What happens to the families of those who have committed heinious crimes?

[FaeFae]

Given recent heinious crimes and sentencing, set me thinking. How do about their parents, siblings and grandparents continue their lives?

What happens to them?

Maybe some of the actions and decisions of the families rests on how public the crime is. Some of the recent crimes have left the family surname very recogniseable and the killers photo’s familiar. I can't imagine that Rudakubana’s family have continued to live locally.

I would include Constance Marten, Savannah Brockhill and Frankie Smith & Emma Tustin and Thomas Hughes in the same way.

AFAIK the parents of the boys who killed James Bulger haven't had to change their identities beyond the original change the legal system gave them.

Robert Thompson was at the time assumed to be the ringleader of James Bulger's murder because he came across as more hard-faced and dishonest when interviewed. Interestingly, he's the one who hasn't reoffended since release. His childhood was objectively appalling: his dad was a domestic abuser who fucked off. His mum was a negligent alcoholic. He was one of 7 brothers in a family where it was completely normalised for an older brother to be violently abusive to a younger one. He really had a blueprint for violent bullying and not being cared for stamped onto him. His mum initially sat in on his police interviews but then refused to because she was too upset. She attended his trial at least on one occasion. She made a comment to a reporter that 'at least James's mum has a grave to mourn him at' which is about the most unsympathetic and self-pitying thing you can say in those circumstances. I'd be surprised if she's still alive tbh. She seemed self-destructive going back to the 80s. Robert Thompson Senior made no effort to support or help any of his kids before or after the murder.

Jon Venables had a (superficially at least) more stable childhood: two parents who cared and co-parented. His mum sat in on his interviews and encouraged him to confess by assuring him they'd still love him whatever he'd done. Interestingly, he's the one who has been revealed to be a paedophile and has been in jail again for years; it's now believed he may have been the instigator for the worst of what happened to James. I wonder if he was born bad or if there was hidden abuse in his family.

I think neither boy would have done something so atrocious without each other, and might well not have done anything half so grave on a different day. There was a horribly improvised, spur of the moment quality to what they did.

I don't know how any of the boys' families feel but, based on how the parents acted at the time, it's fair to say that JV's may have had more introspection about it than RT's.

Thank you for sharing, you did not have to do that.

One of my huge foibles is worrying about ‘what others think of me’ and nothing as serious as this.
Notoriety would be awful, but you must be carrying on within the same area if your DC’s have continued at the same school.

It must be difficult to convince others that you were not aware of what was going on.

There are some families where gentics have been found to play a role.

Read an article of some Dutch family - they found a gene mutation

https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg14018970-600-does-the-aggressive-gene-lurk-in-a-dutch-family/

https://longreads.com/2015/03/10/looking-at-five-generations-of-a-single-dutch-family-to-understand-the-genetics-of-violence/

There was also a horizon program where one of the researchers realised his brain was that of a pychopath - and many in his wider family had commited viloient crimes.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/teach/articles/z79f2sg

Professor James Fallon, who studies the biological basis of violence, discovered that his own brain scan showed similarities to those of violent psychopaths. He also realised he had genetic risk factors that could pre-dispose him towards violent behaviour.
But as he explains in the clip to the right, his supportive upbringing acts as a protective influence, preventing him from engaging in the kind of anti-social behaviour typical of psychopaths, to which he might otherwise succumb.

I met the son of a very famous murderer once through friends at uni. He was adamant that his dad hadn't done it. He didn't keep quiet about who his Dad was particularly. He just wholeheartedly had convinced himself he was innocent and that what he would say when people asked him about it.I felt quite sorry for him really as clearly the alternative (believing the nailed on evidence of his dads guilt) was too much for him to bare mentally,once people knew who he was he became a bit ostracised. He was otherwise a nice boy really.

I knew someone whose son is a child abuser, the lies and the unravelling of the vast amount of his crime rocked their world. The mum has stood by him citing that as her direct (blood) family hadn't been abused she could therefore justify keeping contact her line was if he had abused his younger siblings she would have cut him off. His younger siblings weren't young enough and his sentence was in my opinion too short but for her too long.

It's caused a huge rift in the family as they cannot understand why she continues to stand by him. It's been really difficult for all of them, except him who shows no remorse and continues to lie.

I throughly enjoyed the push.

Someone in my school year is a convicted paedo and currently serving 14-15 years sentence. He had sex with underage children, stored images on computer etc.

His parents and brother changed names by deed poll and moved away from the area.

On the other extreme, a man in the next street, broke into an elderly lady's home in the middle of the night, raped her, causing many injuries and stole expensive items. He's in jail for 11 years. His mum walked around the town bragging of how proud she is of her son. How the fuck can you be proud of your son when this lady was injured and had to go to a care home as unable to do anything for herself due to injuries and mental scarring? She moved away a couple of years after this.

Lucy Letby's parents won't just doubt the guilty verdict they will know their daughter is innocent.

Even as a member of the public it is clear when you look into it that the evidence against her is very weak.

