Assisted Dying Bill tomorrow.

[TooBigForMyBoots]

I really hope this goes ahead.

I'm from a family who die from cancer. It's a genetic thing. Over the years I've watched numerous loved ones die from this cruel and ravaging disease. It has taken a massive toll on us. From PTSD to immense guilt, complicated grief and fear of the future.

Not all of my family would have accessed Assisted Dying, but I know some did want it and requested it in the weeks / days leading to their death. They should have had the option of shortening their suffering. Having witnessed what they went through, I want that option for myself.

I want it for my mother. For the past 20 years she has told me when she wants out and how I will have to help her achieve it. I don't want to. She apologises for putting it on me. She shouldn't have to.

No one will be saved if this Bill is stopped, but fear and suffering will be reduced.

As did my mother and aunt. They didn’t want to go despite having cancer.
Some Saying they’ve never known of anyone who’ve wanted to stay alive is a pointless non factual comment.

One person's "fought for life" is another person's "suffered unimaginably".

The findings of this review do not support the hypothesis that introducing EAS reduces rates of non-assisted suicide. The disproportionate impact on older women indicates unmet suicide prevention needs in this population.

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9230443/

www.bmj.com/content/377/bmj.o1014/rr-7

The link above discusses a number of studies that have found that assisted suicide is accompanied by rise in unassisted suicide.

None of this is my opinion.

I know it's not, you're just chucking google at me. The actual papers are far more nuanced than the bits you're presenting.

I don’t know why your referring to 1961 I didn’t ask about that.
In terms of the current bill there’s nothing available online and I’ve looked at the House of Commons website as well.

You referred to its contents so I’m guessing you’ve got the bill somehow.

Our MP didn’t send us a copy so there’s nothing here.

Of course it's nuanced and complicated, these things always are.

A posters comment that they don’t know of anyone is not relevant. There are many that would like to die and equally many that don’t.
We don’t know the numbers as fact.

Good, so you agree that the following may not be the case ?

"Because yes that Bill means suicide will now be seen as something good to do."

You said:

Or perhaps people knowing they can go through supportive channels before they end their life will help prevent suicides.

My comment is that the evidence suggests that in fact the opposite is true. That's all.

And my comment said perhaps, like Posner's hypothesis did (this is not my opinion). As opposed to the previous comment which stated:

"Because yes that Bill means suicide will now be seen as something good to do."

Which you seem to have no issue with.

That's my point. You said people saying they've not known of anyone who've wanted to stay alive was a pointless, non-factual comment.

I personally haven't so it is not a lie, nor is it pointless. No one is saying everyone thinks the same, they are saying people should have a choice if they have capacity and are terminal.

I looked after my friends primary aged children for weeks while she (only 35) was in a hospice. I saw her children who she loved so much, more than she did at the end - she refused to let them visit her as she was skeletal and not the Mum they knew. She did not want their last memories to be of her looking like that. She wanted to die and she knew she'd never see her children again even while she was still alive, but had no choice but to lie in that hospice waiting for it to end.

So your family members are allowed to have their way and others should be allowed to make the choice for themselves.

I don't think I said that suicide will be seen as something good to do, I don't think that's the case.

I think that suicide will be seen as more socially acceptable, because in certain circumstances the state will help you to kill yourself. The studies quotes seem to suggest that may be true.

My reasons are not because of my family members of which there were in fact more. My reasons for disagreeing to this bill is the lack of detail, workability, research, consultation, affect on the disabled and mentally ill etc.

Im also mindful of the issue of coercion and statistics on DNR which put white, women over 65 ( progressively more with age ) at a higher % of being given a DNR despite illness or outcome.

I’m not just thinking about myself or my family I am looking of everyone. I would find that incredibly selfish and narrow minded.

Neither do I, I think it's fearmongering.

And as I stated, most of us want the right to choose and not be nannied.

Also you showing there's evidence that suicides have increased due to assisted dying hasn't countered my point (not my opinion) that people knowing they can go through supportive channels before they end their life will help prevent suicides. These are not the same thing. Just because suicides overall have increased doesn't mean that some haven't also been prevented. As I stated the author you quoted caveated this in his paper.

I've just realised my comment has been deleted by MN for breaking talk guidelines. so I apologise if I said something offensive.

If you're looking out for everyone you must have a rough breakdown of the number of people who's suffering will be alleviated versus the number of people who's suffering will be increased via this bill?

I feel less fearful about getting a terminal illness after todays news. Everyone should have the choice to die with dignity and I want that choice. We wouldn’t let animals suffer like we do humans. This is long overdue. Anyone against this then that’s fine, you take what path suits you, but let me and others have the option.

Just been listening to the radio that before. Harold Shipman did his horrible thing. Doctors would give a nod and a wink and would literally give extra morphine to ease suffering and to help people pass over, but they are now reluctant to do that because of Harold Shipman.
So potentially, this is why this bill is a good thing.

Yes we had a cousin who died from cancer....my grandmother saw her when she was dying and she was literally screaming that she didn't want to die.

I am more fearful

Dr Shipman is in no way representative of GP or doctors. He was a serial killer
The impact of his actions changed medical practice and medical CPD and regulation. Rightly so

Yes why should the hardworking tax payer be forced to pay to keep you alive.... scroungers

Probably because hardworking taxpayer funds aren't unlimited and I wouldn't want to block anyone from treatment who has a better will and chance of surviving than me.

Not sure why you think my choice to help others live and die an honourable death should be taken away from me.

I strongly doubt we are going down forced suicide.
There’s lots of hospices that are still charities so fall outside the nhs