of mice and men, do you agree with taking it off the gcse course in Wales

[WillowTit]

Of Mice and Men: Classic US novel taken off GCSE course in Wales - BBC News

although i am not in Wales my dc all studied this book in gcse

I don't think there is an issue in shaking up the selection of books they have been the same for a very long time and I, personally don't think there is an issue in talking about acceptable language of the time and how that has changed.

I know Teen DD refused to continue reading To Kill a Mockingbird and Huckleberry Finn for pleasure because of the racist language included in them.

However, crucially I am white British and haven't faced racism so I'd imagine my opinion isn't worth much (and nor should it be) compared to others who experience that language used against them and find it upsetting.

There are plenty of other good books in existence. Something like Noughts and Crosses might be a good edition however they need to be fairly short as an exam text as would be out.

Well for one thing, surely the teachers will be absolutely done with it by now - I studied it (that exact cover too!) in 2006!!

Surely it depends on what they decide to put in its place?!

I think the books on the syllabus list should be regularly changed (just like it used to be)

You can still teach any specific book (ie those the school has copies of) to other year groups.

I think I might have studied it in the early 1990s.

it’s good to have a piece of literature that teaches about that period of American history (if only because some period films make more sense when you know). But there is a lot of literature that references that period—so it doesn’t need to be that one.

And I studied it in 1986. ( Different cover though)...

I happily support a change, that novel is full of misogynistic “what aboutery”, it’s shite.

Which other books are currently on the syllabus, does anyone know?

my dds tell me that the teacher would say the N word and pupils would say you cant say that, and the teacher would say, it is in the book, and carry on.
so in that case, and also the comment in the article, it does make sense to drop it
although it says it was dropped in 2014
"A major exam board in England dropped the text in 2014 when the then Education Secretary Michael Gove said more British works should be studied."#
presumably not fully dropped

I do think it is good to have a book that shows the racist language and behaviour of the time and not censor it. It shows just how wrong it was and how badly black people were treated. It's an important part of history in much the same way as the holocaust.

But the teachers must be fed up with the same two books over and over and over again.

Syllabus books should be reviewed and changed regularly. There are many more books than they will ever have the time to study.

I had to study it at GCSE and I’m in my mid thirties! Not only must teachers be bored of it, its very frustrating that a large proportion of non-white children have to listen to their teacher justifying the use of extremely racist language, then theres the girls having to listen to page upon page of sexism.

While I think gove is a wanker, I do find it odd that a lot of gcse texts aren’t British.

I'm 62 and studied that for my O levels! How many more good books must have been written since?

Maybe American books are chosen as it’s seems more easy to discuss racism, sexism, classism, justice, discrimination …. When it takes place in another country

The reason they've given for dropping it is that ME pupils were upset by the racism. I'm white, so I'm not qualified to give an opinion on that.

I remember studying this book (same cover too!) for my GCSEs in 2004. We had some good discussions about misogyny, WRT to "Curly's wife" remaining nameless throughout, only a person in conjunction with her husband, not someone in her own right.

I think the GCSE texts need shaking up anyway. Some of them are as dull as ditchwater. The English syllabus should be about getting DC excited about reading and understanding the texts, not putting them off. Imagine studying The Hobbit, or Harry Potter!

I used to teach this and because of how attitudes to racism and racist language have changed (quite rightly) it became impossible to not spend the whole lesson justifying what we were reading and why. The same with Romeo and Juliet when they find out she's 13, you spend the whole lesson engaged in a different debate (again, good for the kids that they don't think it's romantic and recognise it's abusive) but I'm expected to be teaching them oxymorons and soliloquies not PSHE.
We've replaced both books with ones with similar themes but that aren't offensive to the kids.

Perhaps there should be a new strain of English - History of English Literature. That way the books can be studied from a sociological/psychological/historical perspective. Just a thought

One of my O level books in the early 70s. I think my sister also read it in the 60s.

I’m in two minds. On the one hand it does seem bonkers that kids today are learning the books that their parents’ generation (and older) read in school - it is surprising to me that there is nothing more up to date of note to teach.

on the other hand, it rather depends how it is taught. Books of that era are shocking through modern eyes (even the Narnia series has some racist and sexist undertones). So I think if we are teaching a book from a moralistic point of view, and demonstrating how not that long ago this writing was acceptable, that’s valuable. FWIW, we didn’t do Of Mice and Men (we did Lord of the Flies), but it was on the syllabus.

I studied it for GCSE English Lit in Wales in 1995! Had no idea it was still on the syllabus. As you say, the teachers must be absolutely dying of boredom with it by now. What a non issue.

Hurrah my sons would say. All three of them had to study it for GCSE.

It's time for a shake up.

Something like Noughts and Crosses might be a good edition

@HPandthelastwish they do that one in Year 7 or 8 at the school my children went to.

In Australia a book appeared on the reading list that had really inappropriate scenes suggesting a surreal and disturbing sexual assault. Because I didn’t know the book I wasn’t able to voice my concerns over the content until my daughter brought it to my attention. I would like them to stick with classics for the simple reason that I am familiar with the content and know what to discuss with my kid before hand.

I no longer trust the schools to make these choices on my behalf to be honest, particularly as other parents complained about this book and the school agreed to remove it from next year’s reading list altogether. I used to think the schools were big on safeguarding children and not subjecting them traumatic reading material but obviously not.

It has been an important book for me nearly as important as Grapes of Wrath it describes communities suffering great hardship. I do not know of other books that convey the miserable poverty the way those do.
It is important to read the originals because they are the feelings of the author.
Are there other books that cover that period of American development?

I was always a very keen reader and always had my nose in a book at home, but Ye Gods - English Literature lessons were very nearly enough to put me off reading altogether. All that endless picking apart of every single sentence, trying to get into the mind of the author and analyse why they used a particular word instead of another word 150 years ago... how the hell should I know? It bored me rigid.