My friend's husband did something awful to a child and served a long jail sentence.

My friend did not have a clue. He turned out to be someone completely different to the person she thought he was.

Everyone assumed that she must have known. It was awful for her to try and protect her own kids and keep them away from the media.

Her in-laws really struggled. Initially they couldn't believe that he had done it. Then they couldn't understand why he couldn't have contact with his kids etc.
My friend continued to have carefully supervised contact with her ex in-laws, so that her kids knew their grandparents. I think to be honest she was relieved when they died.

But her kids have been seriously effected, and they all have long term mental health issues. It is heartbreaking really.

I also know a family where a beloved grandad, who appeared to be lovely, kind, good parent, loved by all, abused one of his granddaughters. It came out years later when she was an adult.

The adult son and DIL are devastated. They are dealing with both the abuse of their child, but also trying to understand that this man, who they all liked, has done this.
They have lost their parents overnight, but they are not dead.

The repercussions are still slowly moving out, as others become aware that they grandparents have moved away, and questions remain unanswered (police case still ongoing)

It has been so hard for them to reconcile the person they knew with the act he has done.

It would be interesting to see how the other children in both families have turned out, and if they had any interventions.

This is part of why people often jump to blaming the victim. They cannot accept that a seemingly nice man would do something like that, generally speaking a man has much more weight in society and we often feel unconscious need to preserve the image and reputation of the patriarch of the family. It's much easier to blame it on a subordinate who is less able to defend themselves than the head of the family who might be able to turn others in the family against you.
As pointed out by others these matters are extremely complex.

Lucy Letby's parents won't just doubt the guilty verdict they will know their daughter is innocent.

In such a complicated case, they can't ‘know’ their daughter is innocent.

In a case like this one, where the victims can't be witness to the crime, only the perpetrator really knows if they are innocent.

I took that comment to mean that as her parents they would be totally unable to comprehend the fact their daughter may have done the terrible things that she's accused of. That then makes them double down on the mindset that she is innocent and they know it. If that makes sense.

I absolutely would.

My ex's great grandfather (his mums grandfather) murdered 2 sex workers,put them in a barrel and pushed them into the towns River

The whole family knew about it and closed ranks

He was never arrested nor charged for his crimes,it's still 2 unsolved murders

Ex's granny knew what her father had done and so did her mother (and in turn,his mother,him and then me-i heard them talking)

No doubt if he had been caught,they would have stood by him,supported him and claimed he was innocent

He was a nasty man by all accounts,but I couldn't have stayed married to him if I had been his wife-id have been too frightened I would be next (saying that,it was a different time and it wouldn't have been easy to leave in those days)

Apparently granny refused to believe he was guilty even though he bragged about it and thought it was funny/the 'dirty bitches' deserved it

@AnEagerSleeper thank you. I'm so sorry you experienced this terrible situation.
I hope you are seeking therapy if you need to? My heart goes out to you. X

And the truth is that even in some cases of so called miscarriages of justice the perpetrator is still guilty,, it just happens that there is a flaw in the evidence that leads to their release.

It’s complicated, because someone’s guilt or innocence can only depend on the case at the time.

In the same way as sometimes innocent people are convicted, so guilty people are acquitted. And sometimes the legal system turns in favour of the guilty when they’re acquitted after a period in jail.

IMO Lucy Letby is guilty. Even if the convictions were overturned on the basis of the way evidence was presented, that doesn’t necessarily make her innocent, it just means that her legal team have been able to argue that the evidence wasn’t correctly presented. She still murdered those babies IMO.

But by the same token criminals such as. O J Simpson literally got away with murder on the basis of a flawed piece of evidence.

Its terrible for families who have tried their best to support their child/sibling who needed professional support and for those with truly loving supportive families. People will make judgements and their lives are turned upside down, they carry a huge amount of guilt too

often people who commit very violent offences often come from dysfunctional families who will often work against professional support the cycle of violence and abuse is very hard to break

Where does it say they were adopted? I haven’t read that anywhere.

If 14 world leading neonatologists are convinced there is no evidence of foul play just very sick babies who were in many cases given the wrong medical treatment by doctors then I would expect Lucy's parents to agree with them and all the pathologists who originally determined natural causes of death in the babies.

I am sure it feels dreadful to realise your daughter is sentanced to life in jail for a crime she didn't commit and that there is very little you can do about it. I hope they live to see her released.

There is literally no evidence that any babies were murdered at all. It is a complete indictment of our legal system and system of expert witnesses that this case ever made it to court in the first place.

The evidence that has been debunked by the experts isn’t just a loophole.
It’s a very interesting read and has convinced me she needs a new trial.

It is very compelling. The people raising the alarm are medical specialists that can see the evidence made by the expert witness for the prosecution Dewi Evans doesn't hold together.

Unfortunately the jury didn't have the medical knowledge to see through it.

Anyway back to my original point. I doubt her parents, who know her well, have ever had any doubts about her innocence.