sex abuse scandals, and they were asking for money to send to the Vatican. I'd never really had much truck with the institution of the church but did believe in God, which was fine, but losing my faith was a shock to me, I think I cried. I always hated confession too, but lately I've not only felt a pull back to it, but I feel I would like to go to Confession, even though I would say I was agnostic now. I took DS's to church on Easter Saturday and they enjoyed the show of it. I wanted them to see it because its part of my culture and was part of my childhood. They enjoyed the whole bonfire/ candle thing, and did enjoy just sitting in church ( and giggling a bit when people were getting baptised in white bomber jackets!)

I agree with this. I hardly see any Catholic families with huge numbers of kids anymore, so clearly no one is taking any notice, yet it would make a huge difference in places like Africa.

Francis and Benedict already did that.

But it's always an odd presumption that everyone will do what the Pope says about condoms but ignore the Pope on other aspects of sexual morality.

If people listened to the Pope HIV wouldn't be spread.

"People don't listen to you, you have to tell them what to do" is weird logic.

You could have a word with your local priest about having confession. If you don't like him you can go to another parish. Priests are only human so you may find one having a bad day or is just a cranky fella. Anyway, any priest worth his salt will offer you confession, doesn't matter if you don't attend, doesn't matter if you have doubts, and it doesn't have to be in the box, etc.

There’s a church near where my mother lives where confession is available almost all day. It’s a touristy spot, lovely insightful conversations great confessional practice.

I used to hate confession, hate it! But it grew on me 😂 It's good to do a regular examination of conscience every so often and then off load it.

Yes I think it’s odd logic that the Pope is supposed to fix all social issues.

His role is a religious one.

How long do we predict it will take for a choice to be made. I’m guessing it will the 5th ballot. Maybe tomorrow morning.

I think it will be tomorrow too.

I wouldn’t worry too much about pope dividing Church. We have had some pretty bad examples - multiple popes, popes fathering children, popes living luxurious lifestyles. Yet here we are - watching that chimney 😁

Also: Napoleon Bonaparte once taunted a Catholic cardinal by threatening: “Your Eminence, are you not aware that I have the power to destroy the Catholic Church?” To which the cardinal quipped: “Your Majesty, we Catholic clergy have done our best to destroy the Church for the last eighteen hundred years. We have not succeeded, and neither will you.